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I hope not. But I worry about the environment at alcohol-drenched parties held on the “turf” of fraternities or other similar groups of boys. But the study I linked to above suggests that the message (or lack thereof) that girls think they are sending with their clothing is not the message that boys may interpret. I think girls should probably at least understand that. As you say, they may be OK with it.</p>
<p>I was looking up what happened to the student who was instrumental in a gay student committing suicide by filming him having sex in his room.</p>
<p>After the jury convicted him of all counts which may have added upto a 10 year term, the judge sentenced him to 30 days.</p>
<p>Apparently, privacy does not merit a whole lot of jail time.</p>
<p><a href=“Rutgers Webcam-Spying Defendant Sentenced to 30 Days - The New York Times”>Rutgers Webcam-Spying Defendant Sentenced to 30 Days - The New York Times;
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<p>I thought this was a really good question, poetgrl and had hoped you would get more responses.</p>
<p>I tried to teach my boys:
To be a “gentleman”, a man who has good manners in the sense that manners are about behaving correctly and considerately. To be a “modern” gentleman, a man who understands women are still often disadvantaged by living in a patriarchy. To try and think beyond a stereotypical male point of view. To try and think outside the heteronormative box. Not to objectify. That no sex is “wrong” but that any interaction with another that disregards the partner’s feelings is “wrong” That it is important to understand sex partners may become emotionally invested regardless of expectations.</p>
<p>Always use condoms. Do not to drink to the point your judgement is compromised.</p>
<p>My sons were the ones watching out and making sure their sometimes too intoxicated friends got home safely from parties and bars. They understood their female friends were usually at greater risk in these situations than their male friends. Sometimes they were a tiny bit resentful to be put in this position repeatedly, but their friends matured and it eventually became a non issue.</p>
<p>I can not ever remember having a conversation with my sons where I suggested they might be victimized by a young woman. I do remember advising them when a girl, or young woman, was pursuing and they weren’t interested. The focus of the advice was how to discourage without hurting someone’s feelings unnecessarily.</p>
<p>
Obey the Scout Law. (It’s not enough, but it’s a good start.) I agree with alh and others as well.</p>
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<p>How many times does Hunt have to say that there is no excuse for the boys’ behaviors, and that the blame lies entirely on them for doing something wrong, and whatever a girl wears doesn’t excuse anybody who takes liberties with her? He says it over and over again, and you keep trying to say that he is excusing bad behavior if “she dressed slutty.”</p>
<p>kayf–</p>
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<p>WOW. FYI–if I actally knew who your daughter was and her relationship to you, I’d still jump in for her if she was in the situation the girl was in in Peru. After your comment above, I want so much to say that I would not do it if the female was you, but I would do it even for you.</p>
<p>What have you been teaching your daughter(s)?</p>
<p>"I was looking up what happened to the student who was instrumental in a gay student committing suicide by filming him having sex in his room.</p>
<p>After the jury convicted him of all counts which may have added upto a 10 year term, the judge sentenced him to 30 days.</p>
<p>Apparently, privacy does not merit a whole lot of jail time."</p>
<p>Well, he faced deportation at one time. I think it should have been a stiffer sentence, but it has not been a cakewalk for 2 years.</p>
<p>For some “others,” Pizzagirl, Hunt will never be able to say it enough. </p>
<p>I am a scant week past launching my daughter at college, so I’m in a bit of a weakened state, but I’ve teared up a little reading what some posters on this thread have shared about how they’ve raised their own boys. Thank you!</p>
<p>Ohiomom - was he in jail for those two years? If not, why only 30 days?</p>
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The case was more complicated than the initial press reports. But the first reports about any case become what we remember about it.</p>
<p>"… he still faces three years of probation, plus more than $11,000 in fines and assessments, 300 hours of community service, and counseling."</p>
<p>I have not followed the case that closely, but I know Ravi seemed close to deportation at one time.</p>
<p>ABs, it is not that he - or 07DAD – doesnt say it enough, its that they combine “must not do” with other extraneous stuff, like dressing, drinking. I think every time.</p>
<p>All I can say is that I hope Nrsd4 is following this thread.</p>
<p>Have you seen the thread below? So unfortunate! We do need to do a better job of teaching our boys! My heart breaks for this girl and her family.</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1391380-i-too-have-daughter-withdrawing-college-due-extreme-anxiety.html?highlight=anxiety[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1391380-i-too-have-daughter-withdrawing-college-due-extreme-anxiety.html?highlight=anxiety</a></p>
<p>It’s called discourse, kayf. There are issues under discussion. Sometimes they’ve been directly germane to the Savannah Dietrich case, sometimes they’ve been tangentially related. Ideas spin off, people think, they muse, they raise provocative questions … I suppose it’s possible for some people to be confused if they do not read the posts closely or if they haven’t read the whole discussion. I happen to find such discussion, even with (maybe ESPECIALLY with) people I disagree with, to be exhilarating. And I have no reason to think, not one iota of reason, that Hunt (or 07DAD or razorsharp or anyone else who doesn’t meet your standards of acceptable discourse) does not understand that there is no excuse, ever, for rape or sexual assault.</p>
<p>ABS, to me it is that Hunt and 07dad minimize the worst of this by continually bringing up other things. You can call it discourse. I think it is minimizing immoral, illegal actions of the boys.</p>
<p>I call it discourse, yes. And I’ll go a step farther. Savannah Dietrich’s behavior that night was idiotic and inexcusable. The behavior of those boys was depraved and inexcusable. Have I just “minimized the immoral, illegal action of the boys” by saying I think Ms. Dietrich behaved badly? I do not intend to.</p>
<p>For the record…the statements in the last few pages of this thread about what happened in court in this case are inaccurate. There was no “appeal.” There is no “superior judge.” I’ve already linked the court files. </p>
<p>I’ve also already linked the video of the court session at which the “gag order” was issued. But I’ll link it again.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20120912/NEWS01/309140001/Judge-warns-[/url]”>http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20120912/NEWS01/309140001/Judge-warns-</a>
-not-speak-about-Louisville-girl-s-sexual-assault-any-reason-videotape-shows?odyssey=nav%7Chead</p>
<p>One thing that hasn’t been mentioned in this thread is that ordinarily it does not matter that a judge’s order is illegal. You have to comply with it or appeal/ move to vacate. If you do something in violation of a court order, ordinarily you can be held in contempt of court EVEN IF THE ORDER IS ILLEGAL. You are supposed to appeal and/or move to vacate the order not just decide for yourself that it’s illegal and you won’t obey it. In this case, Judge Bisig stated that Kentucky law requires such orders to be put in writing. This order wasn’t. </p>
<p>The sentencing is supposed to be today. Savannah is going to have a chance to speak at the sentencing.</p>
<p>There is certainly room for discourse and discussion. Unfortunately, IMO, the tone and content of some of the posts in this thread have been, at the bare minimum, insensitive to the original topic.</p>
<p>Many of the posts remind of the Southern etiquette rule. If you start a sentence by saying “I don’t mean to be ugly, but …”, you give yourself a free pass to be ugly. In this thread we have, “yes, the boys were wrong, but …”.</p>
<p>jonri, what happened was that the local newspaper, the Courier News, filed an request to have the record opened. I thought that a judge that was superior to the one on your video, granted that request, and said that the first judge did not issue the gag order on Dietrich. Yes, I agree with you, watching the tape it seems like the first judge did.</p>