Root cause of the refugees/migrants crisis in Europe

I must have been living under the rock because I have not noticed this crisis in the mass migrants/refugees in the Europe until now.

A lot of finger pointing are happening while many people are struggling.

Do you really think the west (including US directly or indirectly) should share the blame?

Are we (US) “allowed” to stop being the police in the world? Are we also on the hook just like the Europeans for whatever reason (humanity?) it may be?

After all, the “imbalance of power” in the different regions of the world triggered by the industrial revolution seems to have enabled countries which were industrialized earlier to do injustices to (i.e., to oppress or to rip off) many other countries which were late to this “game” in the past N centuries.

Is the western’s policy really the blame as pointed out by the leader of our rival, Putin, or he just tried to take advantage of this opportunity to advance his country’s interest?

(Could we discuss this controversal issue without getting into being political, especially about the policies for the two parties of our country?)

Instead of running, maybe the refugees should fight to take back their country.

Good points. Is there any reason why sometimes “bad guys” in a country or region could seize the power and cause their fellow countrymen to suffer greatly and those who suffer seem to be powerless to fight back and protect their own interest?

Also, do the receiving countries have the “right” to prevent the migrants from entering their countries? Even when not in crisis, it could happen that some group of people in country A like to accept migrants/immigrants from country B, while other group of people in country A are not willing to do so due to different interest or differently held “principle/perspective”. When these two groups have different opinion because of whatever reason it may be, is there any good mechanism /process in place to help different groups reconcile their different opinions/agenda in order to establish a shared “good” policy for the whole country? I am not talking about accepting refugees in this paragraph, just more about immigration policy.

How do u propose the people of Syria fight both Assad and ISIS to take back their country?

There are more than two factions there.

When the situation has become so bad like it is now, it seems it is very challenging to revert the crisis. However, it seems to me that before it became so bad, few were willing to “do something” to prevent this from happening when it was not that difficult (relatively speaking) to do so.

Also, it seems that when the whole country is too poor, or the economic opportunity among people are too unequal (e.g., income and assets dispaity), it is more difficult to prevent this from happening.

The refuge crisis has been going on for sometime with so many people displaced in Middle East. Aids workers have been warning. They were building tent cities but it was clear they were running out of room fast. It is finally spilling over to the first world and getting noticed. I don’t know if this is an issue of right or wrong. It may be more practical matter; cost of trying to stop them vs cost of accepting them.

The regime change in Libya, the rise of ISIS, as well as the empowerment of the Government forces in Syria have been hugely important in creating this crisis. We can’t fix it here, and resettling these migrants in large numbers would be a terrible thing for them and the destination countries. Since we have no stomach for involvement and a weakened military in any case, people will continue to die and some countries in Europe will be further destabilized.

Assad = Iran + Russia. Therefore, no faction can take back anything.

An analogy (not sure it is a good one or not):

It costs much less to prevent people from becoming criminals than to let them become ones and build jails to contain them. But we are not willing to do the former (Why should I spend MY money to help OTHER people’s kids?)

While Budapest is clogged with refuges on their way to Austria and Germany, the oil rich nations of the Middle East do absolutely nothing and take in no refugees.

Our military is “weakened”? Where do you get that?

Destabilized = rising value of US dollars?

We will have the privilege of printing the money forever. It is to our country’s interest? /sarcastic…

I don’t watch TV often so I, too, was surprised to hear of the magnitude of this crisis. Its just so sad…

I’ve been hearing it on BBC news everyday in the past 2 weeks.

This has been massive news all over the world for quite a while now. I am genuinely surprised that so many are just finding out about it.

There are hundreds of new services available online or in print form.This has been a new story for some time now. Are people really that isolated?

