I am not counting on the balance of the country to approve of what is gong on in NY/NJ. I am looking at the data and am happy to see that the numbers are going down. People are free to live wherever they want.
I have two friends who are ER physicians in NYC. I saw what they went through.
It’s mind boggling to me that people think this has been managed properly on a national level, with no plan in place. It’s a free for all.
Do you plan to variolate yourself with SARS-CoV-2 this summer so that you can “schedule” the infection at the least inconvenient date for yourself?
Purdue has said they expect to open dorms with enhanced daily cleaning.
Like most large school, the majority of upperclassmen live off campus. Many of D’s friends with apartments never left.
I think that enrollment is going to be down and they’ll be better able to avoid overcrowding in the dorms. They also have new dorms that are set to open in August.
Not intentionally,@Ucbalumnus; I am reasonably confident that my childrens’ comings and goings, and my own, will likely provide sufficient opportunity for exposure naturally and I live in an area with an overabundance of medical care so there is no inconvenient time for me
I said some of this many posts back, but I feel compelled to reiterate that there’s more ‘tools in the toolbox’ than are typically being discussed on this forum. Colleges will not just come back and resume business more or less as usual except for more frequently cleaning or such. That would certainly not be prudent.
These ‘tools’ include changes in where classes are held (using gyms, performance spaces, art galleries, outdoor classrooms, etc. ), how big they are, hybrid options, staggered schedules, cohort models, block classes, project-based/experiential learning, adjusted calendars, etc.
At high performing colleges (and I don’t mean elite – community colleges can be high performing), faculty are at the table co-designing shifts that will significantly reduce the density and frequency of interactions among students and faculty but ALSO create strong learning outcomes. Faculty (including adjuncts) feeling comfortable about their safety should be a high priority at any college worth its salt.
Dining services will also be dramatically different to protect students and dining staff.
Testing, contact tracing, and isolation protocols will be in place.
Some colleges may even be able to install UV lights in key indoor public spaces to help with sanitation.
Large gatherings will not take place – convocation, speakers series, performances, etc – unless they can be outside with students sitting six ft apart from each other. And even so, they’ll be few and far between.
Masks in public spaces will be required. It will be difficult to enforce, and some colleges will do better than others, but you don’t need 100% mask compliance to reduce spread.
I suspect at least some residential colleges will secure additional housing to de-densify. They may even establish staggered schedules for showering.
I’m not going to engage in a debate around ‘students won’t follow protocols’ b/c I don’t have the energy, but there will need to be a ‘shared sacrifice’ mentality as the Bowdoin president said in his communication. Students who repeatedly mess up should be asked to leave, IMHO.
My point here is that this is not going to be just a matter of declaring 'We’re back!" and going about business as usual. Colleges would do so at their own peril and students (and faculty) should run the other direction if that’s the approach they take.
Is there no risk? Of course not. But can colleges do a lot to mitigate risks? Of course they can.
“Is there no risk? Of course not. But can colleges do a lot to mitigate risks? Of course they can.”
Yes! Just like companies that were deemed essential have been able to be successful. We only hear about the failures in the news, not the thousands and thousands of plants and essential businesses that have been successful in keeping their employees safe. Companies have gotten super creative. Employees have been compliant. Universities and students will too.
My opinion: Any college that has announced what they are doing in the fall is really just announcing what they hope to be able to do in the fall. Few (if any?) schools are able to make an accurate plan at this point.
And…add me to the list of tri-state residents who gives high marks to my own (NJ) governor for how this has been handled. Has it been perfect? Of course not, and there are a number of gaps and inconsistencies that need to be addressed. But overall, I (and anyone I speak to) feel confident that we are being led by someone who is making decisions based on the science and not magical thinking.
I am sure there will be many investigations in future years into the multiple causes of the disaster that befell the tri-state area. Fortunately, others fared better.
There is some evidence that warmer weather reduces the spread of the virus, so that summer time may see a reduction in infections, but the virus may come back as the weather cools. This suggests that, if you believe that getting infected before a vaccine is available is inevitable, you may want to get it during the summer when the hospitals (if you need them during the infection) are less likely to be overloaded. In addition, if you “schedule” your infection, you can plan self-isolation from more vulnerable family and friends, or cooperate with others who wish to variolate themselves to select a date that is most convenient for all of you.
