<p>How bout Napoleon? He had a whole complex named after him.</p>
<p>I am guilty of heightism.</p>
<p>I’m a little over 5’8" and I would say height is the first thing I notice about a guy. I feel bad after reading this thread, but that’s just me, y’know? Not every girl is like that.</p>
<p>But I am known to deal the “You’re too short for me” card. And now I feel bad.</p>
<p>I would say that short males are overrepresented in the upper tier of actors. Going back to Alan Ladd who had to stand on a crate to kiss his leading ladies and Mickey Rooney</p>
<p>[Alan</a> Ladd - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia](<a href=“http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Ladd]Alan”>Alan Ladd - Wikipedia)</p>
<p>Lots of famous short people–a few really shocked me. Dolly tiny. Crazy Rose McGowan-tiny.</p>
<p>[Famous</a> People Height List - Pt3](<a href=“Shaw Communications”>Shaw Communications)</p>
<p>I agree that many entertainers are environmentally correct ( height challenged if you don’t like the PC term)</p>
<p>you want me to check how many pages the * pics where Eddie Vedder is hot?* thread is up to now?</p>
<p>BRB</p>
<p>[height is really a very tiny peece of who you are, unless you fixate on it](<a href=“http://www.sundancechannel.com/iconoclasts/#/episode/210227772”>http://www.sundancechannel.com/iconoclasts/#/episode/210227772</a>)</p>
<p>Confidence and a splash of humor will do a lot for you–just like it does for other people who don’t fit physical norms.</p>
<p>My sister is one of the smartest people I know, graduated from Stanford, then UCLA law school and stands a full four feet nine inches tall. Thirty years ago she wrote a term paper that reviewed the statistics and concluded that short people are in fact descriminated against.</p>
<p>But I am known to deal the “You’re too short for me” card. And now I feel bad.</p>
<p>Never too late to change- besides someday it will come back and bite you.</p>
<p>Many years ago, a friend of mine was quite romantically interested in me- it wasn’t reciprocated & I took the easy way out and tried to plead that I just was attracted to tall dark types ( since most of my boyfriends had been), not smaller boned nordic types.</p>
<p>This was about 4 days before I met my H, who is a smaller boned nordic type.
:o</p>
<p>Boy did they dislike each other.</p>
<p>“Is the background behind the frustration rational? May or may not be”</p>
<p>Then I don’t know why you’re bothering with this whole point-by-point conversation. If you just want to spew emotion, why pretend that you’re actually listening to other people’s rational arguments? You have admitted that this isn’t about logic for you, so I won’t waste further time here. I also won’t be starting any threads on discussion boards about how horrible it is that my boyfriend and I broke up and nobody ever had heartbreak like this before and he was wrong to do it and it isn’t fair and men suck! Because, you know, I’m actually not interested in anyone else’s perspective on that, so I should probably tell it to my diary.</p>
<p>Although I do hope that you post here the next time you decide to tell a woman that her hairstyle is disgusting, her clothes are hideous, and she really needs to use some concealer on those giant zits. See how that commentary on controllable factors is received, and get back to us.</p>
<p>Arcade, I think you’ve been given some excellent advice here: you’re going to just have to deal with the height situation and prove yourself in other ways. There are many examples of short men and women who haven’t allowed society’s attitudes to stand in their way. You referred to the Economist magazine with reverence, so you’ve probably heard of Milton Friedman, who stood only 5’2" or 5’3". I don’t think he would have traded his Nobel Prize and towering (forgive me!) stature in 20th century economic thought for a few extra inches. And Frank Lloyd Wright was only 5’6". I believe he said that “tall people were a waste of space?” In sport, some of the most revered and highly-paid athletes on the planet are quite short: Lionel Messi of Barcelona is only about 5’6", Alessandro del Piero (Italy’s Juventus, I think?) is only about 5’7" or 8, Michael Owen of Newcastle is about 5’8". There are many other soccer (football) players who would be considered tiny by American sports standards, but whose athleticism and abilities make them world superstars.</p>
<p>As a 5’0" woman, I know that it’s much easier for me and I can honestly say that my height has not harmed me. I’ve always kind of liked being light and small. (But I think that the tall woman who posted earlier should certainly feel good about her own height and not allow other people to damage her self-esteem. She is right that people used to be cruel about taller women, but I think that things are different now, as they should be).</p>
<p>If you strive for excellence and cultivate a really, really good sense of humor about your height, then other people won’t even notice it after the first time they’ve met you. And no woman who is worth anything will reject you because of your height, if you’ve got a great personality and a fine mind. It is true that my husband is just under 6 feet tall, but I promise you that I would have grabbed him anyway, had he been short! A good man is hard to find, regardless of height, so work on being a great man.</p>
<p>I’m short
I’m a girl
I refused growth hormones.
