Successful Psychopaths

<p>Successful psychopaths…they may be living right next to you. Working right next to you. </p>

<p>Psychpaths may be crossing your path many times a day…</p>

<p>And the fascinating thing…these psychopaths don’t know they are psychopaths. :)</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/13/opinion/sunday/fables-of-wealth.html?src=me&ref=general[/url]”>http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/13/opinion/sunday/fables-of-wealth.html?src=me&ref=general&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>“THERE is an ongoing debate in this country about the rich: who they are, what their social role may be, whether they are good or bad. Well, consider the following. A recent study found that 10 percent of people who work on Wall Street are “clinical psychopaths,” exhibiting a lack of interest in and empathy for others and an “unparalleled capacity for lying, fabrication, and manipulation.” (The proportion at large is 1 percent.) Another study concluded that the rich are more likely to lie, cheat and break the law.”</p>

<p>Just another NYT rant.</p>

<p>I agree with Waverly–another NYT rant editorial.</p>

<p>“Another study concluded that the rich are more likely to lie, cheat and break the law.”
^regarding this statement: I don’t agree with it. IMO–addicts are more likely to lie, cheat, and break the law. The financial brackets of addicts are spread across the board from destitute to super rich.</p>

<p>Maybe 10% of everybody are clinical psychopaths. It would explain a lot.</p>

<p>I didn’t know the NYT was this slow. The Guardian ran this story last year.</p>

<p>[One</a> in 25 business leaders may be a psychopath, study finds | Science | guardian.co.uk](<a href=“http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2011/sep/01/psychopath-workplace-jobs-study]One”>One in 25 business leaders may be a psychopath, study finds | Psychology | The Guardian)</p>

<p>Dionysus58…love the link.</p>

<p>With this kind of stuff in the legitimate press, who needs The Onion?</p>

<p>I think the article is true…</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>What an ignorant statement. The author of this piece (William Deresiewicz) is a known, proud anti-intellectual.</p>

<p>I only read the article to see whether there would be any mention of Jamie Dimon (exhibit A).</p>

<p>His name usually comes up on CC through quotations from </p>

<p>[The</a> American Scholar: The Disadvantages of an Elite Education - William Deresiewicz](<a href=“http://theamericanscholar.org/the-disadvantages-of-an-elite-education/]The”>The American Scholar: The Disadvantages of an Elite Education - <a href='https://theamericanscholar.org/author/william-deresiewicz/'>William Deresiewicz</a>)</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>What did he say about psychopaths?</p>

<p>Not sure psychopaths, though having worked in the financial industry now for well over 25 years, there are traits that many share with psychopaths. The old statement “it wasn’t personal, it was business” comes to mind (kind of like Tessio in the Godfather telling Michael why he was involved in the plot against him), there is a lot of rationalizing, there is a lot of dissociation between what they do and the effects of what they do. Whether it was ‘borrowing’ from customer accounts to keep a company afloat (MF Global, others), or brokers calling their customers with ‘hot stocks’ that often were turkeys they were trying to unload from their own or their corporate accounts (especially true when firms underwrote an IPO that was going south), to the chicanery of cooking the books of a company to boost the stock price, or executives slashing payroll of successful companies, putting thousands out of work, to boost their own compensation (since most of it comes from stock price) and so forth. </p>

<p>As far as business schools, the real problem isn’t what they teach as much as what they don’t teach. The basics of business school are relatively innocuous, they teach about accounting and finance and how to analyze the financial health of a company and on decisions of whether it is better to expand capacity or get more out of existing capacity, etc, it is in operational efficiency, on building markets, organizational structures, you name it. The real problem is very little is spent analyzing what we used to call stakeholder management, of the consequences of actions, of the consequences of decisions that stretch beyond the bottom line, of the next quarter, or putting ‘shareholder’ interests above that of the company itself (for example, putting in short term things that make stock analysts go gaga, usually cutting costs, that cause the stock price to jump, that may be undermining the company). Things like ethics get short shrift, since the big business schools know that won’t sell their graduates to corporate,inc, or things like social responsibility. Last I checked, they had a lot more work on ‘branding’ a company, of ‘projecting’ an image, basically pr, then on the ethics and responsibility of business. </p>

