<p>I thought this was very interesting. I’ve often thought that the lack of discussion about race was a problem…</p>
<p>[Shh</a>! Let’s Not Talk About Race | LiveScience](<a href=“http://www.livescience.com/culture/081006-race-talk.html]Shh”>Shh! Let's Not Talk About Race | Live Science)</p>
<p>Thanks for posting. I’m black and have experienced how white people avoid mentioning race. For instance, when I made a date to meet a white friend at a restaurant, I told my friend to make sure that she told the hostess that I was black so that if I had gotten there first, the hostess would lead my friend to me. My friend expressed concern about mentioning my race. She feared it would somehow seem racist.</p>
<p>Meanwhile, on other occasions, restaurant hostesses had erroneously told me that white friends whom I was scheduled to meet had not arrived. That’s because I had mentioned that I was there to meet a “single, middle aged woman”, but hadn’t mentioned that my friend was white. </p>
<p>H and I also once were scheduled to be met at a train station in Europe by someone whom we hadn’t met before: He was one of our friends brothers. We were the only black people in the train station, and assumed we’d be easy to spot. However, we weren’t spotted until virtually everyone else had left because our friend hadn’t told his brother that we are black. </p>
<p>From the article. </p>
<p>"The tendency of some white people to go silent or act “colorblind” on the topic of race could do more harm than good, new research shows.</p>
<p>White people — including children as young as 10 — may avoid talking about race so as not to appear prejudiced, but that approach often backfires as black people tend to view this approach as evidence of prejudice, especially when race is clearly relevant.</p>
<p>These results are from two separate sets of experiments led by researchers from Tufts University and Harvard Business School. Their findings are reported in the October issue of the Journal of Personality and Social Psychology and the September issue of Developmental Psychology.</p>
<p>“Efforts to talk about race are fraught with the potential for misunderstandings,” said researcher Evan Apfelbaum, a Ph.D. candidate at Tufts University. “One way that whites try to appear unbiased is to avoid talking about race altogether, a tendency we refer to as strategic colorblindness.”</p>
<p>A 2004 Pew Research Center for the People & Press survey revealed that race continues to divide Americans even though a lot of progress has been made in the past 20 years. The number of Americans who say they have little in common with people of other races is down to 13 percent (from 25 percent in 1988); and the idea of interracial dating among blacks and whites is now broadly accepted. Apfelbaum’s research, however, shows that whites are still socially awkward around blacks on the topic of race…</p>
<p>n one of Apfelbaum’s studies, 101 white undergraduate students were paired with either a white or black female partner who pretended to be another participant. The pairs were presented with 30 photographs of faces that varied in race, gender and background color. Each white participant’s objective was to guess which of the photographs the partner was holding by asking as few yes-or-no questions as possible.</p>
<p>Even though asking about the race of the person in the photograph was a sound strategy for completing the task, white participants were far less likely to do so with a black versus a white partner. Moreover, when the black partner was the first one to have a turn asking questions, whether she mentioned race had a dramatic effect. White participants whose black partner asked about race mentioned race on their own turn 95 percent of the time. When the black partner never asked about race, white participants only did so 10 percent of the time."</p>
<p>You’ve hit on a pet peeve of mine. I have had many white friends who have told me they feel awkward or rude mentioning race. I think it’s more awkward to avoid the topic. This comes up the most for me when friends are giving me a physical description of someone. If you don’t mention race, you’re skipping a pretty big identifier! Or the person will describe height, build, and then drop down to a whisper for, “She’s African American.” Why on Earth does that need to be whispered? In my experience people do seem more comfortable mentioning that someone is Asian than black, which makes sense when you consider the history of race relations between Asians and white people versus black people and white people. I have not seen much of a difference based on age, either, though perhaps others have. </p>
<p>My family is white, but a little girl who is black lives with my family. She acts like my little sister, my mom treats her like a daughter, and in all respects she fits in as a member of the family (though she does have her own family in another country). When we go out, though, it’s clear that people don’t know what to make of us. We get lots and lots of looks, but zero questions. The silence is strange. If I mention that I have a little sister (of sorts) who is black, people sometimes look scandalized that I mentioned race. If race is relevant to the conversation, though, it’s stranger not not bring it up. </p>
<p>The office I worked in last summer was probably over 90% black. When I started work there, there were three white people including me and then one Asian man, out of probably fifty people. I noticed that these people were much more open to talking about race than my white friends.</p>
<p>Just to mention an issue, picking up on the examples above, that doesn’t have any official categorization by the government, would you tell someone that you are waiting for </p>
<p>a) “a morbidly obese woman” (an actual description of a person I know I heard once from a physician) </p>
<p>b) “an extremely ugly person” (a kind of person supposedly banned from admission to the United States Military Academy at one time, by explicit regulation) </p>
<p>c) “a man wearing Coke-bottle glasses” </p>
<p>d) “a redhead” </p>
<p>e) “a hot babe” </p>
<p>f) “an old lady” </p>
<p>or some other term like that? </p>
<p>I think people delete a lot of description terms from their everyday speech as a matter of euphemism. I guess I think it will be progress when “racial” terms are viewed as neither more nor less appropriate than such descriptive terms as “tall,” “blond,” “male,” or “wearing a two-piece dress,” but its the official meaning of those terms that invests them with secondary meaning, and thus makes them sensitive for polite conversation.</p>
<p>^ Yes for C (glasses), D (redhead), and F (old–though I’d probably say “older” just from habit). Maybe for A (morbidly obese), if the person really needs a description. I would like to leave out the “morbidly” and if I didn’t need a precise description, I might just go with “a heavy woman” or something vague, that doesn’t allude to an up and coming death. No for B (ugly). It’s rude, judgmental, and unclear. Maybe for E (hot), if I were joking around with a friend. Definitely for E if I were talking to a friend about my girlfriend. 
