<p>Our son is finally making the big move to his own apartment tomorrow! It has been a long, sometimes trying 24 years. He has done all those things – littered his room with beer cans (as well as Jack Daniels bottles, sigh), stayed out all hours, missed classes (but not jobs). Texting is great but not regularly, only if he spends the night at his girlfriend’s (more than that and they start forgetting). I’ve seen gradual maturing these last 3 years: he goes out less and drinks less, helps out without being asked, works more, especially since he was saving for his apartment. Still, he won’t really be an adult until he moves out. We did systematically make it less comfortable for him – quit making dinner nightly, had bare cupboards, absolutely no laundry service. (He still raids my husband’s sock drawer though!) I’ll miss him, but it will be a huge relief to let him live his own life and make his own mistakes without my knowing all about them.</p>
<p>It has started here too. DH and I were already asleep last night when the phone rang (don’t you hate that?). It was S2 (18 yr. old freshman) saying his 2 classes had been cancelled today and that he and two friends were at that moment driving down the interstate headed home. It’s a four hour drive and it was pouring rain. It was almost 11:00. Thankfully they were already over halfway when he called. I’m sure he did that on purpose so I couldn’t protest them driving home late at night in bad weather. </p>
<p>So I lay in bed gritting my teeth and worrying until I heard the front door open and hour and half later. </p>
<p>S1(21 yr. old senior) is expected here at some point but has yet to let us know when. It’s annoying but I have made up my mind not to call and ask. I’m pretty sure it will be sometime today but when?</p>
<p>Both of mine are the stay out til all hours kind too. S1’s visits over his college years have gotten me somewhat conditioned to the facts… that they are really not going to spend a lot time sitting around with us, their social life is just starting when I’m putting my pajamas on, meals with parents are OK but meals with friends are more fun (S2 did not eat a single meal with us over Fall Break…eating Pop-Tarts when he woke up at 12:00 doesn’t count). </p>
<p>I will say they are pretty good about calling if they are going to stay at a friend’s for the night. We have used the text system too but not for multiple “check ins”. If they are out with friends and decide they are not coming home but it is too late to call (since us old people are in bed), they send a text so if I wake up and they are not here I can check my phone to know they are OK.</p>
<p>Allow me to offer a different opinion. No men that I know of go to their parents’ houses, eat the food, come in and out at all hours, etc., despite the wishes of the parent/family. Particularly if the parents are supporting the person. Nope. No men I know. These 2 are not men. They are over 18, they are fully grown, but they are not men. They are still in the transition stage- not a child, but certainly not men either. Men I know have responsibilities and meet them- that’s part of being a man.
If these 2 wish to be considered men they need to support themselves. In the event they cannot yet, and still wish support from Mommy and Daddy then they need to abide by Mommy’s rules ans wishes, until they are men- and when supporting themselves, then they make their own rules. If they think its ok to sleep all day, or be out all night, or come and go as they please like they lived in a hotel, well, are they paying hotel rates?</p>
<p>Our S(now a college Sr.) was clear at 17 3/4 that from 18 on, everything we did for him was a gift. It was no longer an obligation. We have and still are giving to him in many ways- we want to. But S is in the position that if his behavior causes us to no longer want to give a gift then we don’t have to. He understands and is very helpful here when he comes back from college.</p>
<p>I am definitely not excusing their behavior and would impose some of the rules mentioned earlier. We have done that with our DS when he is home…for instance, call if you won’t be home for meals, let someone know when you might be back if you go out, etc.
But don’t forget that they are on vacation when they are at your house. They aren’t high schoolers who are working at high school and expected to help in the daily household routines. You are still in your regular, working life. They are on a short vacation from their “work” at college.
I find as mine gets older there really is little for him to do in his old hometown. He goes to the gym on my guest passes, he will go to the market for me, he watches tv, plays video games, goes for a run, eats, sleeps.<br>
It is a bit of a vacation but without much to do. The big draw is food and sleeping with more privacy than at school.</p>
<p>Our daughter let’s us know what she is doing when she is home. We expect her to help out with housework and driving her sister around. She has no curfew, but she texts when she is going to be late. I miss her a lot when she is away, so she makes a point having dinner with the family before she goes out. </p>
<p>I do agree with some posts here that if they want to come and go as they please they could stay in a hotel.</p>
<p>Agatha Christie wrote in one of her books that there are only six happy days in a Mother’s life…when the children come home from school and when they go back. (Of course, she was English…ours come home and leave more often than that). </p>
<p>My d’s on her way home now and I’m thrilled. But she’ll drive me crazy at some point over the next week… c’est la vie. I’ll still cry when she leaves, though! Fortunately, the gap between T’day break and Xmas break is only about 17 days!</p>
<p>This thread is making me feel so much better. I felt guilty that I wasn’t disappointed that WildChild wasn’t coming home. He DOES have some friends here in our hometown, even though we have only been here a couple of years (these friends are from college or former boarding schools) and they do the out all night-thing. I am relieved that it isn’t just my over the top kid who does this.</p>
<p>I guess I’ll count my blessings that neither of my kids have the physical stamina to do all-night-out events. If they may be approaching something like that, D will attend a sleepover instead & return home the next day pretty exhausted. They eat most of their meals with us…S gets more helpful each time he comes home but he’s still directionally challenged so I get info from him while I’m giving him directions to where he’s headed. 
