<p>Lacrosse is a mostly regional sport and unlikely to ever be a major college sport, but the chances for this are certainly better for the women as their teams are being formed to correct participation levels as needed to comply with Title IX. Presently, at the Division I level, there are 56 men’s teams and 81 women’s teams and probably twice as many scholarships available for the women’s teams. There are 78 Division I women’s field hockey teams.</p>
<p>I think it’s all okay but that parents and kids should know the score. The problem IMO is that our culture fuels the mania surrounding hs sports to the point that very few question the strategy of pushing their kids as hard as possible down that path. I think the Time piece and this discussion are all healthy and positive. Just so everyone has a realistic sense of the possibilties and isn’t caught up in a fiction.</p>
<p>We live in a culture that fuels AP/Intel/super EC/SAT prep mania, as well. At least the athletes are getting some exercise!</p>
<p>While I think HS sports is awesome and should be done by every hs student when possible, there are most definitely some realizations that need to be known by both student/athletes and their parents. Of a typical small/medium school with say 20 seniors graduating HS; about 4-5 may be looked at by colleges. Mostly local, state U, D2/NAIA schools. Of those 5, 2 might be looked at with D1 schools. Of those 2, 1 will be of the true D1 caliber that allows them to be truly recruited, full ride, and a probable player.</p>
<p>Where the problem comes is when the student/athlete looks at the sport MORE than the full ride education. I have seen quite a few student/athletes turn down a D2/NAIA school for that D1 school. They wound up not getting a scholarship or it was a partial. Worse yet, they get a scholarship and wind up not being one of the “Stars”. Then they get discouraged because they aren’t playing because they aren’t the superstar they were in HS. But if they quit the sport, they lose the scholarship. </p>
<p>I made it clear to my son that if he wanted to parlay sports into a ticket to college via a scholarship, that he couldn’t limit a school because they are too small. I.e. Contrary to what some may say, a full ride education to a small D2/NAIA school playing ball is most times better than no scholarship to some “prestigious” school or a walk on with no scholarship to a D1 school. My son was practical enough to work specifically on the academic side. He got accepted, academically, to all 7 schools that he applied to. Based on merit aid, scholarships, etc… he determined what he wanted and what was best financially. After being accepted, we then started more serious talks with the athletic departments. 2 offered to recruit; 1 offered a walk on; and the other 4 didn’t even talk about sports. That’s understandable considering we live in a small state with little notoriety. </p>
<p>My suggestion is that you use academics to get into a school. If athletics can ALSO get you the money to go to college, then great; just don’t rely on it. Chances are slim. The education itself is the most important thing. Use athletics as a tool, but not as your main crux. Parents and student/athletes who think they are going to work their way through Jr High and High School on sports and will automatically get a sports full ride scholarship is setting themselves up for a big fall. Or, they set their standards too high and lose out on a full ride. There will be some students that are the best in the state in their sport. We probably all know one of these kids. They can also pick and choose where they want to go to school. Unfortunately, that is such a small percentage. </p>
<p>Here is a good example according to the NCAA. According to the NCAA, high school men’s basketball has close to 500,000 players; 157,000 are seniors. There are approximately 4,500 freshman positions available. This means that approximately 3% of high school senior basketball players will play NCAA sponsored basketball. Now, the odds go up a little because not every kid tries to go to college. Also, some go to NAIA and Jr College. But still, the odds are pretty low.</p>
<p>If parents/players would spend a fraction of the time they spend on their sport, the facts are easily uncovered by surfing the web and asking questions to coaches, players, parents who have “been there and done that.” Would you send your kid out to play a game without knowing the rules and strategies? It’s the same thing, really.</p>
<p>Re lacrosse – some things to note (1) lax is the #1 growth youth team sport in the US and (2) the sport is demographically tied at its highest levels to many “tier one” high schools and colleges.</p>
<p>As the parent of two Div III players, I agree that finding a strong match school where you are recruited will increase your profile for any academic money FOR WHICH YOU ARE OTHERWISE QUALIFIED. Both were uncomfortable with the isolation they saw Div I athletes experience, as well as playing on a team with players who were, in effect, being “paid to play” a sport they love. So they ruled out Div I early on. They have friends who feel otherwise, a couple of whom are well-suited to the lifestyle necessary to succeed. Viva le difference. Just know what it is!</p>
