Rape and Greek Life (the Cornell 7 specifically, but also SA in Greek Life generally)

Parents Forum
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So I was never interested in Greek organizations, but I have had a lot of friends, relatives, now a kid, and so on who were involved. Without claiming any of this is universalizable, that description doesn’t seem quite right to me for a lot of them.

For the people I know, it is true the biggest question was usually some form of would I want to spend time having fun with these people. And that is a social question, but is it really a social “exclusion” question? I think for many it was more positive (I like these people and having fun with them) than negative (I am glad people I don’t like having fun with aren’t allowed here). Of course some of this could depend on the greater context, like it sure seemed to me like some organizations were much more into “closed” events than others.

And then outside of purely social stuff, I do think some of them took the service aspects pretty seriously. To be blunt, more often the sorority sisters than the fraternity brothers, but I feel like for some of them, that really was a type of motivating “topical interest”.

Then sort of more on the fraternity side, they did sometimes see this as a sort of business club. Obviously there are formal business fraternities, but even some of the supposedly “social” fraternities seemed to have a reputation for being good in terms of supporting certain career aspirations.

And then sometimes there were aspects of what are sometimes called “identity organizations”. My understanding is the growth of alternative forms of identify organizations has undermined this somewhat, but for example, back in college I knew some women of color who joined a certain sorority because that sorority was seen as an opportunity for some mutual support among such women in what was otherwise a PWI.

And so on.

OK, so I can’t stress enough that I don’t think this means there isn’t a problem here, but I do think it is questionable to view these organizations as entirely different in kind from other college organizations. They all tend to spill over from whatever their nominal purpose might be into other purposes, and I don’t think the “social” Greek organizations always stay purely “social”, they do in fact have service aspects, career aspects, sometimes identity aspects, actually sometimes academic aspects, and so on. Just as organizations nominally with a different primary purpose in practice spill over into the “social” side.

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42

I am thrilled my kids have no interest in greek life. I avoided it at a school with greek life. I dropped out of rush, in fact, when I saw how I had to act to get a bid at the houses I liked best. “Beware of enterprises that require new clothes” (Thoreau) rang in my ears.

I still have incredibly close friends from college. Most of them WERE in greek houses.

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43

While this article is 12 years old, I wonder if anything substantial has changed with regard to these numbers:

Asking this question not to challenge you in any way but because several people have referenced this unusual statistic and I’m genuinely curious…where does it come from?

The article linked is 12 years old, but it cites a study from 2007 on the efficacy of a rape prevention program. I’ve found other articles that also mention the 300% statistic but I can’t actually find that study (studies?). I have seen references to three different articles that supposedly support this claim and, to be fair, I can’t read beyond the abstract of any of them because they are expensive ($100+ subscription each) to download.

But just reading the abstract of this one cited below, for example, does not suggest that it is actually an investigation of how often fraternity members are accused of/found guilty of rape. Here is the abstract of one of the articles cited in support of this statistic:

“College men’s exposure to pornography is nearly universal, with growing viewing rates nationwide. Substantial research documents the harmful effects of mainstream, sadomasochistic, and rape pornography on men’s attitudes and behavior related to sexual assault. The present study surveyed 62% of the fraternity population at a Midwestern public university on their pornography viewing habits, bystander efficacy, and bystander willingness to help in potential rape situations. Results showed that men who view pornography are significantly less likely to intervene as a bystander, report an increased behavioral intent to rape, and are more likely to believe rape myth.”

So, again, I am left wondering…where is the study that found that fraternity members are 3 times more likley to rape?

I’m NOT saying it’s not true. Not at all! The Cornell thing is awful and I KNOW it happens on so many college campuses, and other places. I’ve known people who have survived this type of abuse. I am NOT questioning in any way how horrible this all is. I’ve been transfixed on this case because I have daughters in college, and because my own college campus had it’s own similar incident decades ago.

I’m actually asking, honestly, genuinely, because I’d like to see the study…does anyone know where this statistic came from? It is very striking and I’m hoping to read more about it (the study). Hoping someone else has better internet research skills than I do (low bar).

Thanks.

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Google “Find citations from the last 5 years for the statistic that fraternity members are more likely to be perpetrators of rape than nonaffiliated students”. A bunch of citations and studies will pop up for you.

[Note: yes, this first section below is from the AI Overview at the top of the google results. I haven’t confirmed all the citations, just responding to the poster above who wondered how to go about finding the info online.]

