Schools for average student with above average stats

College Search & Lists
1

Looking for suggestions of schools for my D -class of 2017. We think she is amazing but realize she is actually quite average in ECs and a typical high average.

-Very Good tests scores - 34 ACT one sitting (1980 old SAT - 2 times superscore but not as good as the ACT)
-Very Good GPA - w 4.65/ uw 3.94 but Poor rank for her stats (not top 10% - - top 15%)

  • Rigorous courses - many APs (10 by graduation next year - 6 already completed)
    -from Pennsylvania - not URM
    Avg ECs for the real world - below average for CC community and no big awards and/or big leadership. No sports. Little volunteering (non this past year due to heavy schedule much more in years past). Many theater and vocal ECs.

Unsure of major but currently looking into business, economics, and political science.

Unsure of size/location - doesn’t want too rural - would like to be close to a city or possibly in a city. We would like her to be reasonably close (8 hours or less) She loves nature and outdoors but also arts/theater/concerts.
“We” think she will do better at a smaller and mid-size school – she is looking for school spirit and many opportunities to find her people and start over if necessary – she needs a break from her small town cliques

-She will have $30 - $35 K to spend a year

She is struggling to make a cohesive list of schools that will be a good match or reaches - she would be happy to go off to Alabama but we are hoping there are other ideas for her to explore.

She has seen and LOVES:
University of Pittsburgh (merit not likely- rank too low - will be at top of her budget in-state), Richmond (unlikely to afford - scholarship chances?), University of Alabama (LOVES it and can afford it - but it is far), Lafayette (larger scholarships unlikely given her average ECs but she will try).

currently her only matches (financial and academic) are Alabama and Pitt (at top of budget)

She has seen and liked but will likely NOT apply: UVA, Gettysburg, Lehigh (all 3 too expensive and merit unlikely for average girl) Susquehanna, Bucknell, (too rural/far from internship opportunities) Clemson (not in top 10% of class and too rural), Auburn (she loved it there but not sure it was worth so much more $ than Alabama)

To visit: Villanova (reach), Temple, University of Delaware (not sure if she will get merit $)

Looking for suggestions. Places where she would likely get some merit $, good business/finance, school spirit …

2

Alabama will be merit tuition scholarship. It’s not that far!

3

You may want to look at James Madison University in VA… Without a Scholarship it would be at the top of your range for Tuition, Room, and Board, but there are some competitive merit awards. The area is not urban, however the campus arts scene is strong, and it is only 2 hours from DC.

JMU has strong Business/ Finance, and LOTS of school spirit.

4

Thank you – great idea! I forgot all about JMU (had friends who attended back when I was in school) She would love those mountains of VA. Off to check out the admissions stats and merit options.

5

<<<
University of Alabama (LOVES it and can afford it - but it is far
<<<<

It’s not that far! Lol.

Net cost would be about $15k per year! Lots of money leftover for plane fares!

Bama has 1000 students from California…and students from Hawai’i and Alaska!

6

Merit aid at JMU is tight, unfortunately, but thee is some competitive merit. Much is offered by major departments. But some overall by admissions. However, many students move off campus after freshman year, to student apartments and complexes that ring the campus. So the cost of room and board can go down after freshman year. Your tuition also stays the same even if you take over 19 credits a semester, so if a student is interested in double majoring or pursuing multiple minors it can be cost effective.

7

@mom2collegekids Both D and I are sold, sold, sold on Bama – but my H is unsure. He wants to see D apply to many schools and thinks others will come through with some merit - at the very least he wants her to have applied to more than one school so that she feels like she has choices. He really liked UA and was impressed but is cautious and would like to see her closer to home. He thinks she will get lost at such a big school (of course we keep reminding him of the honors college and the small school in a big school).

Since both D and I are the ones who have read and researched - yet we are both happy with UA - we are looking for other suggestions from the CC community that may be contenders worth the application time and $. JMU is a good idea - on paper it seems like D could be happy there and someplace I would not have considered - I am sure there are others that people know about that they could pass along.

