Summer Melt - Making the wrong college decision?

Colleges & Universities Princeton University
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<p>I have recently been freaking out, wondering if I made the wrong college choice. I was admitted to Princeton and Harvard and although I have so grateful, I’m now second guessing my decision. I have always planned to study engineering, especially aerospace, so Princeton was my top choice for quite a few months. But then I visited Harvard the week before May 1st, and I loved the social atmosphere and the people there. </p>

<p>Basically, I chose Harvard because I’m not entirely sure that I want to study technical engineering. For getting a job at technology companies in the future, I felt that I wouldn’t be at a disadvantage if I chose Harvard, and I felt that Harvard offered more opportunity to explore my options outside of engineering. </p>

<p>If I plan to still study engineering, will do you think I made a wrong decision choosing Harvard? Will it have serious consequences on my job outlook for the future?</p>

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<p>No. Don’t worry at all about this. Harvard is a fantastic place and I’m sure you’ll have a great time. You can also do summer internships to help you with getting jobs in the future as well. </p>

<p>I don’t think anybody would say you made the “wrong” choice. Both were fantastic options and you chose the one you felt more comfortable with–good for you!</p>

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<p>I think it’s normal to question your choice when you have great options. My son was in the same situation two years ago. He had hoped to attend Princeton because he wanted to major in Engineering but also have access to an exceptional liberal arts experience. When he was accepted to Princeton, Harvard and Yale, all such amazing choices, he started to question what he should do. He revisited each, and although he enjoyed Visitas at Harvard (he didn’t get a good feeling at Yale, in part due to the Policeforce holding a protest outside of the admitted students/parents event held in an auditorium in New Haven about the violent crime statistics and wanting higher pay) Princeton felt right to him. Once he made the decision, he’s never regretted it and loves Princeton even more than he thought he would. He decided after his freshman year to switch from MAE to ORFE due to the amazing economics classes he took his freshman year. The point is that if Harvard is what felt right to you, you made the right decision. If by chance you think you made a hasty decision, I know of a student who changed her mind early in the summer last year, called the Ivy school they had initially turned down and were allowed to enroll. Hope this helps.</p>

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<p>If you have misgivings, try calling the Princeton admissions office. They’ll definitely help you to reconsider your decision and switch back to Princeton.</p>

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<p>While there are myriad reasons to choose Princeton over Harvard :), I think this thread should be focusing on your actual question: * If I plan to still study engineering, will do you think I made a wrong decision choosing Harvard? Will it have serious consequences on my job outlook for the future? *</p>

<p>The answer? Not at all!</p>

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<p>Not sure that I entirely agree with glassarechic on the engineering front. It really depends on what type of engineering you plan to study. While both Harvard and Yale have attempted to strengthen their engineering programs over the past ten years, they are no where near the level, both in professors and classes offered, as most of the engineering programs offered at Princeton. If he is interested in Computer Science, Harvard has an excellent program, but Harvard literally didn’t offer an MAE degree as of two years ago. I haven’t researched if that has changed since then.</p>

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<p>Any other opinions??</p>

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<p>Are you STILL on the fence? I think it’s time to let go of the indecision…</p>

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<p>^ Seriously.</p>

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<p>Let me ask you a very honest question…did you truly have “space” and “time” to go through a list of pros and cons in your “own” mind NOT influenced/tainted by your parents, friends or acquaintances?</p>

<p>Were YOU allowed to make the final choice between your school choices without undue pressure from “outside” influences? </p>

<p>…for you to be still wavering like this going into August tells me you are not HAPPY with your decision…</p>

<p>…I know what you are going through…since my children had to make tough choices as well…</p>

<p>…as parents, we gave our children room, space, time, with list of pros and cons for all the schools involved to discover where they would be the happiest…and not to be concerned about what “we” thought since we were not the ones “attending” school…they were…</p>

<p>…if you truly did your DUE DILIGENCE in examining both schools independently…free of bias…from certain forces telling you “should” go to a certain school for its “name”…then you made the right choice…</p>