"Academic Peer-Reviewed Citations

  • Salazar, L. F., et al. (2021). History of Sexual Assault Perpetration and Violence-Related Prosocial Tendencies Among Fraternity Men, Men With Membership Intentions, and Unaffiliated Men. Violence Against Women, 28(10).
    • Details: This massive cross-sectional study analyzed data from 262,634 college men in the United States. The researchers found that fraternity status was significantly and positively related to sexual assault perpetration both prior to and during college, noting that fraternity members demonstrated diminished violence-prevention prosocial tendencies compared to nonaffiliated students.
    • View Study on Sage Journals [1]
  • Zinzow, H. M., et al. (2021). Selection and Socialization Accounts of the Relation between Fraternity Membership and Sexual Aggression. Journal of American College Health, 71(6).
    • Details: This longitudinal study tracked 772 male participants from high school through their sophomore year of college. It established that fraternity membership prospectively correlated with a 62% increased likelihood of committing sexual aggression during the first two years of college. The study highlights both selection effects (men with high-risk traits joining fraternities) and socialization effects (fraternity culture exacerbating the behavior).
    • View Article via PubMed Central [1]
  • Barnes, M. L., Adams-Clark, A., et al. (2021). Risk of Sexual Assault and Harassment in Sororities and Fraternities. Dignity: A Journal on Sexual Exploitation and Violence, 6(1).
    • Details: Based on an online survey of college students, this study evaluated campus sexual exploitation risks. The findings demonstrated that fraternity membership directly predicts men’s exposure to, and perpetration of, nonconsensual sexual contact independent of general campus alcohol problems.
    • View Open Access Paper [1]

:magnifying_glass_tilted_left: Secondary Research Summaries & Scoping Reviews

  • Stover, N., et al. (2024). A Scoping Review of Bystander Intervention Training for Sexual Assault in Greek-Affiliated College Students. Trauma, Violence, & Abuse.
    • Details: This 2024 literature review notes that fraternity men are significantly more likely than their non-Greek-affiliated counterparts to report committing sexual assault (citing specific campus datasets tracking an 8% vs. 1% perpetration rate discrepancy). It attributes this to sexually hostile peer subcultures and rigid gender norms.
    • View Scoping Review on PMC [1]
  • Bhandari, S., et al. (2024). Preventing Gender-Based Violence and Supporting Survivors in Fraternity and Sorority Life. Journal of College Student Development.
    • Details: This study acts as a meta-analysis of risk factors in Greek life. It synthesizes previous landmark statistics alongside modern data, noting that fraternity men range from three to eight times more likely to perpetrate sexual violence than their non-fraternity peers depending on the specific campus subculture.
    • View Literature Review on Sage Journals [1]"

https://digitalcommons.lib.uconn.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=8484&context=dissertations

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45

Thank you!

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As someone who grew up far away from the Greek system, I am also wondering somewhat - while we talk about the issues about frats/ frat parties - what the role of the sororities is in this (noting that Jane Doe has also sued hers). I want to make it plain that I have a number of friends here in the US who were in sororities and all seem to have had only good experiences. But I am wondering if, when a member is assaulted - and the data do seem to show they are at significantly higher risk than other women on campus - do they provide support for the victim, or is there more of the “don’t rock the boat” thing going on? I know this is an incredibly superficial way to look at it, but rush was happening when we moved C26 into campus, and we saw a couple of groups of maybe 30 or so girls who all looked identical (dressed the same etc), and I am wondering how deep that conformity goes.

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47

As someone that’s seen both sides of Greek life ( posts above) and knows kids in all types of fraternities, I can confidently say that the thing is, you never know. Not only are houses different In their cultures, those same houses can change year to year. Usually it’s only 2-4 people that set the entire tone of how the frat will treat women, a few that will participate because they to have the opportunity, a few that participate because they are afraid of the ringleaders, and then a whole bunch of bystanders that allow it. Once a culture is ruined, it tends to stay that way for a long,long time.
In the general frat of “good guys”, those who don’t plan parties around the chance to SA women, often all it takes is a small group of strong voices to speak out and model respect for women ( or any group of people) and not stand for anything less. I guess we all hope that will be our kid, and that is the type of house they’ve joined, but more often than not, it isn’t.

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48

Sexual assault is rampant on all campuses. It’s relatively common out in the non-academic world too. Victim blaming is also rampant in our society. Our country can’t even release the names of pedophiles because someone powerful might be impacted. The problem is less fraternities and sororities than it is sexism. We need men to step up and actively fight against this behavior. We need to make systems in which women are believed and action is taken. Every single one of the Cornell administration involved in this -and who took little to no action --should have already resigned. Instead they are doubling down. They care more about their own power than women’s safety.