8

I understand. Our younger son just wanted to apply to Bama, but we made him apply to 6 schools just to see and to make sure. :slight_smile:

Unless someone is double/triple majoring in unrelated majors, a student pretty much takes classes in one area of campus, particularly if they’re coming in with AP credits…so that also “shrinks” a campus. My kids were STEM majors at Bama, and their classes were mostly in the NE quadrant of the campus.

9

I wouldn’t call Villanova a reach, I think it’s a match!

These schools meet need:
-Boston College
-College of the Holy Cross
-Emory University

These schools may offer merit:
-Fordham University
-Marist College
-Muhlenburg College
-Providence College
-Skidmore College
-University of Scranton

10

Sounds like your child needs to determine the parameters of her search.

For example that means (as you shared):

  • city or near city schools
  • within 8 hour drive Philadelphia metro
  • not large
  • good school spirit
  • solid business program
  • merit aid to bring net cost to $30-35k

Cities could include:

  • Philadelphia
  • New York
  • Boston
  • Toronto
  • Montreal
  • Cleveland
  • Pittsburgh
  • Baltimore
  • DC
  • Raleigh

Drill down and build a list starting in those markets.

11

By the way, I don’t think Lafayette is out of the question for merit. Would the $24K Marquis Scholarship be enough? My son received that with slightly lower academic stats and very average ECs - essentially a varsity sport, band and a minimal bit of volunteering. Also, do you have some financial need where Lafayette’s good FA might cover the rest of the gap between the Marquis Scholarship and the $35K that you are looking to spend? It might be nice to have a couple of smaller colleges on the list as well. Same for Lehigh…will you qualify for need-based aid at all?

12

@momofzag We will not qualify for any need based aid. It is nice to hear that your son received the Marquis Scholarship – when it liked the school and the AO staff. She met many friendly people on campus and felt she would fit in there.

Since that time we have realized that her ECs are quite average and typical HS stuff, and her chance of getting competitive merit might not be so good. She had to fill out some essays and an application listing her community service and ECs for a large scholarship based on a summer activity and she realized quickly that her application is lacking in that area. She is going to try for Lafayette but she is not going all in unless she receives the larger scholarships – in her mind it can’t compare with the value and experience of Alabama at a higher cost - and we feel that her budget is more than reasonable (and with 2 more siblings to follow it is the max we can provide).

13

@ClarinetDad16 Our problem is that many of the parameters on your list are “our” parameters of where we think she would do best. She thinks she wants a large, full of school spirit, completely different from her life experience. She has been happy at almost every campus we have seen and she is pretty easygoing. She is willing to keep visiting schools to try and find something that she likes as much as UA for a value that fits her budget.

Thanks to the suggestions above we have added The Ohio State to our search as well as James Madison University. We will keep Villanova on the list but are unsure of her chance of merit to bring that cost down. We may look at Baltimore (Loyola U of Maryland) and possibly American in DC.

14

If she likes a large school with rah, rah sports, then tOSU is a good option (although it is getting more and more competitive to gain admission). But OSU does offer merit for out of state kids that brings the cost down to your budget. Not sure that it’s any closer to home for you then Alabama though and it’s certainly not smaller than Alabama.

A small college where she might be eligible for higher merit could be Denison University or College of Wooster- perhaps her theater and vocal ECs are more impressive than you think?

15

If she likes U Alabama, she might also like U Mississippi or U Kentucky. Both are a little smaller than U Alabama.

16

How is a student with a 34 ACT score and a 3.94 gpa average? That’s very, very impressive

17

Also, Miami Univ in Ohio has merit for someone with her stats and they aren’t as big as some other state schools and it has what she’s looking for, but I don’t think it’s near a city. I think kids who go to schools that aren’t near cities tend to do their interships during the summer and/or do a semester abroad or in LA or Wash DC if they want another internship

18

Thanks for the suggestions - I would not have thought of many of these.

@citymama9 - D has high test scores and she worked her tail off for her GPA - she is a smart girl and she loves learning - but she is not really well rounded and her ECs are what everyone on CC calls “weak” and “typical”. She has plenty of school activities that she enjoys - she has learned a lot and she has fun but she is not a “leader” or a “winner” or an “innovator” in anything. She has lots of theater/music but she does not have a passion that takes her above and beyond - she is a typical HS student. She really is an average girl with not much to write in her essays and her brag sheet that she needs to fill out for her guidance counselor is quite anemic. After we have spent time reading the requirements and the profiles of the kids who have won the merit awards at schools we realize that good test scores are not enough to win her any $ at those schools (and we are no where near shooting for top schools - just good schools where she we receive a solid education).

