<p>I’m a freshman in college and I’ve been planning on majoring in either math, physics or chemistry, but reading some of the threads here has me worried. Is employment in the sciences really as bad as some are making it out to be? Should I be doing engineering instead? How hard is it to be successful as a pure science or math major?</p>
<p>Yes. </p>
<p>Applied Math is a great major btw.</p>
<p>Employment options depend mostly on your major. If you do something that is heavy in Math and/or Computer Science you will be fine.</p>
<p>Which science?</p>
<p>Computer science, applied math, and statistics have relatively good job and career prospects as of now, especially if supplemented with each other and some economics and finance.</p>
<p>Of the more “lab” type of sciences, physics appears to be significantly better than chemistry or (especially) biology for job and career prospects at the bachelor’s level. The biology job market is probably flooded with pre-meds who did not get into medical school competing for the low paid lab technician jobs. Someone interested in chemistry may want to consider chemical engineering instead.</p>
<p>You can check the career surveys at the web sites of UC Berkeley, Cal Poly SLO, CMU, MIT, and Georgia Tech to compare how graduates of different majors are doing.</p>
<p>Here is some information from the US Department of Labor - Bureau of Labor Statistics - Occupational Outlook Handbook:</p>
<p>Chemists and Materials Scientists: [Chemists</a> and Materials Scientists](<a href=“http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos049.htm]Chemists”>http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos049.htm)</p>
<p>Biological Scientists: [Biological</a> Scientists](<a href=“http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos047.htm]Biological”>http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos047.htm)</p>
<p>Physicists: [Physicists[/url</a>]</p>
<p>Mathematicians: [url=<a href=“http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes152021.htm]Mathematicians[/url”>http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes152021.htm]Mathematicians[/url</a>]</p>
<p>Mathematical Science Occupations, All Other: [url=<a href=“http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes152099.htm]Mathematical”>http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes152099.htm]Mathematical</a> Science Occupations, All Other](<a href=“http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes192012.htm]Physicists[/url”>http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes192012.htm)</p>
<p>Yes stay away from Chemistry and Biology. Getting addicted to narcotics would be less damaging to you life and well-being than pursuing a science career and easier to quit too.</p>
<p>Thanks to everyone for the responses.</p>
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<p>I’m enrolled as a pure math major at the moment. Would switching to applied math improve my career prospects significantly? How different is the major in terms of courses, approach, etc.?</p>
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<p>Would it make any sense at all to combine math with something like chemistry or chemical engineering? I’ve thought about going the math + CS/econ route, but I have a hard time making myself feel excited about either of those fields.</p>
<p>Applied math is for people who want job in industry straight out of college while pure math prepares you for grad school in pure math/applied math. Pure math has significantly more writing proofs. </p>
<p><a href=“https://career.berkeley.edu/Major/AppMath.stm[/url]”>https://career.berkeley.edu/Major/AppMath.stm</a>
<a href=“https://career.berkeley.edu/Major/Math.stm[/url]”>https://career.berkeley.edu/Major/Math.stm</a></p>
<p>As you can see here it’s possible to get employed with a pure math degree as well. In that case you’ll have to make yourself more marketable by learning programming, finance, etc.</p>
<p>B.S in Chemical Engineering can get you jobs that require B.S in Chemistry, but it’s not the other way around. ChemE or any other engineering majors look quantitative enough in employers’ eyes that you can get variety of jobs not just limited to Engineering so I wouldn’t say combining Math would be that helpful.</p>
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<p>Specifics depend on your school, but typically the math and applied math majors do not require a huge number of courses. It is likely that you can take both pure math courses and have enough schedule space to easily fit in applied courses like statistics, economics, and/or computer science, which could improve job and career prospects at the bachelor’s degree level.</p>
<p>Regarding the Job Occupational Handbook link that NeedAVacation supplies- the Biolgocial Sciences page is in start contrast in regards to job prospects from what many of the posters say here.</p>
<p>Here is a snippet from the page on job prospects:
“Job Outlook. Employment of biological scientists is expected to increase much faster than the average for all occupations although there will continue to be competition for some basic research positions.
