Referring to hyphenated Americans--what do you say?

Parent Cafe
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<p>I grew up in a farming area of central Washington, where some 30-40% of the population was of Mexican descent (it’s probably now closer to 65%). There were a few other groups who still had a strong cultural identity other than “main-stream American”–descendants of Russian-German pioneers, 2nd-3rd generation Japanese-Americans, and a few Basque families. I think that’s really the key–how do people think of themselves? In my family, we spoke Spanish with the grandparents and English in our own home, and ate more traditional Mexican than mainstream foods. My parents were active in politics and my uncles and older brother served in the military, and my dad was a successul farmer and paid lots of taxes–clearly, they were all participating in the benefits AND obligations of citizenship. But if anyone had asked us how we self-identified, although we REALLY meant Mexican-American (since our grandparents immigrated to the US in 1924 and my dad and his nine siblings were all born in the US), we would have responded, “we’re Mexican,” and even today, I say that I am Mexican-American when speaking to other Americans. Since I DO have a strong cultural identity, if I were to simply respond that I am American, that would be ignoring an important piece of who I am. </p>

<p>Still, in my everyday life, it doesn’t come up often. I am part of an overseas community of mostly military Americans of many cultural/racial backgrounds (and many blended backgrounds) who have lived all over the US and world. I think I am very typically Mexican in appearance, but my married name is not a give-away, and I don’t have a distinctive accent when I speak English, so I doubt if most people even think much about my ethnic heritage when they meet me. The local people probably think I’m Italian or Turkish until I start talking, and then I’m sure my pathetic attempts at the language immediately mark me as an American.</p>

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<p>I’ve always thought it was sort of funny that Prairie Home Companion is always talking about Lutheran. One of my gay friends from a tiny town in Virginia jokes that what really made him feel like an outsider was being a WASP in a town dominated by Catholics and working mostly for Jews.</p>

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<p>I think that the Northeast and in fact most of the east coast has a culture that is very aware of personal heritage. It matters to an enormous number of people how long your family has lived in an area (as in “his ancestors came here in 1775” or “we’re DAR, you know”); I found it very liberating when we moved to Seattle and no one cared. I see this eastern interest in breeding as part of the reason people in that area of the country seem to be so determined to find out people’s roots and then say things like “Polish-American” or “Italian-American” or whatever. </p>

<p>(As an example: when I met DH’s mom (New England born and bred) for the first time, it took her about 5 minutes to tell me about her illustrious ancestor who fought in the American revolution; she was clearly reassured when I told her my aunt had investigated all that and that I was DAR eligible. (I didn’t tell her about my mom’s side of the family, with the distant uncles who were part of Jesse James’ gang.))</p>

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<p>Arround here I see a big difference between the pre WWII immigrants and the post WWII immigrants. Families like mine, where my dad & all my uncles fought in WWII rarely use the hyphenated American. Especially those of Italian & German ancestry. They were sometimes looked on with suspicion back then, and often had to prove their American allegience. </p>

<p>My ancestry is Irish, maternal grandparents right off the boat, yet we were American. We listened to the Big Bands, not Irish traditional music. Now that my kids are heavily involved in Irish music, I am always taken aback by how many American born citizens in that network call themselves Irish. Every one I’ve come across had a much later immigration history than my family & none of their dads & granddads were in the US military. I think those 1940s movies with privates Murphy, Steinberg, Kowalski, and Scarpelli sharing bunks had a tremendous impact on that generation and their offspring, even if they did not enlist themselves. Of course, nothing will unite people of different cultures faster than sharing a foxhole & fighting for each others lives!</p>

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<p>My family looked at marriage almost like breeding a horse or dog I’d bring home a pooky WASP from the Upper East side, and my mother would worry about “inbreeding”! Talk about livestock! DH is a hearty Irishman, (American born) and my mother couldn’t have been happier to have “strong stock” marry in to the family.</p>

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<p>dmd, LOL. </p>

<p>H’s family hails from New England- they go back to the 1600’s, mostly in the same town for that long! Someone in his family did a complete family tree and linked his side all the way back the Royal Garter, Sons of Runnymede, and the like. </p>