Most of the refugees are not fleeing combat or other violence but poverty. There has been a recent surge that’s (finally) drawn attention but literally millions have fled poverty in Africa and the Middle East for years. That is why the Muslim population of Europe has become so large: in 2010, there were about 13 million foreign born Muslims in Europe (which excludes Turkey, of course, and those born in Europe). The number should look relatively familiar: it’s in the same ballpark as the Latino/Hispanic migrants come to the US and generally for the same reasons: poverty at home, lack of opportunity at home, sometimes violence at home. As I said, the latest surge has caught attention but this has been going on for years. There are a half million Muslims in Sweden and a few places, notably Malmo, are now over 20% Muslim.

Note the recent surge is not people fleeing violence now but, for reasons that are obscure, people who were already displaced. The reporting on this from the Middle East, meaning by local sources, indicates that factors involved include: a) belief that the various wars will continue (in Syria, Libya, Iraq), b) reports from people who have gone to Europe have been disseminated among family, clan, etc. and c) that there is a general sense that people can go to certain countries (notably Germany) and receive a lot of government support, including medical care and education and housing allowances. In other words, there is now little hope the situation at home will improve for a long enough time that people see more value in relocating. The picture I draw is a fairly classic information cascade in which people see x leaving so they also leave because what if Germany closes the doors and they get in but your family doesn’t? That seems to have put a large mental premium on acting now.

As to root causes, yes the US played a big part in destroying Iraq and I’d say we were extraordinarily naive and obtuse to believe a thin caste of Westernized Libyans, Syrians, etc. could take over their nations and lead them Western-style. That completely misunderstood the region, the cultures, the religion and pretty much everything else I could list. But in the end, Syrians have destroyed Syria. Libya has enough oil money to keep all Libyans relatively happy but they’ve only succeeded in wrecking the country and devolving into a somewhat more refined version of gang rule than Somalia.

(As an aside, we are so naive about other cultures we can’t even see that Russia, for example, has direct interests in keeping Assad in power: they face Sunni Islamist rebellions and terrorism inside Russia and its republics so the last thing they want is a Sunni-dominated Syria and, worse, a Sunni Islamist dominated Syria wanting to export that to Russia. That is a big reason why the Russians are selling to Iran: not Israel but Shia bulwark against the Sunni. So when people were talking about how we needed to support the Syrian rebels, the Russians heard that as a direct threat to their own internal security and propped up Assad and his allies. And now, I have to say do people doubt that weapons sent to the “Syrian moderates” would have ended up in Islamist hands? We have this weird idea that everyone is like us and that with just a bit of push that will all come out. It just isn’t the way the world works.)

If you look at economic figures, the Arab world - not counting oil states - was slightly better off than the Asian nations in the early to mid-1970’s. (Same is almost true, btw, of N. Korea versus S. Korea: they were about even.) Since then, these Asian nation have leaped ahead and the non-oil Arab world has quite literally stagnated. As a note, Syria was actually somewhat of an exception: it had decent public health and education systems, actually made an effort to incorporate Palestinians into the economy (as opposed to isolating them from work, from the health and education system as Lebanon has) and under Bashir Assad liberalized the economy somewhat and saw reasonable though not outstanding growth.

One can say something similar about a handful of countries in Africa - they were on a par with Asia and Arab states - but they actually slid backwards until recent years. There’s a chance that parts of Africa now have a reasonable economic future, but much of it is still a disaster by most measures. That’s why people leave.

It’s important to note that each country has its own connections to migrants. French migrants tend to come from French-speaking countries. Many came from Algeria, despite the memory of the civil war with France, because the self-inflicted violence there became unbearable, with large scale massacres in the 90’s scaring everyone. Now migrants from there are economic. British migrants have tended to come from Pakistan and other former colonial areas. German migrants were mostly Turk, which is one reason the information in that region about Turkey seems most well known. (Note that the 1998 Maastricht Treaty finally allowed Turkish Germans born in Turkey to become German citizens.)