There is another thread where general CV discussions are supposed to happen. General discussions of masks, general discussions of if you want to infect yourself or not, if your governor is doing a good job or not, etc… Can we please keep THIS thread to “Schools in the Fall and Coronavirus”?
I was onboard with Gov Murphy until this opening of the beaches and boardwalks. I get it - the shore towns rely on summer tourism almost exclusively for profit. Not opening would be devastating. But his approach seems so rushed to me, just to be open by Memorial weekend.
Hopefully, it all works out.
I’m back to K-12 scenarios as I can’t stop thinking about this.
I have a HS student in a low SES district of 50K+. I feel the divide between wealthy/private and low SES will be magnified even more this fall 
I’m worried about how kids can go a year or so without meaningful education - at least from what we’ve seen this spring.
About 30% of the students responded in our district to any education efforts starting march 15; we’ve already seen how education stopped.
A teacher friend told how she held her first “lunch table” over zoom with 6 of her ESL students. She had students was twirling in the chair; not paying attention, yelling siblings running around in the background; and construction noises pounding in the background. She is floored to even try to figure out how to teach in the fall if this method starts because no one was watching these kids.
Compare that to the wealthier district nearby: the parent is sitting next to the student on the iPad making him focus. The divide will multiply.
In fall, if our schools were to open, and then close because of infections - I worry about the education progression.
My question for the education professionals is: how long can kids go without education? Do kids catch up easily? Will they stay behind if they don’t get education (or sporadic education) for a year or so ?
NYC will ask 1 in 6 public school students to attend online summer school, 4x the usual number, presumably due to problems this spring. It is unclear the summer instruction will fare any better.
In regards to re-opened k-12 closing with new cases, I wonder if they will be more strict than usual. Schools here already have policy regarding illnesses, if a certain percentage of students out with it, then school closes for deep clean. This has happened before during a bad flu season, so there is precedence. They came within a few students of that threshold 2 or 3 years ago at Ds school.
@GMGiant, I hear you had some sort of problem with political posts?
Fwiw, I’m very far from NYC, as is everyone around me, and we find Cuomo’s pressers an island of sanity in all this, which is a pleasant surprise from Cuomo fils.
@scmom12 I forgot about that. We did have one year where flu was raging and school was closed for two days. But a LOT of kids were calling in sick and then other kids “called in sick” because they were afraid of getting sick. I want to say it was something crazy like 30-40% of the kids calling in sick one day and the school closed for the next two.
I’m here talking about science, in particular epidemiology and public health. A serious problem in the response to this virus in the US (and some other countries) has been a political refusal to hear and deal with the science, and a proclivity toward making up “substitute science” that comes out with more likeable answers. If you’re looking at Weeden’s paper and seeing politics, you’re badly misunderstanding what scientists do.
Some parents in the wealthy k-12 districts are sitting beside their kids helping, but they may have to go back to work soon. My sister teaches in a school that used to be a Title 1 school but now has about 1/2 the students from wealthier families. Some students are logged on and ready to go every day but other are MIA.
I have a parent who is from the wealthy district. Every kid has a chrome book and lots of support not only from the classroom teacher but also from the school nurse, psychologist, reading specialists. This parent is looking to put her kids into a private school for the fall because she has to return to work. She figures the middle school kids can handle a split schedule of some days in school and some days at home but that the 3rd and 4th graders can’t.
I’ve also noticed a big push with TV ads for ‘free, public online schools.’ (those schools want the state funding, about $8000 per student) I think if I had a grade schooler I’d consider that option. The materials are tried and true and certainly a lot more organized than the local public schools could put together with 2 weeks notice.
I find it odd that people who complain the loudest about other people’s politics are the most political.
The politics is clear from the college president / politician who wrote the op-ed / article. Yes, Weeden was mentioned.
Weeden is a sociologist- Cornell where she works is trying to open with the help of public health and other scientific experts per their website. The author of the ‘article’ clearly has an ax to grind. It unfortunate he tried to bring a sociologist into his stance versus Public Health officials and Medical Doctors like 99.99% of college presidents.