<p>Years ago, I researched my own family, which also goes back to 1600’s Massachusetts. Funny thing is, we have a lot of the same names in our family tree (not to worry- I’m talking 1650’s-1750’s; after that, my family moved out of NE). Of course, I have my own skeletons- no Jesse James- but I have maternal grandmother/aunts who were tried and convicted of witchcraft.</p>

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<p>There’s a lot of excellent points being made here. Especially about the north east coast. Family and history is a little more important up there it seems. I was born and raised in the New York City and New Jersey area. My family was/is predominantly Italian. It was not uncommon to refer to ourselves as Italians, but only when trying to describe ourselves differently than others who lived in the area. </p>

<p>But in accordance with the title of this thread, I don’t ever remember anyone ever “HYPHENATING” a race in our area. Even now, except for those being politically correct, you don’t hear someone being referred to hyphenated. </p>

<p>To be honest, except for the occasional racist remarks that you hear among all group, most people accept each other as Americans and therefor have no need to hyphenate them. Of the 2 MAJORITY groups, if you had to be descriptive, you probably just stay with “He is Black” or “He is White”. If you were in the ethnic parts of the country where it’s a little more important, you might break up some a bit more to include; “Hispanic”, “Irish”, “Italian”, “Asian”. But almost NEVER would the HYPHEN be used and the additional word “AMERICAN” be included. I guess most people consider it the norm. But, except for some micro-cultures, it is rare to use ancestry country of origin when describing someone. If they do, it’s usually for political or financial gain. E.g. Can’t have a neighborhood “October-fest” without mentioning Germans. Or mentioning greeks if you’re having a Greek festival.</p>

<p>But if not for a specific purpose, then most people are referred to as White and Black. If there is a need, people will add Asian, Hispanic, and a few other “Generalized” areas. But again, hyphenated-American is rare. That seems to be reserved for blacks. I think one of the big problems is that Blacks have been in this country much longer than many people’s families have. Also, because of skin color, it is commonly accepted that the majority of blacks in the USA have ancestry back to Africa. Probably a pretty accurate conclusion. But what ISN’T accurate, is most people’s ignorance in geography. Think about it; “I’m from Italy”; “He’s from Ireland”; “She’s from Mexico”; “He’s from AFRICA”. DUH!!! Africa is a continent, NOT A COUNTRY. That’s why blacks didn’t have their descriptions taken down any further. Like a white might go further down to Irish, Italian, German, etc… Most people forget Africa isn’t a country and because of the slavery that brought many blacks to this country, many aren’t sure which country in Africa their ancestors came from. Some do, and some are learning, but most don’t know where. </p>

<p>But, because of the feel good politically correct, they’ve learned to hyphenate people. This helps them to have individuality. Mind you, we’ve been taught individuality since the beginning of time. We have all seen the individuality of those around us as far as we can remember</p>

<p>Anyway, the title of the thread mentioned hyphenated Americans. I think using a Hyphenated-American in describing yourself or someone else is simply a means of trying to be politically correct or cover up your own insecurities. There is nothing wrong with just saying white, black, hispanic, asian, indian. It is pretty well ASSUMED that if you are here, you are an AMERICAN.</p>

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<p>indian? are you talking about native-american or south asian-american?</p>

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<p>I grew up in Baltimore and it had many ethnic neighborhoods. Like someone posted earlier if you knew where someone lived you knew their ethnic background and it was very probable that their grandparents only spoke their native language.</p>

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<p>Pyewacket, well said:

</p>

<p>I do agree: all this matter rests easily as a unity inside my thoughts: I’m Jewish AND American. If you could map my mind on a given day, half my thoughts are devoted to American issues, half to Jewish. </p>

<p>That might suggest a hyphen in my brain, and yet I don’t identify as “Jewish-American” or “American-Jewish” BECAUSE, in my mind, the principles of both heritages merge seamlessly as one (freedom, justice, equality). </p>

<p>Hyphenation feels cumbersome, like wearing an ace bandage when nothing’s sprained. I run around and live as both (the “And”) not squished into one (“the hyphen”). </p>

<p>Jewish religious practice generates a culture visible to others, not to mention generating really good delis and bakeries :wink: This reads as “ethnic” in the conversation. </p>

<p>To live as a “both” makes me very happy. Thanks to grandparent immigrants, I now live in the first world nation to guarantee by law the freedom of religion (read George Washington’s Letter to the Hebrew Congregation in Touro, R.I., written BEFORE the revolutionary war!). Without G.W., maybe we wouldn’t all be enjoying deli sandwiches today or buying bagels in Nebraska. Amazing to consider, and I DO think about all this a lot. </p>