<p>…BUT, if you feel, even today that you did not have this opportunity…to go through this checks and balances…on your own “TERMS”…you may feel “cheated” and therefore still “regret” your decision…unfortunately…</p>

<p>…I feel for you…nevertheless, it is time to move on…best of wishes!</p>

<p>N.B. I hope that future students and parents reading this will learn from this OP’s situation…and prevent this from happening to your child…</p>

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<p>Holy crap dude. Princeton will be a better fit for engineering. Take a look at this thread: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/princeton-university/1526415-why-princeton-engineering.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/princeton-university/1526415-why-princeton-engineering.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Regarding this: "I loved the social atmosphere and the people there. "</p>

<p>There’s a reason Harvard’s yield went up when Veritas was cancelled. The social atmosphere isn’t that great…perhaps you had a rare good experience for a couple of days but you might not have that great of a time for four years. If you’re a guy: my guy friends who go there say that freshman year social life sucks especially hard.
People generally don’t choose Harvard because of its nice people…</p>

<p>Princeton, on the other hand, has a great social atmosphere.</p>

<p>If you pick Princeton and for some really, really strange reason dislike it you can always transfer to Harvard. You can’t transfer into Princeton.</p>

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<p>With all due respect BiologyMaster64, I don’t think anyone would be wise to listen to any of your advices, since they are grossly biased.</p>

<p>Harvard’s yield has been going up almost every single year for the past couple of decades or so. Saying that it went up this year because Visitas was cancelled is misleading and downright ridiculous.</p>

<p>Other than that, I would say to OP that both Princeton and Harvard are great, you can’t make a wrong choice. Neither Harvard nor Princeton will ever limit your jobs prospect. This, in my opinion, is the most realistic advice you could get. Bashing Harvard to make Princeton look better is very childish, and doesn’t have the effect you think it has.</p>

<p>Good luck to the OP!</p>

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<p>@OP and Yab123</p>

<p>Considering OP is still working himself up over this decision in late July, I think he needs a definitive answer. Instead of trying to counter my arguments with vague statements and ad hominem attacks maybe you could offer some actual advice. </p>

<p>FYI, asking a X college vs. Y college question in X college’s forum MIGHT JUST invite bias into the argument. Take a look at the advice given in a college’s specific forum. Why don’t you consider how such a question would go over in Harvard’s forum? In Yale’s? In UCLA’s?</p>

<p>There are no hard and fast stats on Harvard’s social life but several of the things I noted in my post are a problem. Plus you could always read the Crimson to see how “fun events” like Harvard’s spring music event are usually poorly received.</p>

<p>Plus you never addressed engineering…Harvard doesn’t care too much about Engineering and Applied Sciences. Apparently they didn’t even have an MAE major until a couple years ago. They’re not terribly well-regarded in engineering either. Compare this with Princeton, a school that takes great pride in its student’s strength in science and engineering and has the stats to show it.</p>

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<p>Princeton is objectively better for engineering…</p>

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<p>@BiologyMaster64: I agree that some bias is expected and even encouraged. But there is a huge difference between being biased and being misleading.</p>

<p>It’s funny how you were selective in replying to my comment. I don’t mind you comparing one program to another objectively. But saying things like the yield went up because Visitas was cancelled IS misleading. </p>

<p>“Harvard doesn’t care too much about Engineering and Applied Sciences.” </p>

<p>Again, how did you get to that conclusion? are you familiar with Harvard’s current resources available to SEAS students? what, exactly, gives you the right to make such an arbitrary, baseless statement?</p>

<p>I might be paraphrasing here, but I’ve even seen you say things like “Yale is weak in the sciences.” What in the world are you talking about? Yale is not considered weak in the sciences by any measure. These types of assumptions can discredit your comments and arguments, even if you offer some valid points.</p>