Employment change. Employment of biological scientists is projected to grow 21 percent over the 2008—18 decade, much faster than the average for all occupations, as biotechnological research and development continues to drive job growth. Biological scientists enjoyed very rapid employment gains over the past few decades—reflecting, in part, the growth of the biotechnology industry”</p>
<p>I honestly have no idea where they came up with that. If anything I see more job ads for chemists than biologists and there are way more biology majors than chemistry majors.</p>
<p>Just for kicks I typed
chemist into indeed.com and got 4,130 job ads
Biologist into indeed.com and got 1,583 job ads
Accountant gets 40,178 job ads</p>
<p>Keep in mind how many more biology major there are and that many of the biologist jobs also like chemistry majors because they are good in the lab and at running lab equipment.</p>
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<p>Keep in mind taxes are due in two and a half weeks, and most people don’t think about them until the last minute.</p>
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<p>Still, growth from a low base does not mean that the end result will be that good. It is like two students in school. One improved his/her grades, while the other’s grades declined. But if the improved student went from a D- to a D+, while the other student went from an A to an A-, the student whose grades declined is still doing better in school.</p>
<p>As long as students believe that they have to major in biology to do pre-med, the biology job market will be flooded with failed pre-meds.</p>
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<p>Engineer gets 316,380 job ads ;)</p>
<p>sschoe’s analysis stems from the simple fact that most undergraduate biology majors take jobs with varying names such as lab technician, research assistant/associate/scientist, lab technologist, biologist, biotechnician, biotechnologist, biomedical researcher, and teacher. Many go on to graduate school to further specialize in a related field.</p>
<p>Accounting majors take jobs as accountants. They are staff accountants, tax accountants, chief accountants, financial accountants, management accountants, and public accountants. Some do have specialized names such as CFO, auditor, and treasurer. </p>
<p>It’s clear why sschoe hates science. Scientists must be able to understand the use and misuse of data and be able to think logically. Scchoe has yet to show any of those abilities.</p>
<p>Tell me sschoe, what’s the current unemployment rate for those working in the scientific research and medical industries (where biology majors usually work)? Now how about the unemployment rate for those working in professional services (where accountants work)? A simple google search should lead you to the answer.</p>
<p>and You Inmotion have yet to display good reading comprehension. The indeed stuff I posted was just for kicks I never claimed it as solid evidence just a sign. Job titles can vary for all professions. Not all accountants have the name accountant in their title either they can be auditors, analysts, IRS agents etc. </p>
<p>Tracking employment data is highly complex and is often misleading. A Chemistry major who can’t get a job as a chemist and works instead selling cars or doing construction work is employed. Heck I took the police exam to see if I could get hired there. BLS spends millions on doing these stats but they essentially do the same thing I did they just count the number of people with chemist as their job title and display the median salary and make projections. It does not include people in crappy permatemp jobs, nor give any indication as to what % of those who graduate are able to get decent jobs in the field. </p>
<p>The most recent ACS survey gave some more hints.<br>
[Chemjobber:</a> Well, that’s not good news](<a href=“http://chemjobber.blogspot.com/2011/03/well-thats-not-good-news.html]Chemjobber:”>Chemjobber: Well, that's not good news)
Only 38% of MS grads in Chemistry were employed full time and of that 38% 55% were employed by academia. I have no idea what MS grads do in Academia (BS’s sometimes work as technicians and Ph. D’s as Post-Docs) but I doubt that it could be considered as good jobs as academia is known for significantly lower salaries. The take home message from that is the vast majority of chemistry grads do not find good jobs with the BSc., MSc., or even Ph. D. (40% FTE of that 60% Academia most are not tenured professors).</p>
<p>In conclusion, we have a degree that takes intelligence, long hours in the lab, and dedication and rewards it with extremely poor job prospects and increasingly anemic (worse than blue collar) salaries if you even get salary and not some hourly permatemp job. That is why I hate science and think that the people calling for more students to study science are either quite ignorant or incredibly amoral.</p>
<p>FWIW the numbers at Purdue University isn’t so bad for starting salaries for 2010 Biology majors. Of course it’s only 13 people and who knows how many actually are in the field and not a Assistant Manager at the GAP.</p>
<p>Biological Sciences
Number Reporting: 13
Low: $20,800
25%: $29,560
50% $35,000
75% $39,000
High: $60,000
Avg: $34,080</p>
<p>Full link and comparison, click on 2010:
<a href=“Purdue CCO”>https://www.cco.purdue.edu/Student/PostGradData.shtml</a></p>
<p>$35,000 median is significantly worse than actuarial, computer science, and statistics within the science category (chemistry and physics not listed), though better than (presumably pure) math. It is also worse than business, economics, and engineering. It is only slightly better than most of the humanities and social studies listed.</p>
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<p>However, a plain bachelor’s degree in biology tends not to get the better jobs without additional education (medical, nursing, dental, pharmacy, PhD, etc.; and medical schools do not require a biology degree). A flood of failed pre-meds who majored in biology keeps supply high relative to demand for biology graduates.</p>
<p>On the other hand, sschoe2’s gripes mainly apply to biology and chemistry; university career surveys indicate that physics, applied math, statistics, and computer science graduates do considerably better in the job market. Chemical engineering graduates do considerably better than chemistry graduates.</p>