<p>Good luck with the course, Pyewacket!</p>

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<p>Columbus Day tomorrow is a perfect example. In the NY area it was a big deal growing up with a school holiday and some companies closed, big parade, etc. Here in Florida its not even mentionned…I don’t think my kids know the holiday exists.</p>

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<p>paying 3…of course if you live amongst a substantial Jewish community you often hear distinctions; as in she’s an orthodox Jew, he’s Reformed, etc.</p>

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<p>Back to your original question, I think Chicago also has ethnic neighborhoods. My grandfather was a German who came through Ellis Island, he married a DAR Wasp and moved to the suburbs, but we used to visit his family in the city where everyone had accents and the stores all sold German stuff. I wonder how much of that culture is still there? I know the German area of NYC is dwindling fast, Little Italy is being eaten up by Chinatown, and another Chinatown has sprung up in Queens. </p>

<p>I do a bit of architectural work in my town which has always been the immigrant neighborhood. It used to be Italian and now it’s Hispanic.</p>

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<p>Chicago also has a large Lithuanian population, apparently.</p>

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<p>I’m from NYC and totally agree with you. The flip side is that kids like mine whose relatives have been here since the 1600s and don’t have any other ethnicity than American can often get aggravation from people who are blown away by that. ZS has an essay due about her ethnic heritage and being unhyphenated, her teacher told her to make something up because being just American is not acceptable. she’s going to do a distant relative who we’ve never known anything about from Italy. I told her to be really creative.</p>

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<p>zoosermon,</p>

<p><<her teacher=“” told=“” her=“” to=“” make=“” something=“” up=“” because=“” being=“” just=“” american=“” is=“” not=“” acceptable=“”>></her></p>

<p>That sounds like an “only in New York” crazy situation! Why can’t she write about wherever her ancestors came from in the 1600s -she could be Dutch-American or Puritan-American or whatever?</p>

<p>BTW–I’ve been reading that in South Dakota, they’ve replaced Columbus Day with Native American Day–I guess they’ve got more of those than they have Italian-Americans!</p>

<p>mathmom, very little is left of obvious German neighborhoods in NYC --one restaurant and one delicatessen in Yorkville and a couple of places in Queens. But a whole lot of Germans still turn out for the Steuben parade. Also from NJ and Long Island --this year was the 50th ! --although many Germans fly in from Europe for the occasion.</p>

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<p>Once again, the experience of a couple of people in cities in the Northeast assume that the whole Northeast is like their singular experience in the city. In my neck of the woods- small town in PA - the only time heritage comes up is like Zoosermom’s experience, when the teachers make you write a report on your ancestors. My kids have also had a hard time narrowing down their ethnicity. We’re pretty much heintz 57 - German, English, Irish, Scottish and I really think there’s an American Indian on my husbands side. It’s much more common to ask about where someone goes to church, not for a religous inquiry, but because most everyone goes to church it cuts the chase to similarities.</p>

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<p>My family’s been here since the 17th century, but we still think of ourselves as Scots. It doesn’t always have to do with the time here, but how your family culture looks at its past. I was raised on British food like oxtail stew and finnan haddie (YUK) and at one point insisted that we be like other families and order pizza once in awhile. My parents had never even tried it!</p>

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<p>Kathiep, my daughter is fascinated by how different life is in your town, even though it’s so close by. She walked slowly across the street at home yesterday and I had to remind her that this is not Pennsylvania and people wouldn’t thing twice about running her down!</p>

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<p>Maybe I’m more ethnically aware thatn I thought. Tonight D & I were waiting in NYC’s Port Authority for a bus back to NJ that had been delayed because of traffic hassles due to various ethnic festivals & the Giant/Jet game. A 60 year old woman in line was complaining about a Pulaski Day event, and asked “who the heck is Pulaski?” I immediately started spouting details on the Revolutionary War hero. I was stunned that this woman had no clue who he was, despite living a few miles from the Pulaski Skyway. Growing up in a very ethnic Catholic blue collar world, I guess the ethnic heroes tended to stick in my head. (I have not a drop of Polish blood.)</p>