You could also add “in a wheelchair” or “walks with a cane” to that list.</p>
<p>I can remember when growing up in the northest that there was a time in my life that using the term black to identify a person seemed appropriate. Then at some point people spoke of the the importance of being color blind and specifically not identifying people by race. From that point on for me it has been a dilemma between stating what is clearly obvious when trying to identify a person and being inpolite by identifying a person by race. Thank you for this discussion. Next time I need to help someone identify a person they don’t know I will use the objective terms needed with confidence and these will include the person’s race, hair color, the most polite description of height and weight that I can think of, but the description will never include the word ugly!</p>
<p>When my oldest son was in elementary school, he was telling me about a boy in his class who had lent him a pencil. I asked which boy and he described him as brown hair, blue shirt, jeans, white shoes. I looked around and couldn’t spot him. He finally brought the boy over and he was black. At the time, I was pleased that it never ocurred to my son that there were different skin colors.</p>
<p>“Then at some point people spoke of the the importance of being color blind and specifically not identifying people by race”</p>
<p>The people who came up with “colorblind” were idiots. Why should anyone not notice what color a person is when color is one of any person’s most identifiable charcteristics? </p>
<p>The people who thought being “colorblind” was desirable are people who actually thought that being anything but white was a negative characteristic. I’ve never heard any black, Asian, Native American or Hispanic person suggest that not noticing someone’s race is what’s desirable.</p>
<p>What’s desirable is not jumping to conclusions about a person due to their race.</p>
<p>3bm103
When our son was little, he didn’t seem to notice racial differences among his friends at preschool. He noticed them in adults, though, maybe because our group of friends and neighbors is not nearly as diverse as his preschool was.</p>
<p>We don’t get a newspaper anymore, so I don’t know if they still do this or not, but it used to drive me crazy that when there was a crime committed, the newspaper would publish a description of the suspect, and leave out race. They would put hair color, eye color, height, weight, etc - just no skin color - or other ethnic heritage mention. I used to read “brown eyes, black hair” and wonder, am I looking for a white guy? A black guy? Asian? Hispanic? (I think they might now at least allude to “dark skinned” or “light skinned”.)</p>
<p>There was a period of time when “African-American” became the preferred term over black. However, I know a handful of folk who are black, but not African-American (a friend from England, a friend from France, a friend from French Guiana, a friend from St. Lucia…) So sometimes I don’t mention race because I’m afraid of offending by using the wrong term.</p>
<p>Once we had a black friend from French Guiana staying with us. At the same time, we had a dark-skinned foster baby living with us (she was Indian, but could easily pass for black). I took our friend shopping. I was carrying my foster D, and my friend was carrying my then 2 year old blond haired, blue eyed daughter. It was amazing to us what happened – whites in general just openly stared (trying to figure it out, I guess!) Blacks were offended, and would come up to me and make comments or demand to know “Where’d you get that baby?” But we made a lot of folks uncomfortable.</p>
<p>Our friend asked me a lot of hard questions about why. Very eye-opening experience.</p>
<p>I agree with Northstarmom, the color of the skin, hear and even eyes, are main characteristics of a person, everybody noticed them and I don’t understand why they are afraid to say it. I come form another country that doesn’t have those taboos; a black person is a black person and there is nothing wrong with that; a pale person is a pale person (easily spotted in a beach) and there is nothing wrong with that. I hate when people tells me I don’t look Hispanic, they don’t realized that Hispanic is not a race and does not even a correct classification since people from the Americas have different origins.<br>
“What’s desirable is not jumping to conclusions about a person due to their race.” Northstarmom, you couldn’t say it better!</p>
<p>ITA with post no. 8.</p>
<p>I think part of the problem stems from the feeling that white is the default, so everything else is out of the norm and, therefore, mentioning it points out a perceived negative deviation. For instance, I never hear someone saying “she’s white” as a descriptor because most would assume she’s white unless something else is specified.</p>
<p>Actually, in some parts of the world, people DON’T notice hair color, because it is not distinctive for most people there. I asked a guy in Taiwan once about an actress in western movies he was mentioning in a conversation and what her hair color was–a very routine description question in the United States, I agree. He had no idea what her hair color was, as he had never particularly noticed that. </p>
<p>After edit: similarly, in some places, where I have lived, “she is white” would be ANYTHING but the default. But “white” might not be the term for “white.” Perhaps “Western” would be, or “American” (which latter term, I also agree, doesn’t do justice to the large number of American people who aren’t white people).</p>
<p>I dont say becuase I dont want to offend anyone. What are the proper terms for the various races…</p>
<p>For months while in high school, S had been talking about some school friends. One day he announced that they were coming over and probably would order some food. Two of them were kosher, he said, to warn me about the kind of food to offer. I knew one of the Jewish kids. When the other showed up, I was taken aback. She’s African-American. S never bothered to find out whether she was adopted or if she was the child of a bi-racial couple (her last name is Jewish). Another friend with the surname Smith turned out to be of Chinese origin (adopted). Still another was half-Chinese half-Australian.