It is a historic migration that will probably have a large effect on the future of Europe. I do not see how European countries can retain their very generous welfare states if they maintain an effective open border policy for all the refugees and economic migrants from Africa and the Middle East. There is also the issue of culture as the nature of many of the immigrants is less assimilable to prevailing cultural norms than, say, Mexican immigrants to the US. Large numbers of angry young men who are underemployed, resentful, and taught that they are superior to the kaffirs and to women are not going to be easy to deal with. That the Syrian refugees talk about “Mama Merkel” would seem to indicate that they expect to be taken care of rather than just left alone to prosper or fail, as was the case with earlier immigrants/refugees to the US.

Yes and yes. Intellectual honesty requires me to admit that US foreign policy has had a large recent role in destabilizing the Middle East. As it turns out, we could not import Jeffersonian democracy into the Middle East, and the Arab Spring was a disaster because it led to the outbreak of sectarian civil war unconfined by a strong-arm dictator who kept order. But Putin also stoked the problem by preventing anyone from reining in his ally Assad when something might still have been done to force Assad to modify his behavior. The US is also giving the largest amount of money in the world to Syrian refugee relief efforts (largely through funding camps in Turkey).It would be imprudent, however, to accept large numbers of Syrian refugees in this country. Some are fleeing ISIS, some are fleeing Assad; most may be totally apolitical but there is going to be a jihadi strain among them. Like Iraq, Syria was a mishmash of different peoples and sects with boundaries drawn up by the British and French (Sykes Picot), held together by a dictator. There is really no “nation” to fight for. There are millions of people in Syria, though, and they all can’t be relocated.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Democracy cannot be given to people who don’t want it and and haven’t reached the state of historical development to exercise it. If you think your enemy will kill you or persecute you if he gets into power, you cannot afford to let him get into power even if he wins a free and fair election. There is not enough social trust in the Middle East to permit democracy. We should have realized this but we did not.

and as if all this isn’t complicated enough, climate change is also one of the causes:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/03/science/earth/study-links-syria-conflict-to-drought-caused-by-climate-change.html

Many posts above are very educational to me.

I heard of Assad and read his news for quite many years. I look him up on wiki. In it, his attempt to manipulate the public opinion of the US is mentioned as well. Hard to tell whether the author of this wiki article also has his own hidden agenda. (Do they think the majority of US population have a negative opinion on the Occupy Wall Street? Or, their point is: The general population in that region (or even many regions) of the world have a negative opinion on the Wall Street because the Wall Street is a symbol of the capitalism and “the rich exploiting the poor” in their eyes? After all, there is no lack of people who hate the rich.)

"At the outset of the Syrian Civil War, Syrian government networks were hacked by the group Anonymous, revealing that an ex-Al Jazeera journalist had been hired to advise Assad on how to manipulate the public opinion of the United States. Among the advice was the suggestion to compare the popular uprising against the regime to the Occupy Wall Street protests.[221] In a separate e-mail leak several months later by the Supreme Council of the Syrian Revolution, which were published by The Guardian, it was revealed that Assad’s consultants had coordinated with an Iranian government media advisor.[222] In March 2015, an expanded version of the aforementioned leaks with nearly 3,000 additional emails from Assad’s personal account, were handed to NOW News and published the following month; the emails detail attempts to manipulate the opinion of American Christians,[223] flirtatious emails between Assad and a Paris-based geneticist Dr. Suzanne Kuzbari,[224] attempts to organize the kidnapping of individuals with border smugglers,[224] attempts to falsify the results of a poll on the FOX News website,[224] frequent remarks showing contempt for the Arab people,[225] and emails from Fawaz Akhras (Asma al-Assad’s father) discussing 9/11 conspiracy theories, how “Jews” created Al-Qaeda and how "Hitler was the founding father of the state of Israel”.[226] One email showed Assad’s wife Asma Assad sharing a modified version of the famous Arab Nationalist song Biladol Orb Awtani, changing the lyrics from "The Arab provinces are my homelands” to "The Russian provinces are my homelands”