I like being short. I work my petite-ness =)</p>
<p>Yeah my friends love when they get an opportunity to make a joke about it. “can you get the graduated cylinders?” “ummm no michele I kinda can’t reach them” <em>winces for the upcoming height joke</em>
haha but its all of good fun, and a lot of times I poke fun at myself–i’ve never had a situation where someone has been cruel to me about my height.</p>
<p>I think it’s a lot worse for guys though
but I feel the need to mention that Johnny Depp is ~5’4"
and he doesn’t seem to have much of a problem with it.</p>
<p>I was always falling for short guys who wouldn’t date girls taller than themselves. I’m pretty middling. Oh well their loss. </p>
<p>Tom Cruise is short too.</p>
<p>At some point my parents were commenting on how tall our boys were and I said I thought they got it from my father’s father. They looked very surprised and informed me that he was only 5’-8". I could have sworn he was taller than all my uncles and my Dad (who is 5’-10"). I guess he just looked tall next to my grandmother who was 5’-0" before osteo made her shrink.</p>
<p>Discrimination in attraction to the opposite sex is somewhat irrational, perhaps driven by nature, who knows? I have no problem with that - people generally have little control over who they are attracted to. Most women probably unconsciously feel they need a man taller than them.</p>
<p>What bothered me most with my under-sized daughter was that people felt it was okay to make fun of her shortness. Even an adult whom she met, the first words out of his mouth were “You’re short!” On the tennis team, an opponent announced, “All I have to do is hit the ball high! Haha!” What is the purpose of these comments? They are certainly not intended as compliments. Also, she was always treated as a little child, even when she was 14. One of her 8th grade friends said to others “I don’t know what to do with her - she looks like she’s in 5th grade!”</p>
<p>What I’m trying to convey is that for some reason, people think its okay to make comments about a person’s unusual height, and it really is not okay.</p>
<p>I can’t imagine making these rude remarks about your daughter, Bay. The worst! I guess it falls in the category of children who are too skinny, or have glasses? They’re teased, too and it certainly is NOT OK!</p>
<p>Bay - I understand what your daughter is going through. I got those rude comments for being tall. When I was in second grade, I delivered an envelope to a teacher and was accused of being in the wrong building and escorted to the principal’s office (he thought I was in middle school). I was told my nickname in college was “The statue of liberty”.
The good news is it does get better. Maybe folks are just holding it in but I stopped hearing those cruel comments when I became an adult. That’s OK. I think your d will be just fine. She’ll just develop a thicker skin like I did. I know I’m a bit different but so what? These days, I always offer to get things off top shelves for those little ladies in the grocery store. We all need to be proud of who we are!</p>
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<p>I am 59 years old, have an MBA from a top ten graduate business school, and am a professional. I’m also five feet tall. I gave a presentation to the Executive VPs in my company. I was about five seconds into my presentation when the ****ing CEO of the entire company said, “[My first name,] why don’t you stand up?” Oh, that was some big yuck, all right. We all had a good chuckle over that one.</p>
<p>On the other hand, I tell my son, who’s 5’ 6", that as long as your legs are long enough so that your feet reach the floor, you’re tall enough. Ha. Ha. Ha.</p>
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<p>That’s inspirational…I hope you don’t mind my asking, but are you a male or female?</p>
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<p>Newman actually came under fire for that, and he said it was a song showing the ridiculousness of heightism.</p>
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<p>Ranting may not be productive. There are two things I need to do. First I want to make sure that I am of top standards, that my height gets in my way as little as possible. But I know that, too a degree, height will always be in my way as much as I want to pretend that it is not. So I want to make heightism more evident, I want there to be some way to check that someone isn’t just getting hired because of their height (or not getting hired because of their lack thereof)</p>
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<p>I think the exact same thing, I’m afraid that I will blame my problems on this and become bitter. But I can still protest it and try to advance my self as much as possible. And yes, the story about the lawyers is amazing and inspirational for people like me. People can still get far when heightism presses against them. But I won’t suppose it doesn’t exist.</p>
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<p>Thanks for the advice!</p>
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<p>That is great, I’m glad that she did.</p>
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<p>I’m bothering because it was a message…I don’t think its wrong if you try to criticize my argument. In fact I welcome it. But don’t criticize my writing it in the first place, just because it comes across as irrational (or even if it had been irrational and you had to point it out). And I’m afraid you’re taking the wrong message from this. I have nothing against the women who don’t find short men attractive, but I’m against the idea of it. And I haven’t admitted its not about logic, and neither have I tried to “spew” arguments. You are putting words in my mouth.</p>