I sent my son off to college and my biggest worry was that he wouldn’t study.

I sent my daughter off and my biggest worry is she might be sexually assaulted. We talked about ways to protect herself -but the fact is - it’s often the men you know and trust that violate that trust.

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49

Lest it seem like I’m completely alienated from the Greek system, I will clarify: I went to a university with a robust Greek system, went to a lot of fraternity parties, and had a lot of Greek friends. Not a one joined for the service aspects. I’m not saying it doesn’t happen, but in my experience service came up as an afterthought—sometimes positive, sometimes negative—if it came up at all. (I should also clarify that I’m talking about historically/predominantly white Greek life in all of my comments.)

Some joined because they had not found their place or a group of friends (and Greek life made a huge positive difference in their happiness). Some joined because it was the only way to get into parties (men, generally, since women could pretty much always get in). Some had friends and were already well-established on campus but wanted the social caché of a certain house (or entered school knowing that they were destined for that house). From what I’ve heard from my kids about their friends and my parent friends about their kids, this all seems pretty much unchanged. I’ve never heard anyone talk about service or anything other than social connection.

Ultimately, it’s great if Greek organizations end up offering other aspects to their members. But they are social groups first and foremost, and decisions about who is invited to join them are based purely on (brief) social interactions (or pre-existing family/social connections). As I’ve made clear, I don’t think you can separate that from the sorts of negative, often group-perpetrated behaviors that seem to be much more prevalent in these organizations.

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50

At some universities, sororities tended to have a greater tendency toward racial segregation than fraternities or their campuses generally. It was as recently as 2013 that this scandal occurred: The Final Barrier: 50 years later, segregation still exists – The Crimson White . So it is not surprising that many women of color joined sororities other than the historically White ones.

There were/are also specifically service-focused (usually coed) Greek letter organizations. Presumably, those more interested in the service aspect would join those.

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51

I feel like we are gradually recreating here something I have actually seen before, namely a sort of “profile” of a higher-risk fraternity (not so much sororities, although I think the question about complicity is a perfectly valid one). I may not be able to dig it up quickly since it has been a while, but I believe the context was basically providing to young college women information about the places and situations where they should be particularly on guard for possible sexual assaults.

But then there is also this:

I’ve already been having conversations like this with my D30 who just started boarding school, and it is very sad how different it is from my S24 conversations. In terms of protecting him from harm, we did talk about things like drug and alcohol abuse, driving while intoxicated, and so on. But it is very true our sexual assault conversations were largely about how he could help protect others, whereas with D30 it by necessity starts with protecting herself.

But I guess getting back to the complicity point, we also talked about watching out for other women and not being shy about (safely) intervening.

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In the very few cases I am aware of personally… the issue isn’t “don’t rock the boat”. The issue is “don’t get us de-chartered” from the national organization, or “don’t get us unwanted publicity” or “don’t shine a spotlight on what we don’t want made public”.

Some inane tik-toks of the women getting ready for a dance or event? Great. Some ridiculous social media posts about the so-called “professional decorators” who specialize in over-the-top decor for bedrooms? Fine. A bunch of repetitive videos showing a skin care routine, how to make a “cleansing” smoothie to prevent hangovers, and all that jazz? Just a way to boost someone’s numbers for her branding deal with a Korean cosmetics company or for her portfolio once she starts interviewing for a job as an “influencer” post graduation.

But get into the guts of the seamy side of sorority life? That’s a no-no, no matter how much free publicity, clicks, and engagement the women want on the puffery. No high end workout clothing brand is showering the sorority with freebies in exchange for clicks if those clicks lead to articles in the campus newspaper or the local press about underage drinking, SA, the Sorority president selling Kratom out of her Louis Vuitton handbag, etc.

Many sororities have created a fishbowl for themselves. And keeping the press (and university authority figures) away from the glass is Job 1.

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53

I don’t like painting greek life with a single broad brush. I went to a small school where greek life was integrated into the social fabric of student life. It offered a group of friends, a support system of friends we could count on, support for studying, and a place to gather … parties were open to all, and drinking was not considered “required.” We had lots of friends outside of our greek organizations, including “independents.” Yes, a lot of people drank, and fortunately, it was fine to sleep it off on a couch at the fraternity house, if necessary. It was a small enough school and I feel that I was connected to the grapevine well enough to say that I don’t believe that there was a SA problem in greek life. I knew two women SA’d in college, with one perpetrator being non-greek & that assault not connected to a party, and the other occurring completely outside of anything connected to the college.