<p>OP’s only concern with Harvard that it might limit his job prospects. Fortunately, almost everyone has assured OP that this isn’t the case at all. Neither Harvard nor Princeton would look bad in almost any field or discipline.</p>

<p>I’m sorry if I’m coming a little hard on you. But please try to understand where I’m coming from. I’m sure a lot of people would appreciate your input, but saying things without merit won’t help them in making their decisions, and might actually hurt them.</p>

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<p>“It’s funny how you were selective in replying to my comment.”</p>

<p>I’m just going to go ahead and end this conversation. I don’t like talking to massive hypocrites who ignore salient points in two of my posts then complain about me picking and choosing what to reply to.</p>

<p>TO OP: Here’s a pretty old article on Harvard engineering. Obviously it’s biased towards Harvard and the interviewer/interviewees make a lot of noise about how Harvard’s engineering is up and coming. If you’re serious about this do some research on your own but the claims they make for the future in this article…haven’t really been realized.</p>

<p>From the Crimson: “Harvard’s graduate engineering program ranks only 26th in the country… Competitors say the program’s small size and budget prevent it from measuring up to the standard of larger schools like MIT.”</p>

<p>" ‘At a very small school you’re not going to have the infrastructure you need to do modern engineering.’ …according to John C. Brauman, senior associate dean for student affairs at Stanford.</p>

<p>“In fact, professors in the Harvard department are on a tight budget. Several of the engineering faculty members’ positions are not fully endowed.”</p>

<p>“We need to have more appointments,” Dean of the Division of Applied Sciences Paul C. Martin says. "Some of our courses are taught by people who are here in positions that are not fully funded.</p>

<p>"Where top-ranked MIT’s research budget for 1993 was about 150 million. Harvard’s was approximately $22 million, according to the survey.</p>

<p>Professors say they sometimes face a lack of resources in the department."</p>

<p>“A lot of us have chosen to do the things we do because of the lack of facilities that you would normally have,” says Rogers, who works with models and computers rather than in an actual lab.</p>

<p>The head of the biological engineering courses “has a continual struggle to keep his labs up-to-date” because to be up-to-date, he must work with “outrageously expensive equipment,” Rogers says.</p>

<p>The department also doesn’t have the money to fund a large number of technicians “so grad students have to do a technician’s job and that’s hard,” according to Rogers.</p>

<p>“For instance, one student who was working to figure out alternative fuel uses in rural settings had no lab with proper venting in which to do his research and had to test his work in the winter snow.”</p>

<p>Martin says the lack of good lab space hurts Harvard in faculty searches.</p>

<p>“We’re in the process of trying to clear out books from the attic” to use the space for labs, the dean says. “People are working in subbasements.”</p>

<p>Compared to many top programs, Harvard’s faculty is also incredibly small. There are just 27 professors in Harvard engineering sciences and applied physics, compared to about 100 at Princeton, approximately 200 at Stanford and far more at technological institutes like MIT.</p>

<p>“The type of research [students at a smaller department] have been exposed to will span a narrower range than someone at MIT or Stanford or the larger engineering schools,” Brauman says.</p>

<p>Students and professors at Harvard say they know their program is not seen as comparable to larger schools like MIT or UC Berkeley.</p>

<p>“It’s smaller,” Martin says. “As a result of the fact that it is smaller it gets less recognition.”</p>

<p>Students say they are sometimes put on the defensive in describing Harvard engineering.</p>

<p>“A lot of businesses don’t take Harvard engineering that seriously,” Schivell says. “It has a Harvard name but that doesn’t carry as much weight” in the technical fields.</p>

<p>When concentrator Wan-Yin Wu '97 talks about Harvard engineering with friends at MIT, they often say, “Oh Harvard, that’s right, they do have an engineering department,” she says.
[Harvard</a> Engineer Division On Rise | News | The Harvard Crimson](<a href=“http://www.thecrimson.com/article/1994/12/12/harvard-engineer-division-on-rise-pin/]Harvard”>Harvard Engineer Division On Rise | News | The Harvard Crimson)</p>