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<p>I never said that I would do any of those things. Those things are terrible, and SO IS telling someone that they are unattractive because they are short. </p>
<p>Please don’t leave because you feel that I’m making this discussion hostile. I just think you put words in my mouth, and I disagree with what you said. But if you still have arguments to make, please make them.</p>
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<p>I like the advice, and it seems practical. People CAN do well without great height, but again, it is a disadvantage. It is like trying to tell someone today not to complain about racism or sexism in the workplace because some women and minorities are leaders. But I do think your advice is practical, and it is probably better to focus on doing my best.</p>
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<p>J. Depp is 5 foot 10. Good actor though, but not short!</p>
<p>“I haven’t admitted its not about logic, and neither have I tried to “spew” arguments.”</p>
<p>You said your frustration might not be rational, and you responded to concrete arguments with the explanation that this thread was just an emotional rant.</p>
<p>Rant = spew in my dictionary. They mean letting it all out.</p>
<p>“Those things are terrible, and SO IS telling someone that they are unattractive because they are short.”</p>
<p>Then you should abandon the idea that it matters whether someone is teased/discriminated against for irrelevant attributes they can control or irrelevant attributes they can’t control. Why do you care whether race prejudice > religious prejudice, or height prejudice > fat prejudice? These insults don’t have ranks on any totem pole of cruelty that I’m aware of. It doesn’t help your case to try to draw fine distinctions about which personal insults are or ought to be more unacceptable than others. If you had deliberately chosen to be short in order to enhance your gymnastics career, it would still be unacceptable to tease you about your height. </p>
<p>If you strive to treat people kindly and judge them only on the attributes that matter to a given task, and encourage others to do the same, then I don’t think you need to worry about all the rest.</p>
<p>I’ve thought for years that “heightism” is the next frontier. I share your concern that it’s such a ridiculously important factor still, long after we have
evolved as a civilization beyond the cave-culture protection features of strong, tall, fast, brawny men to protect the tribe.</p>
<p>There are several other genetic features that preserved the tribe, so don’t forget them: the ability to tell a story (describe the hunt so others could find the herd the next day) which is the entertainment gene. To be able to amuse people, to have a sense of humor, is a great survival/protetion gene. For my H, 5’5", it is his lifesaving trait. It got him dates, a wife, leadership respect in his work. Above all, he’s an active listener, compassionate and funny. He loves life. Everyone forgives him the height because he is just full of enthusiasm for life. I fell in love with him the moment I met him. </p>
<p>I’ve thought for a while that it would be valuable to consider what why male height still matters AT ALL any more, now that we have now realizations about power balances post-feminism. We no longer insist the boy must exceed the girl in age, salary or IQ, for the couple to find public acceptance – so why do we hang on to height, still? </p>
<p>We think we’re not racists, yet heightism is biased in terms of race, since Asians and Semitic peoples are, on average, shorter than Nordic/Aryan/Caucasians. </p>
<p>It’s only very recently that polite people even begun to refrain from public comment about another person’s weight. </p>
<p>It’s no surprise that actors include all sizes because they understand a physical niche. </p>
<p>My S at 5’5" is a professional actor but usually gets character roles. If he plays a lead, it’s often as a singular young man (Alan Strang in Equus) not as the romantic partner to a girl. He had a girlfriend for several years in college, whom he exceeded in height but she was in a wheelchair (ok, so now I stopped you cold, right? There’s a lot of things tougher than being short). Another girlfriend was a head taller. S had the courage to pursue her because he saw how his uncle married a woman with similar height difference, and it worked out great. That SIL stood up to her tall family who disapproved (“Stop it, Dad. My fiance is handsome, smart, kind, funny and short. Would you prefer he be ugly, dumb, mean, dull and TALL?!”) She had to stand her ground and defend their relationship, which has lasted 20 years and inspired all the nephews not to shy away from that rare tall girl who might be open-minded. Anyway his current g.f. is his similar height. I’m sure he’s faced more rejection because of height than taller guys with all the same other qualities he has, but he just maximizes his beautiful qualities of character, so he has found g.f’s and a profession. </p>
<p>My D describes herself as “five feet nothing” but wears signature platform boots and lights up the room with her personality and charm. She gets modeling contracts these days, too. For work, she’s teaching preschoolers because she IS taller and can control the situation, except when they do. In college for an EC, she learned to walk on stilts because they had a circus EC. That was pretty cool for her. Anyway, she deals. SHe’s very smart, and her longterm b.f. is maybe 5’5", I don’t know and don’t much care. She did not like dating tall men because it made her feel badly. She likes comfort. </p>