I’m amused that he wants to drive in LA when he’s still getting lost in our small island.</p>
<p>They are not boys, but they are not men in the mature sense. So TALK. Talk things out. Set the usual ground rules for when they are hone and what is expeccted if the lodging and meals are free. I think that it is reasonable that when they are inside your home, that your wishes regarding alcohol are honored.</p>
<p>That said, I think that when they are out, they are out and they decide what they do and don’t do. And I think at that age, that they get to come and go on their time. Curfews are not so appropriate. And if they are gome at 3am, you just have to let it go. If your son misses an interview, its his problem and his responsibility. Ask that they give you an idea when they will be back and where they are going. And let them go. They are up all hours at school, with no one checking in on them. You will just have to try to sleep. If they call to update, thank them. If they call because they are lost, help them out. But I think that when they are in the house, they have to live the rules. And when they go out, it is their rules, with your simply asking that they speak up before they go, and be curtious about keeping you somewhat in the loop. </p>
<p>My opinion. This will keep them coming to visit. Otherwise if you make it too restrictive you won’t see them come back.</p>
<p>younghoss, you are right and I admire your position but it’s a hard one to maintain for us mere mortals. They are used to the (false) autonomy of college life where they come and go as they please and this gives them the equally false impression that they are grown-ups, but of course we true adults know better. It’s a prolonged adolescence, for sure. Which we’re paying for. However, it sure paves the way for an unsentimental wave goodbye as they load up the truck for the final move. (And right now, I’m grateful for that.)</p>
<p>Ahaaaaahhhh!!! The Incas are still here!!! He ,he , he… </p>
<p>Captofthehouse; Vampires, very good, I like that. Sucking the blood, very good, yes that’s what they do to me.<br>
Marite: yes, that you. I have visons of you with a book in hand enjoying the leaves, last gasps on the park bench before snow arrives? We have a good crowd of neighborhood kids who gave up our city for Boston area. Not mine, but local kids, parents sold the house. Having a little ajustment problem with that, you know, the departure of many. SO, WHAT 'S GREAT about Boston anyway???Duh???</p>
<p>Anyway, today is better due to sleeping well last nigh. </p>
<p>Worry, worry. My life is about worry.</p>
<p>BHG:</p>
<p>Good to know you had a good night’s sleep! Life always seems easier when one is not sleep-deprived.
Right now, I don’t know why I like the Boston area quite so much. It was freezing over the weekend, warmed up a bit yesterday, then today, it’s been raining cats and dogs. Wet leaves are covering our lawn instead of staying on trees for us to enjoy their sight. :(</p>
<p>Good to see you, too, Backhandgrip. It’s nice to see folks from so long ago. Was it really 5 or 6 years ago already?</p>
<p>I’m not sure what you mean Bela,(post 30) that you like my position, but it’s difficult for mere mortals. I would like a clarification of how my position is difficult for mere mortals. Is it implying somehow I am above mortals- or that I think I am? I’m not sure I like the implication. True, I often have a different perspective than some her. True, I am often bold enough to politely disagree with many as I did on this thread. But not true that I think of myself as any better or any smarter than those here.</p>
<p>younghoss - for what’s worth, I am with you.</p>
<p>Thanx Oldfort.</p>
<p>I cannot fully agree they are on vacation. The logic would continue that if I am paying for all or part of his college, then I could be thought of as his employer. Yes, I fully agree doing well in college is my S’s main job now. I have no problem with his coming home on breaks. In fact, I like it.
But I work a full-time job too, so does my wife. We like vacations. I cannot even imagine the wife and I taking off the same week, then going to my parents home, or my boss’ home and requiring them to feed, wash our clothes, cook, etc., for us while we slept all day and/or came and went as we pleased despite their wishes.
The student that calls himself a man may want to think of it as a vacation, but they cannot automatically think my wife or I are obligated to pick up the tab for their vacation- whether seen as extra cost or our extra labor- for free.</p>
<p>One thing wife and I feel we did right, while s was growing up- we never used the phrase “…when you’re 18”, or “not until you’re 18” or “…under our roof” or similar phrases. We deliberately substituted “…when you’re a self supporting adult” or “when you can make your own rules”. We see a clear distinction there(not specifying an age) and wanted to avoid a child of 18 or 19 saying “I’m a man now at 18, I can do it!”, then having us respond “not in my house.” We thought that might be seen as changing the rules on our S and we thought that would be unfair of us. Growing up, S got a clear idea of making one’s own rules goes hand in hand with supporting oneself. And, the date on his birth certificate was only a small part of how we defined “being a man”. He knows we feel if Mommy and Daddy are paying your bills, you’re not yet a man- even if he was 35! We wanted S to be clear that obligations come with being a man, not just privileges.</p>
<p>I like that phrase a lot, younghoss (“when you are a self-supporting adult…”). It incorporates a lot of value/positive expectation into a short statement. I’ll remember it for my son…</p>
<p>Good advice younghoss. We made the mistake of using the “When you are 18…” phrase a few times. I remember the day after my oldest son turned 18, he called me and said “remember when you said when I turn 18 I could pierce my eyebrow?”…</p>
<p>I agree about the texting but it is usually me texting them in the middle of the night and hoping I get a response so I can sleep.
“transcript” from a text conversation with my youngest when he was home for the weekend:
Nov 9, 4:27 am
me: Where are you
s: Oh Im at Jordans Ill be home in the morning
me: It is the morning</p>
<p>So far, we have not had the kids whereabouts unknown until all hours yet & hope not to. My kids get pretty tired & like their sleeping time so generally are home and on their computers or in bed before I fall asleep. I know I have a hard time sleeping until everyone’s at least physically home or sleeping over at a home where I know the family.</p>
<p>I never said anything about “when you’re 18” as the issue never has arisen & now they’re 19 & 21 anyway. How time does fly! I remember thinking when they were born that 2009 seemed so infinitely far away–guess it no longer is.</p>