It doesn’t help with merit $ that her that her rank is out of the top 10% as well - she is just slightly above average rank (but still average - not the outstanding top 10% or exceptional top 5%). She has been penalized for those music/art classes as they drag/dilute her GPA where a lunch and studyhall would have been neutral with no weighting to dilute the academic AP classes.

Realistically, she is an average student with above average GPA and outstanding test scores, living in a state with a extremely expensive instate tuition for state flagships - where she would likely have to begin at a branch campus and transfer to main campus in year 3. We are looking for ideas of schools where she would look above average enough - even excellent - to be granted some merit $ to make them affordable. On paper it is tough because of her test scores/GPA the college search engines filter out many of the schools that people here are suggesting -

Now if we could count doing laundry, helping out at home with siblings while parents work, visiting with relatives, snapchatting with friends, as ECs on the college ap - she would be in great shape.

19

@novicemom23kids I think helping at home (doing laundry, watching younger sibs) while parents work is looked upon very favorably by many schools (including some very elite ones). One that we visited last summer (maybe Yale?) kept giving the example of “babysitting your younger brother” as a valuable out-of-class activity. They mentioned it over and over, to the point that I found myself wishing there were a larger age difference between my S and his sister so he could claim to be babysitting her when really she’s perfectly capable of looking after herself.

I think that there is a move towards recognizing different ways that students contribute to their communities/families. I even think I heard that after the Harvard report on college admission (“Turning the Tide”) came out, that one of those high end Ivies (again, for some reason I think it’s Yale) announced that they were going to add an essay question on “how do you contribute to your family?” maybe even for this admission cycle.

Your D sounds like an engaged student with great interpersonal qualities, who is a team player if not a leader. I’m not saying this to discount the fact that high achieving kids with demographics like hers and “average” ECs face steep odds at elite schools. Also, I assume that the “how do you contribute to your family” prompt is at least partly intended to capture the experience of folks from low-privileged backgrounds who may have to work and take on responsibilities at home to make ends meet (perhaps this does not match your family’s situation). But I also think they are looking for people who are contributing to their immediate/local environments (including their own families) in meaningful and authentic ways (in contrast with wealthy kids who do an expensive “service trip” to a developing country or similar).

tl;dr: I think doing laundry and looking after younger sibs while parents work is valuable and would be viewed as such by many colleges.

20

I think that she looks great and you may be underestimating her. Remember to cast a wide net with safeties/matches/reaches.

The ACT is great- so look for schools where that will be a top score. If she is interested in the south, look into Loyola University New Orleans. It’s a great school with a lot of artistic creative types in one of the best US cities. Merit may be very likely there.

If she can extend further, look into Trinity University in San Antonio- again a great school that offers great merit and is trying to attract geographic diversity. They have their scholarships on their website. Again, SA is a very unique city.

For more merit and again in Texas look into UT Dallas. It’s really trying to attract top scorers and the geographic diversity. A lot of smart kids turn down top schools to go to UT Dallas for the merit and academic opportunities they offer.

However, none of the above schools are big rah rah schools. Will she be National Merit Finalist? If so, University of Oklahoma offers merit and is huge on school spirit. Also, I believe that Michigan State offered some really great merit to National Merit Finalist/high stats students.

Remember that she has contributed a lot to her school community by participating in theatre. Also, the essays are key. If she is a great writer, she can get into some top schools.

Are you sure that you won’t get any financial aid? Go to the NPC calculator and plug in your numbers.

As you know, CMU is in Pittsburgh and while definitely a reach it has been increasing its monies to students that show a lot of interest in the school. Their economics, decision sciences and public policies programs are top notch.

BTW, I thought my two kids were solid students in different ways but no great shakes. But they both managed to get merit at the schools they applied to.

Don’t forget to enjoy the journey.