<p>Not to say they don’t have gems, I read a piece by some schmuck in the Harvard Business review that stands out who basically argued that insider trading should be legal, how it was all about ‘the game’ and so forth (couldn’t figure out if the guy was some game theory analyst playing with a theoretical proposition, or someone with their ethics chip turned off), how insider deals and manipulations and stuff are actually good for companies …</p>

<p>And you can see some of it in the current headlines. JP Morgan chase just took a 2 billion dollar hit in derivatives trading (they basically bet the wrong way on credit default swaps they sold), this only 4 years after the financial world melted down over similar things, and what is coming out is senior management and risk managers basically ignored a slew of red flags to allow this trading to go on…last I checked, between the trading losses and the hit to their stock, they have lost 20 billion dollars in value. Yet Jamie Dimon has been particularly vocal that the Volcker rule, which would stop banks from doing this kind of prop trading, wasn’t necessary, that banks were aware of their responsibilities and how vulnerable they could be if risk measures weren’t followed and so forth, and that they were ‘good stewards’ of the economy and would no longer put commercial lending at risk from such trading…</p>

<p>I suspect the wording would be better served to say that the culture tends to reward those whose behaviior is more aligned towards the psychopathic end of things, that is probably closer to the truth.</p>

<p>did you post that link before dstark? I remember you on this subject before.</p>

<p>What about unsuccesful psychopaths???</p>

<p>Now those guys are pretty scarey, too, imho.</p>

<p>“What an ignorant statement. The author of this piece (William Deresiewicz) is a known, proud anti-intellectual.”</p>

<p>I think it would probably be better, in the context of what we are talking about, to call it anti elitist in the true sense of the world, not the Sarah Palin version that anyone who can understand 4 syllable words and has an education is an ‘elitist’,.but rather people who truly think they are above everyone else, and when it comes to traders and investment bankers and high flying financial executives, that is often very true. </p>

<p>I think part of what the author was referring to is the anti intellectualism involved in elite institutions like the ivies, where the whole purpose of going there seems to be as a training ground to become an investment banker or founder of a hedge fund and the like rather then being a place to become an intellectual, to learn for the pleasure of learning and so forth, rather the attitude is you go to an ivy so you can be accepted into the gilded set of high flying lawyers, doctors and business leaders, it is that attitude I think he is railing against, that instead of our best and brightest (as supposedly these schools get) focusing on trying to make the world a better place, they are focused on self interest and greed…I am not saying that is true per see (though if you look at the percentages and what they are majoring in/heading towards in the ivies, it is not a small percentage), just saying what he means. An intellectual is supposedly someone who wants to lead the life of the mind, that isn’t an investment banker or someone who wants to be a COO/CEO generally. </p>

<p>Intellectuals, the kind who do ‘lead a life of the mind’, generally tend to be as critical of the excesses of wall street, of corporate greed and mishandling of the economy, as the author is.</p>

<p>Poetgrl…the link was from the NY Times this week. </p>

<p>I have discussed this issue before.</p>

<p>@musicprnt - I am aware of the excesses of Wall Street, that’s why I brought up Jamie Dimon. However the author does not make the fine distinction you do; he has an ax to grind.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>So does everyone else in the world.</p>

<p>I’ve worked for 40 years, and have worked in corporate America for 30 years, and there are many many psychopaths in business who don’t necessarily work on Wall Street. My last boss, for example, who delighted in tearing people down in front of others, and who saw every question as a challenge to her authority.</p>

<p>She was only one of many I’ve encountered. They exist big-time in business, and they can be very very successful. They view everything as a zero sum game. “If you succeed, then you’ve taken something away from me.” So, in their minds, no one else can have any kind of success whatsoever, unless they have given it.</p>

<p>And here I thought you guys are conversing about the new Sherlock Holmes.
But he doesn’t call himself a psychopath, he calls himself a sociopath…;)</p>

<p>Love it. Thanks, Dstark. Thank goodness we have intrepid “researchers” doing this very important “research.”</p>

<p>Sewhappy, Actually…it is pretty important.</p>

<p>How do you like musicprnt’s posts?</p>