Reflections of an elite legacy parent

We gave relatively small amounts to Yale regularly, not with any expectation that it would help our kids get admitted there. After neither was accepted, our interest in and generosity towards Yale took a pretty big hit, and we didn’t give anything for 6-7 years. The last few years, however, we have started to give again. Things just reminded us why we loved it – a reunion, a conference around the anniversary of something one of us was involved in, children of close friends being admitted . . .

It won’t ever be at a high level. We can afford to give more, but Yale doesn’t need our money half as much as the organizations we support more significantly, and our college giving is split between our alma mater and our childrens’ alma mater.

As far as our children were concerned, we got over their rejection a while back. They had great college experiences; we loved the education they got in and out of the classroom. They both have good jobs and lives they love. One of them beat out multiple Yale candidates for each of her last two jobs. Can’t ask for more than that!

I had been a consistent but low 00’s donor for several decades with the expectation of “average” legacy consideration, which I think I got. No bitter feelings whatsoever. However, the main thing I have learned through the process (visits to luxury dorms, marketing materials) is how filthy rich the elite schools are and they do not need my money. Cal (and the Feds) paid for my grad degree and I will continue to contribute to them. However, I have been a bit upset at them, because the students that have called me up recently have been semi-professional business types not related at all to the program I was in. Stanford students that called for contributions were actual scholarship recipients, were eager to talk about themselves and the school, listened patiently while I told them not to waste their lives on Wall Street (none were planning to), always enjoyed talking to them. For the next several (3 X 4) years, I will be giving (paying) out for tuition and will lay low on giving to schools.

To the points being made, H and I are doing some estate planning and have to make some decisions on long-term charitable giving and setting up guidelines for a family foundation. I feel that H and I were full pay when we were in school, I was full pay in business school via my employer, and we were full pay for S. We’ve given enough. There are other meaningful causes I’d rather support.

“However, the main thing I have learned through the process, is how filthy rich the elite schools are”

So many good causes… I would never give money to schools with billion dollar endowments. I get why the uber wealthy donate buildings (to carry on their name at the school) but can’t get why ‘normal’ people would give $100 a year or more to HYPMS. Again, so many schools (elementary, religious, poorer colleges) that could use that… it barely pays for the fancy stationary they use to send you thank you notes.

No, not necessarily. Some of the peopje I know who have given significant $ (as in millions) to our alma mater have had their names on things; others haven’t. I’m not remotely at that level, but if I were going to, I would not want my name on it. I think that letting on that you have a lot of money is a big security risk. Under the radar …

@Pizzagirl Full pay doesn’t make you “give enough”. The average cost of educating a student at an elite school (although that average could include things like maintaining a museum) is equal or lower than tuition charged. Financial aid comes from donations and endowment instead of tuition. Not receiving financial aid doesn’t mean you are giving.

4 tuitions worth is “enough” as far as I’m concerned.

The reasoning about the cost being lower than the tuition charged does not hold when the cost includes the highest prices being paid for athletic facilities, rock climbing walls, bidding up prices for rock-star profs, the whole competitive arms race between elite univ in general.

@DHMchicago Actually I meant to say "The average cost of educating a student at an elite school (although that average could include things like maintaining a museum) is equal or higher than tuition charged…

Good example of how some anecdote or assumption becomes a wildfire. Who do you think demands amenities? And check who’s paying for those athletic facilities. In many cases, it’s through development. Some rock star profs are paid out of the endowment (chairs or leading special programs.) Or underwritten in some part by the grants they bring in

None of this is simple.

I don’t have a problem with paying rock star profs, really. They should pay rock star profs. And, having received enormous benefit from Yale’s residential college system, it would be hypocritical for me to complain too much about spending money on nonacademic amenities. At some point, however, the nonacademic amenities cross over into inappropriate luxury, and as far as I can tell many/most high-prestige/high-cost institutions have had that point in their rear-view mirror for some time.

It is not always obvious to the outsider whether high spending will add educational value or if it is just a sign of inefficiency, waste, or pointless luxury, particularly when educational quality has subjectively defined components and varies from one student to another.

I have not, and will never give a $0.01 to Stanford, even though I have means to do so and even though I’m not mad at them for anything. Even if my darlings had been admitted, I would not have given.