<p>S#2 is going to his #1 school with about a 1/2 tuition merit package. S#1 is at his #1 school with a full tuition academic scholarship – has traded his varsity lax career for one as the local middle school coach, frat rush chair, tour guide, and campus hip-hop dance champ, but none of this has any effect on his scholarship. Told us recently that he’s still amazed they “designed the perfect school for me” – way back in the mid 1700s. </p>
<p>The key is that both were fully qualified for admission AND the merit money offered. How much weight was given to their respective athletic experiences/potential contributions, we’ll never know. One thing I do know, though, is that being “just a jock” would not yield these scholarship results. </p>
<p>So keep up the singing, dancing, writing, volunteering, and whatever else S/HE ENJOYS, then go out and find the school where s/he can be happy, whether s/he plays or not. Now THAT’S a smart game plan.</p>
<p>good post christcorp</p>
<p>Sticker, our coach has been working with athletes for 30 plus years. He’s got a lot of state championship trophies, but what he brags about is the team GPA. He’s one in a million.</p>
<p>Esquette; I don’t know much about lax; but for those who are interested; DIVISION III schools don’t give athletic scholarships. That is an NCAA ruling.</p>
<p>DIVISION I/IA, II, and NAIA do give athletic scholarships. Usually when you are at the Division II and NAIA schools, it is usually common that they are partial scholarships. We had 2 recruited this year to an NAIA and a D2 school. Both schools still would have cost the student/family about $10,000 a year. D1 schools are a lot more generous. Then again, they usually have more money to work with.</p>
<p>Now, I guess it’s possible to get athletic scholarships that aren’t NCAA sports. I.e. if the school is a D3 school in their NCAA varsity sports, but they have a particular sport that isn’t in the NCAA listing; e.g. Fencing (Just an example); then it’s possible to get a scholarship for that. But, if it’s a D3 NCAA varsity sport, there is no athletic scholarship. Just D1, D2, NAIA, and some other local athletic affiliations.</p>
<p>Christcorp:</p>
<p>Please review the post again – the scholarships I am talking about are ACADEMIC scholarships in Div III, not athletic scholarships. Therefore, it makes no difference whether the scholarship recipient plays the sport (which is why I included the anecdote about S#1). And these academic scholarships (aka “merit money”) are for a full four years, subject only to a minimum GPA – not year to year as with Div I athletic scholarships.</p>
<p>As for the generosity comparison between Div I and Div III, I have yet to meet a single Div I lax player who has a full tuition scholarship, let alone one guaranteed for four years even if s/he doesn’t play. The lesson is that there is FAR more money for academic scholarships (regardless of division), and the chances of getting more aid are therefore better when pursued through the academic scholarship side of the ledger.</p>
<p>Christcorp and Mam – I think we’re on the same page with the same message ;)</p>
<p>I have been following this thread with interest as I have one son on a full ride high division one scholarship at a top 20 school and another who is a senior in high school who does not play sports (knee injury), but is a National Merit Scholar. Here is my advice:
- Do not plan on getting an athletic scholarship. Too many things can happen that may derail your plans-injuries, recruiting, kid stops growing, etc. Do not have your kids playing in the Nationals when they are 10 years old. No one cares. Take a family vacation instead. They should be good by the time they start high school and should be great by sophomore year if they will be high d-1. If they are not great but have a certain physical attribute that makes them valuable (ex: 7’ tall for BB), then that is okay too.
- Plan on doing well in school and on tests like the SAT’s. There is nothing more valuable to a coach than an athlete who would get into the school in the regular applicant pool.
3.If offered a scholarship/admission to school, choose the school that is the right fit even if a) you never play a minute of your sport, b) the coaching staff leaves the minute you sign your LOI (letter of intent/binding agreement), c) could afford to stay at the school though loans or whatever if you want to quit your sport and just attend the school. - Best advice: have a really smart kid who is athletically gifted AND has the right size and body type for his/her sport. That is the easiest way to get into college these days.
- Know that number 4 is happening early. That way your kid can commit his junior year and never has to do anything other than fill out one application. No stress, no waiting, no unnecessary paperwork.
- Athletic Scholarships are only good for one year at a time. Most competitive schools who compete at the high Division one level will honor the scholarship for four years unless the kid gets caught smoking pot or stealing or refuses to participate in the program at all. That means, if he cannot play, then he helps out with other things and the scholarship is honored. Coaches do this because no one would commit to them if they thought they might get dropped for having a few bad games. This is not in writing. It is a matter of the personal integrity of the coach and school you are dealing with. Act accordingly.