<p>For the genius who notices that I’m not copy-pasting the entire article: It’s called trying to make an argument.</p>

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<p>That’s perfectly fine by me. Good luck in Princeton; I hope you have a great time there, and more importantly a great successful life. I’m sure you’ll do.</p>

<p>I will end this by still saying once again that I hope you part away from misleading statements and articles that were written almost two decades ago. </p>

<p>I rest my case.</p>

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<p>BiologyMaster64 I can’t resist jumping in here because you’re the same person who argues things for the sake of argument without having any relevant basis for some of conclusions you draw. Like when you said the weather in Princeton was “mild” because it’s one of the Southern most Ivies (What? Why does this matter?) and then tried to lambast me because I told the girl from Korea that the weather in the summer and winter was actually “fairly extreme” in answer to her question. You proceeded to lecture me that all weather questions are relative (news to me) and that NJ weather was milder than New England, all of the Midwest, and the Pacific Northwest (very wrong my friend). I held my tongue through your arrogance but son, I have been in all fifty States and travel regularly to major cities throughout the US. In addition, I have lived on four continents so I know a thing or two about weather variation.</p>

<p>I hope you were in Princeton last week enjoying the 100 degree days (107 heat index) and were there six months ago when the wind chill got in the single digits. If a 90 degree plus temperature swing isn’t “fairly extreme” then I don’t know what is but I’m sure you do.</p>

<p>i think your either dated or anecdotal arguments about Princeton vs. Harvard’s social scene and commitment to engineering are ridiculous (you fail to even mention that Harvard is moving all of it’s engineering to a new location with brand new state-of-the-art facilities in the next few years). I’m glad you love all things about Princeton and everything is ideal there (including the weather) but a lot of us have had actual experience at multiple Ivies and there are definitely pluses and minuses associated with each one. People who love the social scene at Harvard and being in Cambridge (next to MIT) and near Boston (arguably the best college town in the US) might not necessarily enjoy being in the idyllic but campus-centric Princeton setting.</p>

<p>The point is we don’t actually know which college suits the OP best. It comes down to a personal choice that he needs to make and live with. It’s fine to lend your opinion but you are not the authority you like to think you are.</p>

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<p>Oh, and your yield going up comment because Visitas was cancelled was another example of “genius” to use your own phrase from above. Absolutely, no data out there to support a wild claim like that. One could argue that yield might have been even higher had students actually gotten a chance to visit the school (it has been on an upward trend with past Visitas events). Also, what about anyone who might have been dissuaded from going because of the terrorist bombings and shootings (would the yield have been even higher without the attacks)?</p>

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<p>BiologyMaster-- how old are you? Do/did you attend Harvard? I’m going to say no. Well, I’m actually a student.</p>

<p>Harvard actually has a School of Engineering and Applied Sciences, and the above poster is correct in that SEAS will be moved to a brand new location (by 2017) with state of the art facilities. Engineering and applied sciences have been around at Harvard science the 70s. If you bothered looking at the SEAS website you would know that, since they have a timeline in the history section. And SEAS is a graduate school, meaning the undergrad EAS majors are through that school, even though all undergrads are enrolled in the College (all other undergrad majors are through the Faculty of Arts and Sciences, different from the Graduate School of Arts and Sciences). </p>

<p>Yield went up after Visitas was cancelled because hundreds of students called, skyped, Facebooked, tweeted, and made videos for the accepted students. The prefrosh loved how much we all appreciate our school and took the time to reach out to them. THAT’S why the yield went up (besides Harvard offering record financial aid again). </p>

<p>“Social scene” and how you feel on the campus are very important. When I visited, I could see myself here. </p>

<p>OP-you can PM me about any concerns. Your interests may change. I came in as engineering, decided I didn’t want to do it, looked at math, stats, and now a different concentration. Princeton’s engineering program is better than Harvard’s. You can cross-register at MIT. You’re still going to a top school in the country and world.</p>