That said … I am well aware that this was my experience at my unique school. My D was extremely wary of fraternity parties because she had friends whose older sisters were themselves assaulted or knew others who were assaulted in incidents related to fraternity parties. My D knew in advance of going away to school how best to avoid SA, which is, unfortunately, a necessity for our daughters (and is of course, not a guarantee a SA won’t happen … so she knew what to do in that case). AND my S knew in advance of going away to school how to conduct himself and what to do if he was aware of others not conducting themselves properly. We discussed things very openly and honestly. I think that every parent needs to speak with their kids about acceptable conduct.

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54

Among the people I know who joined Greek life or whose kids joined Greek life, it was the same, I never heard anyone say they joined for the service aspects. Then again, maybe they did and just didn’t tell me. I do know a lot of people who only joined because they’re legacies…their Mom/Dad and Grandma/Grandpa were in a sorority/fraternity and they’ll be in one too

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Reports that one of the accused has lost his job.

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I’m relieved that neither of my kids have been interested in participating in Greek life. And in the interest of full disclosure, I am very much not in favor of traditional sororities & fraternities. This is just my own personal opinion. Others may have had positive experiences and/or your kid(s) have had good experiences being involved in a sorority or frat while at college.

I think that traditional sororities & fraternities create a sub-culture in which conformity is desired above everything else. Conformity of thought, how you dress, how you talk, what you look like, who you hang out with, etc. And, let’s be real here, in traditional frats & sororities, it’s mostly Caucasian students. Zero diversity except for 1 or 2 token non-Caucasian members.

And don’t get me started on all of the stupid sorority dance videos on TikTok and Instagram, where the focus is looking hot, shaking your butt, and flipping your hair for the camera.

The truth of the matter is that there are so many requirements of sorority & frat members to participate in chapter activities that a lot of the time, those members end up with not having a whole lot of time to actually foster other friendships outside of Greek life.

And that’s a huge lost opportunity.

I also think that the ‘mean girl’/queen bee behavior is often not talked about enough within sororities, and it can push girls who desperately want to fit in to go along with stuff they’re uncomfortable with just because they’re afraid of being ostracized from the group.

Also, the mandatory date night requirements are…oh my gosh…I don’t have the words…like, are we in the year 1955?

From an outsider’s perspective, I see the whole culture as being toxic and not what the organizations claim that they’re all about. Are there chapters here and there which are the real deal, into their philanthropy projects, etc.? Absolutely.

AND the whole “Greek system” is an entirely American thing. If you talk to somebody in another country about your frat or sorority, they’ll usually have no idea what you’re talking about. A woman I know was shocked when somebody she was talking to once was not impressed that she was in a sorority in college. The other person attended college outside the US and was not raised in the US…that person’s reaction was basically, “Um, you paid for your friends?”

As far as I’m concerned, they should do away with all of it.

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57

Assuming this is all true, one of the worst things about this entire episode is the lack of courage from the other fraternity members to do the right thing. It’s sad and disgraceful.

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58

An interesting tech detail regarding the WhatsApp chat that allegedly had 57 people on it : whoever photographed the chat had the wherewithal to take photos of the phone screen versus a screenshot because WhatsApp notifies users when screenshots are taken.

Someone had the foresight to think that this chat should be documented without its participants being notified.

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It’s sad and disgraceful, but I’m not surprised at all. If you’ve spent any time around frat brothers, you would not be surprised at the culture.

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A member in my daughter’s sorority was assaulted - not at a frat party but in her dorm - and the sorority absolutely supported her. The university allowed the man to remain a student, so she was forced to see him around campus for the two years it took to go to court. The sorority members supported her through that and also on court dates.

It’s very easy to form a blanket opinion about Greek life when you’re basing it on TikTok reels and Bama Rush (and we’ve certainly had more than one thread on here debating the value of it, ad nauseum). There’s this thing called freedom of choice - if Greek life is not for you or your kid - don’t choose it. There are even a handful of colleges that don’t have it at all, so it’s not there to threaten. It’s also easy to vilify the frats but the fact is that college environments in general can be a hotbed for SA. Binge drinking and drug use are major contributors. Until colleges find a way to reel in the on and off-campus usage, unfortunately, it will continue - and these are the cases that get reported. There are many more that stay silent - because look at what happens to those who report!

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