- Playing a Division one sport is the most grueling way for a kid to work their way through college. After seeing the recruiting process and what goes into the whole scene for son #1, son #2 said he would never want anything to do with that life. Too many sacrifices.( It is also highly rewarding for the people who choose to participate.) As a parent, I am grateful my #1 son is attending his dream school, but I am mindful of the sacrifices he made to get there and continues to make to stay there. Also, I have to acknowledge that although some players do manage to excel academically at the highest level while playing a D-1 sport, most players do suffer a lower gpa due to their athletic commitments. (30 - 40 hours a week, 48-50 weeks a year)
- Son #2 did great on the PSAT and the SAT, took a rigorous course load at a good public HS, and will graduate with a 4.0 (W) or slightly higher GPA. He had every weekend and holiday off unless he was doing an occasional EC activity. (Never missed prom to attend a tournament or travel out of town. Never drove two hours a day to get the coaching/training that wasn’t available in our city. Didn’t miss anything as a matter of fact) He so far has full ride offers at a few mid range schools, half off and maybe full tuition at a top 30 school, and maybe a Regent’s scholarship at one or more UC’s. Actual dollars-wise, he has equalled my full-ride athletic scholarship son. And, when son #2 gets to college, all he has to do is engage himself in his studies. He could work 20 hours a week and still have plenty of free time compared to the one on athletic scholarship.
- Let your kid do what they love. Let them use their strengths, whether they be athletic or academic, to get into the best possible college they want to attend. I used to think the easiest way to get into college was through sports, now I think is through high test scores, etc. Really, it is through whatever strengths your particular kid has. Their passion and motivation are what get them in.
- If your kid does get recruited, try to learn the ropes from someone who has nothing to gain by whatever decisions your family makes. Follow the NCAA rules throughout the process.
- If you go down the sports scholarship road, enjoy it- it goes fast.
- If you go down the other roads, enjoy it- it goes fast.</p>
<p>“4. Best advice: have a really smart kid who is athletically gifted AND has the right size and body type for his/her sport. That is the easiest way to get into college these days.”</p>
<p>Not sure if you meant this the way I am taking it but it sounds like there is some way that you think can control those two things. Please clarify.</p>
<p>You all who are lucky enough to have multi-talented kids are oversimplifying this decision. In most cases, a student cannot simply achieve academic scholarship credentials, such as a GPA above 4.0 and near perfect SAT scores, by selecting the academic path rather than the athletic one. Not focusing on sports does not a top student make. I would like to point out that both types of achievement–athletic and academic–require hard work AND some God-given ability. If you don’t have the latter, you can study your heart out and not be academic scholarship material, just like you can spend your life practicing sports and still not be recruitable.</p>
<p>PS Let’s not forget that students often have to “settle” in order to get those academic scholarships too. You are most likely to get a scholarship at a school for which you are at the very top of their range. In order words, where you can get the money might not be the best school you get in, where you want to be, or where you should be. For example, I don’t know anyone who has an academic scholarship to an Ivy League school. Oh, and for the poster who kept talking about National Merit. My S was a NMF and never got a dime for his trouble.</p>
<p>Esquette; I understood your post; I just wasn’t clear in my presentation. I was just mentioning for those interested in athletic scholarships, that Division III doesn’t offer athletic scholarships. Division I/II/NAIA do. And from my experience, DIV II/NAIA tend to give less money towards each scholarship. Not always, just many times.</p>
<p>TheGFG; I don’t think anyone is over simplifying the subject. Yes, some are fortunate to have kids that are both academically as well as athletically gifted. Of course that is nice. The emphasis on academics is because anyway you look at it, it is easier to get financial aid/assistance/etc… based on academics than it is with athletics.</p>
<p>If you look at the numbers, only about 3% of HS athletes will go on to play college athletics. And not all of them will get full ride scholarships. Some will be walk-ons. Some will get partial scholarships. If you look at scholarships, merit, grants, and many 3rd party financial aid (Free money from scholarships and such); a much larger percentage of kids will get to college with this money than with athletics. </p>
<p>If you review my post, it suggested GETTING INTO COLLEGE with your academics; and if you can use sports to help pay for it, then that’s great. If parents are reading this thread and they have elementary school kids, they should be concentrating on academics as a means to college. Of course you want the kids to do athletics. Especially if they like it. Colleges want well rounded students. Even 2 identical students applying to Harvard with the exact same GPA and members of the same clubs and volunteering with the same agencies; if competing against each other; one will have a better chance if they also do athletics. It just makes them more well rounded. Same thing applies to extra curriculum and other factors.</p>
<p>Athletics is a great thing for kids. It’s healthy; teaches team work; teaches them how to work hard; UNDOES ALL THE ELEMENTARY SCHOOL garbage of not competing, by teaching the kids how to win as well as lose. Teaches them the real world in that the greatest reward is the one you feel within for your own accomplishments. It also helps you to learn respect for yourself, fellow team mates, and the opposition.</p>
<p>Academics and athletics are both important. Both are difficult. Both take hard work to succeed in. But; if you are going to bet your son/daughter’s entire future on getting a scholarship, then you have a much higher chance of getting an academic scholarship/merit/grant/etc… than you do a full ride athletic scholarship.</p>
<p>P.S. TheGRG; There are a lot of scholarships for Ivy League schools. Just that they don’t come from the schools. There are a lot of private scholarships out there that people don’t look for. My son was offered a PRIVATE full ride scholarship to include tuition, books, lab, dorm, food, monthly stipend, etc… for a very good out of state school. (I admit it wasn’t ivy, but I know similar ones that are for Ivy league schools). These are usually given by alumni, corporations, etc… There’s a lot of money out there. Sorry for those who think that the only money available is from the school via merit scholarships. (There’s also a difference between the school giving MERIT scholarships and a NATIONAL MERIT).</p>
<p>Believer- That was just a little joke! Meant to convey that we have no control over what attributes our kids are born with. Especially their physical build or IQ. And very little control over how hard they choose to work at gettign good grades.