Cheese and Rice … they have more than enough $$, and more on the way.

I took a couple of years holiday from my non-huge donating to UVA after one of mine was denied. But have since gotten back on the program. They did me a favor years ago and I feel like I should pay it forward regardless of what they think of my kids.

FWIW, UVA says it doesn’t track donations for purposes of their legacy admission program.

“At some point, however, the nonacademic amenities cross over into inappropriate luxury, and as far as I can tell many/most high-prestige/high-cost institutions have had that point in their rear-view mirror for some time.”

I can’t think of anything at either of my kids’ schools that felt like lazy-river inappropriate luxuries. Frankly their investments in infrastructure were long overdue.

Most of the lazy rivers are actually at the big state schools – Texas, LSU, Colorado, Arizona State, etc.

The elite schools mostly splurge by spending a lot on student instruction – lots of small classes and lots of professors.

People are usually the single biggest cost.

Small classes and top professors are precisely the value-added “splurge” I’m looking for.

@MOMANDBOYSTWO wrote, "Question to Parents: How do you feel about donating to your colleges after your own child got rejected? "

Geat question! I’ll admit that I gave more-generous-than-usual gifts to Yale the past few years in anticipation of S applying. He was rejected – but I got a nice, hand-written ‘sorry’ letter from the Development Dept.

I will scale back to modest annual gifts from now on. Y was still 4 of the best years of my life and I don’t mind giving back, even if they dashed one of my dreams.

Thanks to all who have shared their thoughts in response to my question about donating to a college after a child’s rejection. I think I will likely take a break from Duke for a while after I complete my pledge commitment. Having a child rejected by anything (sports teams, colleges, jobs, etc) feels worse than if I am rejected. I wonder why that is.

My husband attended Brown and then law school on substantial loans. If he were a college student now, given where his parents’ income fell, he would have no loans. He’s given to his alma mater every year since he graduated law school, even when it was financially hard for us to do so, initially small amounts and now around $1000 annually. So not enough for a developmental hook but enough to acknowledge his gratitude and to offer some support to the generations of kids who have attended brown on financial aid, like he did. That’s been his motivating factor from the get-go; he’s been overwhelming grateful that brown have him the loans necessary for him to attend. It made an enormous difference to his life, not least he’s been able to pay his own kids’ tuition.

In addition to his donations, he’s also interviewed for Brown, which he does because of his sheer love of the school, something he likes to share with prospective students.

Both our kids applied to Brown ED and were deferred. The deferral hurt more with the first because he was an excellent applicant (and thankfully admitted to Uchicago EA the same week, which took the edge off the pain for him). He was ultimately admitted RD, together w peer schools like Penn, WUSTL with no hook, which did make us wonder why the deferral. But we were so happy for him, and he was over the moon, that our love for brown was in no way dinged by the long wait.

Our second kid was lopsided and a tougher admit. His overall scores were high…2260, although not as high as his brother’s, but lopsided too…800 CR, 690 M, and that was reflected in his GPA…a 92 UW. So we sorta expected him to be deferred or rejected. He ended up applying ED2 to tufts and was accepted, and was also admitted to WUSTL and USC early bc he was a finalist for selective merit awards. So it’s possible that had he waited to hear back, he may have gotten in, though still unlikely. (And truth be told, tufts has worked out well for him: his academic, ECs, and personal experience at tufts has been phenomenal. It’s been a great fit.) But when he wrote the withdrawal email to his Brown admissions rep, he said something that really resonated with my husband and me: he told her that while he was disappointed he wouldn’t attend brown, the school will always hold a special place for our family, that he’d always be grateful to the University for all the possibilities it’s given his father and his brother, and consequently, the way it’s already impacted his own life. Honestly, when my husband and I read it, we were glassy-eyed. And because what he wrote is true, we have continued to give to brown just as before he was deferred (and most likely would have been rejected).

And yes, @MOMANDBOYSTWO, like you, my husband and I have found that our boys’ disappointments–deferrals/rejections from colleges, jobs, and now looming grad school apps–are worse than our own personal rejections, but also, their academic, job and personal successes bring us more intense joy than our own success. It’s so enriching to love people this intensely.