I had to meet them to find out their ethnicity.</p>
<p>I avoid it because it is all too easy to be labeled now days. I’ll discuss race with close friends who know me and aren’t going to read things that aren’t there. Other than that it is a taboo subject. I think this country could do with a gut-spilling about race. Not in a snarkey manner but getting things off our chests, collectively. A lot of what is out there are out-dated preconceptions and stereotypes. It won’t happen but I think it would help in the long run.</p>
<p>As a white person myself who has made some effort to educate myself about racial issues (but can clearly remember a time when she was totally naive and clueless), I think most white people just have no idea how to approach race. They genuinely think that pretending to be colorblind is the way to not be racist (ignoring or not realizing that <em>society</em> is not colorblind, and that unconscious bias is pretty much universal), and I have heard white people complain about elementary schools teaching black history, talking about the Jim Crow era, etc, because it’s destroying their child’s colorblindness.</p>
<p>The people who thought being “colorblind” was desirable are people who actually thought that being anything but white was a negative characteristic. I’ve never heard any black, Asian, Native American or Hispanic person suggest that not noticing someone’s race is what’s desirable.</p>
<p>What’s desirable is not jumping to conclusions about a person due to their race. </p>
<p>Northstarmom, I agree with you with regard to what is desirable. I cannot tell you why the people who were teaching colorblindnes were doing this and even if it was only white people doing the teaching. Now that I think about it I am guessing it had to do with the tendency that some people had to use race midsentence as an adjective to describe the person. Which actually was put there for the purpose causing the listener to jump to conclusions. (This is not just limited to race it also includes ethnicity and faith and very often this is intended as a negative adjective). So perhaps colorblindness was touted by folks who thought we should see each other the same and when we lost a sence of preconcieved notions with regard to race then we would see a person and not a color. But sometimes a color or a characteristic is just that. A facts that allows us to distinguish an individual in a crowd. Please don’t be offended by people who won’t use race to describe a person. They are only trying not to offend. (That sounds sort of strange doesn’t it.) So, as in the article mentioned in post #2 once white people know that it isn’t offensive to use race to identify a person they will use it. The more there is discussion, hopefully the more we understand. I find this discussion liberating because while I have used race to identify a person in “crowd” because it has seemed silly not to I have also felt uncomfortable and a little worried that my mention of race might be seen as more than just that. It is an eye opener to see that not using race in a description can also be seen as more than just that. Perhaps it all goes back to honesty.</p>
<p>18, I appreciate you candor. I think more importantly it is a reflection of the fact that in an overly PC world today, you don’t feel free to be honest. If you mention something about the “poor” it is assumed you are making a veiled reference to blacks. That same if you talk about those on welfare or other entitlements. I think everyone has become very cynical about race, due in part to the lack of discussion about it. I think most wish it would just go away…they know it won’t.</p>
<p>A couple of earlier posters hit on an important point, I think, which is the question of how to talk about different races. A lot of people say African-American. I tend to go with the term black since it’s factual and many dark-skinned people I know are not from Africa, are not American, or don’t like being in a group with a hyphenated title. Some people of course prefer the title African-American, while others prefer black, Black, dark-skinned, or some other term. Many people we would normally call Indian are now describing themselves as “brown.” My take on this is that if you don’t mean to offend, you probably won’t be offending people, and if you do by accident, you can apologize and ask how that person would like to be identified. At least that’s my take on it.</p>