Next poster- EXACTLY. Not everyone has kids who are either elite athletes or good test takers. That is why you go with YOUR child’s strengths. You find their talents and support the development of same. There is a college out there for everyone who wants to go. And, btw, for the above average athlete who is a decent student, there is probably a coach somewhere who wants you to play for him. Might not be for a scholarship, but definitely possible with a little initiative. (Same goes for talents like musical ability, acting, painting, computer skills, the list could go on and on. Colleges want to find students who are a good fit for them.)</p>
<p>It’s even worse when you consider the time commitment required of athletes, scholarship or not (usually at least half of the members of a non-revenue sport do not get <em>any</em> scholarship money).</p>
<p>Take softball as an example. A team will play about 60 games per year. When not competing, they athletes are at mandatory weight training in the morning and practice in the afternoon.</p>
<p>I’m sure it is the same in every sport. A college athlete devotes approx. 30-35 hours per week <em>mandatory</em> with the team. Is your lab scheduled during practice so that you miss an hour of practice on Thursdays? Sorry kid, guess you’ll have to pick another major!</p>
<p>Those 30-35 hours per week during the season (4-5 school months) and 20 hours per week off-season (3-4 school months) knock out any opportunity for a part time job, and more importantly, career related internships and networking.</p>
<p>A student could earn a LOT more money just working part-time than they receive in scholarship money. (of course this is not true of the 2-3 per team on full ride).</p>
<p>Very interesting discussion. My son has completed official visits and now is trying to make a difficult decision (track & field). Final 4 schools all either top 50-100ish in usnews rank overall (range from 20 to 100 in his major). Highest ranked for academics would like him to walkon or possibly small books athletic schol. + small merit scholarship. He was in 75% range for sat/gpa but i’m sure having the athletic hook didn’t hurt - probably would be considered near reach for him. Other schools have a mix of academic merit and athletic scholarships ranging from books to approx 1/2 of full. 2 are private, 2 are state schools - all out of state. Couple small conference, couple big BCS conferences. The most scholarship money is from lowest ranked school (~ 100ish ranked school). He has a list of attributes for each school and is ranking each one- academics, team, location, facilities, coach, cost, gut feel… The coaches have varying degrees of interest ranging from phone call every week to taking forever to reply to email/phone - but all were interested enough for official visit. </p>
<p>We’ve told him to figure out what school he would like to be at if he never did his sport again as some others have posted. And also telling him to be careful about overrating the athletic scholarship piece - for example, if he rates the school high in every other category but they only want him to walk on. Especially in the case where the athletic scholarship is only books (~1k). The initial “prestige” of signing athletic scholarship will wear off fairly soon.</p>
<p>Good news is that he thinks he could be happy at all of them and they aren’t miles apart academically. The hard part is picking the best one since all have pros and cons. Fun times:)</p>
<p>i think it’s worth mentioning that for student athletes who truly are scholar athletes, there are schools that are specifically looking to recruit athletes who do also have very strong academics. scoring well on the psat, nmf or nmsf recognition, top class ranking, and good gpa all can open doors.</p>
<p>I just found this thread and want to say to mam- thank you for your post - it gave me chills (in a good way). I currently have a Div1 athlete who is making an effort to experience friendships outside of the team, including sorority and non-team roommates (to the chagrin and disapproval of her coach), and your post confirms that this may pay off in the long term.</p>
<p>To bessie, based on my experience, this post is spot on! :</p>
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