<p>The trick about being short is to find every other character quality you have, especially your intelligence, sense of justice, and sense of humor, and grow THOSE. The only thing I detect from your postings is perhaps an absence of humor, but you might just be very rant-ing and not giving the full picture here. Also, if you can’t generate humor, it’s almost as good to be: attentive, kind, caring. Women like that a lot, too, no matter what the man’s height. </p>
<p>See if you can find an interview with Rhea Perlman about how much she loves her H, Danny DeVito. I know she talks about how sexy he is. She’s great and so is he. </p>
<p>It would always be nicer to have a few more notches up in IQ, handsomeness,
strength, or height. You can lift weights to build strength, but I can’t think of anything to do for height except my D’s approach with the platform shoes. She’s a girl, so she can wear them on the outside, but putting lifts in shoes is really legit for now, while you build your confidence in myriad ways.</p>
<p>I know guys who wear a toupee for a few years because they’re upset about being bald. Then they find they’re feeling stronger and just put the toupee aside, accept being bald.</p>
<p>My H shops very carefully for himself and sons (on Ebay) to dress as well as possible, to compensate for height deficiencies. If you have access to a real tailor in your community, go have a chat with him someday. They really know how to alter a garment so you look taller. My S’s dress up a bit more than the people around them, with blazers and turtleneck sweaters, to look dressier and classier. They can’t afford the sweatshirt slump, they just can’t. When my youngest (5’7") strides into a room confidently with a leather blazer (from Ebay!! don’t buy retail!!), all heads turn. He looks mahvelous and it distracts from height a lot to simply dress very well. Once you’re working professionally, if you wear suits, a tailor makes a difference there. Invest in yourself that way, someday. I know this is not appropriate on campus, but still, there are college clothing choices that would help you even now that aren’t dorky but kind of classy, in a college setting still appropriate.</p>
<p>FInally, there are some physical activities that short men tell me are really helpful. I’m not into sports but will recite their wisdom: wrestling, because you are paired with someone of equal weight, is different than all other sports because short people can compete equally. I knew a guy who did wrestling for a year as a confidence-booster to his physicality. </p>
<p>My eldest does some Asian martial arts. He got as high as a an orange belt in karate, which isn’t the moon, but he really liked having a physical outlet that didn’t depend on his height.</p>
<p>Listen, if a girl rejects you over height, it’s her loss. Nuts to her. I’m sorry you won’t have access to the full range “available” to the taller guys, but if you work up your fine qualities, you can find someone who is either taller and tolerant; same height and wonderful; shorter and delighted to have someone who doesn’t overwhelm her. </p>
<p>Be grateful you are healthy and ambulatory.</p>
<p>And yes, I’d love to see this developed in research, even in discrimination law.
Go for it. Meanwhile, brighten up and be a babe-magnet for justice.</p>
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<p>To spew is to “cast forth with vigor or violence or in great quantity.” I haven’t cast this with violence (which is the usual connotation of spew), nor wtih vigor (especially if you don’t think my arguments are convincing). At least in my opinion, spew seems to be taken off hand as wrong. A racist can spew vitriol, but it would not be the same as a rant…the racist may spew his views even when he doesn’t mean to rant…anyways.</p>
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<p>Well I think all those things are terrible. I think some of those things are more terrible than others, so when you claimed that I should go and tell someone they are ugly, or that they have zits, that does not fall in agreement with simply saying that some things are more terrible than others. If robbery is more terrible than murder, then you cannot say “go rob someone, see what they do,” which is equivalent to what you were saying when you wrote “go tell someone that they need coverup for their zits.”</p>
<p>Dismissing an insult and ranking it as lower than another is not the same thing.</p>
<p>I think it is a legitimate to argue that the insults that I have listed as worse than each other are not seen as worse, or that I have ranked insults incorrectly. My case is that it is worse to discriminate against someone based on something that they cannot control than based on something that they can control. </p>
<p>This is obvious with some ideological views that have direct consequences on others (Naziism is bad, can be controlled), but sometimes we even accept a degree of prejudice when it is not ideological and when it does not affect others. For example, people may find smokers to be less concerned about their health and not hire them for ____. Or people may find overweight people to have a lack of self control over their appetite.</p>
<p>Now if the overweight people were eating due to psychological duress, then we would not be as open to discriminate against them because the psychological distress is supposedly less in their control than just a desire to eat. Again, I don’t think insulting ANYONE is good, but judging based on controllable characteristics is not as bad as judging based on uncontrollable characteristics.</p>
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<p>Yes…this is me encouraging people to do the same. And, I DO agree with judging people based on the given task. If I need a one-time task done, like having a computer fixed or something, I would not care about someone’s weight or any controllable characteristics either. But what do you judge people on when being a boyfriend or a girlfriend? What is the “given task”?</p>