And trafficking does not require physical content…
I hope that somewhere in the court case, it comes out as to whose decision it was to condense Jane Doe’s statement so much and remove clearly important statements before handing it to prosecutors. Was it within Cornell police, someone in the administration, etc?
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I have been involved in fact finding for Title IX cases. It’s extremely important to ask questions properly - employees need to be trained for this. It’s crucial to have very clear, specific steps to be followed for an investigation. I was fortunate to have upper management, a direct supervisor and coworkers who took this very seriously (upper management was well aware of the reputational and economic fallout from not doing so). It’s really important for schools to involve legal counsel in developing the steps to be taken, and involved employees (including campus security) must follow the process exactly as outlined. I assume that Cornell had a well documented, legally vetted process in place for handling Title IX cases, but perhaps not everyone was properly trained, committed to the process, or willing to deal with the fallout from following the process.
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I know that expecting our kids to refrain from partying, drinking, doing drugs, and sex in college is unrealistic, though I know many students do not partake. That said, I do think it’s our jobs as parents to model appropriate behavior. I also think it’s a good idea to let kids know about laws regarding drugs, alcohol, and consent. We always told our kids that actions have consequences and getting in trouble with the law can ruin your life and the life of others as well. Think about how your actions will affect you, your family, your friends, etc. You don’t want to be prevented from getting your dream job due to some stupid action.
We also emphasized respecting yourself and respecting others. And not doing stuff just because “everyone else is doing it.” Would you jump off a bridge because everyone else is? Here is a quote: “what is popular is not always right, and what is right is not always popular.”
Also, I was the parent who always called when my kids went to a party at someone’s house, especially if it was a family we don’t know well. I also always told my kids that if they are somewhere and they feel uncomfortable or can’t get home safely, they can call me and I’ll come get them, no questions asked.
For most of their childhood, our kids used the family computer, so they knew that H and I had the ability to see what they were doing online (no we didn’t constantly check on them). When they were older they did have their own laptops, but again we talked about safety and how to be careful online. Don’t send pictures, be careful about talking to strangers, etc. And come to us if anything makes you uncomfortable. Also, we encouraged our kids to not spend all of their time on the computer, on their phone, and watching tv. I think it’s best for kids to learn that their is a life outside of the internet and social media. That may be part of the problem, kids spend way too much time on Tik Tok and Instagram.
My nephew has a daughter who is in 6th grade and she doesn’t have a smart phone yet (she just has a basic phone) and they are holding off getting her one as long as possible. They say they’ve avoided a lot of issues that some of her classmates, who already have smartphones, are going through.
You can’t prevent everything, but you can do a lot to help you kids avoid problems
My son never goes out but with my daughter, she enacted this many times. 11P, 1A - I’d go get her. We came home. I’d go to sleep. If she wanted to talk, she would. She was never drunk, etc. and I believe always looked out for her safety. I hope.
But this is a must for parents to offer I think.
My children were not in the greek system, but students and their parents in the past shared that there are “unofficial frat” houses off campus for parties. A Cornell parent verified that this is true. Her D’s current off campus apartment (who also is not involved in the greek system) lives near one this year. It has been very challenging for her.
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I think that is a defeatist attitude to take when trying to solve the problem. Are you going to say boys will be boys, and leave this situation alone? And if you can’t change behavior when kids are young, can you really change behavior when they get older?
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Why are you putting words in my mouth that don’t even seem to bear any relation to what I wrote? I specifically spoke about role models and the effects of what kids see at home. Sorry, but pretending that abstinence at home is the solution to all these issues is naive and clearly unsubstantiated in fact. You also seem to be saying drinking is “the” problem, but very many men are able to drink and get drunk and be around drunk girls without assaulting them.
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Incidentally, here is chatgpt on the issue of evidence: ChatGPT - Parental Abstinence Research
And I thought there seemed to be some broad agreement on this thread that drinking is part of the problem at Frats in creating an unsafe environment for girls.
Separate from drinking, I am also saying that we should be role models for kids on how men should treat women. Those are separate issues.
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One of the NIH papers I referenced above shows that men who join frats are more likely to have exhibited drinking behavior before college. So yes in the ideal world that everyone abstains and no one ends up joining frats as a result these incidents would presumably lessen, but that’s hardly realistic. And possibly a bigger issue, as already pointed out a number of times by a number of people on this thread, is the way a culture of assault has become normalized- including by people who famously don’t drink.
Edit: it’s pretty annoying when you add things into a post I’ve already responded to. I’m not going to go back and alter my response to include your additions.
I will add that there are countries that ban alcohol completely and guess what, women still get raped.
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If we concede the fight as being “hardly realistic” there is nothing more to say. As a society we could try to reduce teen drinking. Just as we worked very hard to reduce smoking. I told the kids not to drink before 21. That is a step in the right direction – now over 21, one of them doesn’t drink, and one of them drinks occasionally. It’s not the worst outcome. If we as parents don’t even bother with consistent messaging, there is no hope.
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You’re contradicting yourself now. First you say no alcohol at all, now you say nothing before 21. Anyway I’m done arguing this in circles with you. No one disagrees that alcohol is a factor and “we” could be teaching our kids better. This doesn’t solve the issue of what is happening at frats, which is broader than just the alcohol aspect.
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If you solve teen alcohol, the frat rape problem will be substantially reduced. Everyone will be in their senses.
The national minimum age to purchase and publicly possess alcohol is 21. Could messaging like “Just Say No” work? Should the U.S. support a war on drugs, including alcohol, in Greek Life?
It has worked on me (in a different country) where I was growing up. It has worked on my kids in the US. Certainly zero tolerance in high school. But just consistent messaging about where I am myself personally. Alcohol use is rare or zero.
It certainly worked in my household as well. I used to drink very sparingly, never beer, but not anymore. I don’t like the word carcinogenic & alcohol is classified as a Group 1 carcinogen. Personally, I would like to live as long as possible.
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Universities are trying hard to provide alcohol free social activity funding: ChatGPT - Alcohol Free Campus Programs
The US “war on drugs” is widely seen as an expensive failure. The US “war on alcohol” from 1919 was also accepted as a failure in 1933.
Universities could impose stricter rules with respect to alcohol for recognition of fraternities and sororities, although stricter rules could cause some chapters to go completely off campus as unrecognized organizations. Private universities could prohibit or limit their students from joining unrecognized (or any) fraternities or sororities. But many of the largest fraternity and sorority systems are at big public universities.
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Change is more robust if it starts at home, early. Not when the kid is 18.
For that, you have to get parents to abstain completely. Will parents in general do that?