@younghoss My interpretation is that he was not a legal gunner owner. Gun laws wouldn’t have stopped this madman from killing.
The poster said our “culture” doesn’t value human life. It wasn’t a gun conversation. It was about a cultural respect for life. And I don’t think we are unique in that respect. Hence the other parties mentioned. Please read both posts to better understand the context. Respect for life includes treatment of women. Children. Religious tolerance. Political opinion even if different from your own.
I believe it’s a part of the global human condition. Not an American issue. In fact I believe despite the issues we have many of the non gun issues have improved. But it’s certainly not even close to being ideal and a lot of work needs to be done.
No argument from me that the United States today is one of the greatest places to live and one of the safest, no matter where you look and no matter when you look in all of recorded history. People lose sight of that, understandably so when something like this happens.
Just to get back to the tragic and terrible event, we likewise should not lose sight of the fact that the shooter Gary Martin had multiple convictions, including one for stabbing a woman and another for domestic violence, according to the profile at heavy.com. We often want people to have second chances, but there is a cost to that.
Also, he used a handgun, which most knowledgeable people will tell you can be quite a lot more deadly in close quarters than a rifle. No one is talking about banning handguns. At least not yet.
Yes. It was an awful tragedy. And the poor intern. So incredibly sad. Beyond words. Thoughts and prayers to the victims and their families.
How long ago were the previous violent crimes committed? “Ban the box” maybe for non-violent crimes, but yes, giving repeated offenders another chance is extremely risky.
Recidivism rates are high.
thank you for clearing that up for me, privatebanker. Apparently he had broken many laws even before this incident.
According to the WP, he had been arrested by Aurora police several times over the last few years for domestic violence. Why he wasn’t tried and jailed is not stated. It’s also shocking that he could beat his girlfriend with a baseball bat and serve just three years in prison.
In all fairness, I should say the alleged shooter broke many laws before he allegedly perpetrated this particular incident.
@younghoss I’ve read since my post that he did purchase the gun legally. The back ground check failed to bring up the Missouri felony.
And not sure if his more recent issues were on the record. Or the timing around the newer crimes and purchase.
Missouri may have not uploaded all cases from back then and it is not connecting to him. That’s a problem. Systems aren’t perfect for sure. They need to up the game in that area.
^^^^^. The felony was in Mississippi. It didn’t turn up on a FOID background check. But it did show up on a concealed carry permit check. They revoked his FOID card. Looks like they never followed up confiscate any guns.
We are just way too sloppy and complacent with our background checks, even as feeble as they are.
My understanding, as noted previously, is that there was a failure to confiscate his gun. So the authorities messed up there. As far as background checks, most employers will have checks going back about 7 years and will often disqualify a candidate for employment for a violent crime or one involving theft. That said (and I have great experience in this area), the third parties who conduct the background checks for employers are horribly incompetent. For example, they will miss a felony by “Richard Nelson” if the applicant applies as “Rick Nelson”.
The Dekalb paper reports that the NIU student was at the termination meeting with the shooter. That seems odd for a first day intern.
That would be horrible HR practice to have a new intern at a termination. I’m wondering if my HR VPs will be more interested in having more security on premises after this…
^^^Agree, and so tragic. I worked at a fortune 50 company for many years and by the early 90s the policy was to have an armed security guard accompany the employee and HR staff for every termination, at any facility ,whether US or international. After termination, the security guard took the employee to their desk/office to get their things and escorted them to their car.
I remember being escorted like that when I was laid off in 1990!
The problem is, just like with this guy, they come back and often the receptionists in the lobby doesn’t know they were terminated or that there is any concern until the bullets start flying. I met a lawyer at a conference who is with the company that had the distribution center shooter in Maryland last September. (It was a female shooter) He said you can’t imagine how awful it really is until it is your co-workers and your company going through it.
The report I read said the shooter opened fire at the termination meeting. But, yeah, I can see how a disgruntled employee could easily get in by acting like he’s still working at the place he’s worked for 15 years.
That’s right. I didn’t realize he had the gun in the workplace and that he opened fire right after he was terminated.
It is not going to change anything, sadly. But I just wonder if they thought the intern was a strong kid and had him around in case the man got violent. Perhaps the others were afraid and not physically capable to hold him off alone. Good god. I can’t imagine the pain for these poor families. It literally makes me feel a bit scared for our kids as they go out into the world.