Part of the reason Carleton is intense is it’s on trimesters. The courses move fast there. Trimesters are another criterion that may be appealing, or not appealing, to the student compared to semesters.
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Have you looked at Union? They have some ABET accredited engineering majors. I can’t say for sure but believe it will be a different feel from Bucknell, etc.
The big NMF schools - and there are more than these -
Tulsa - with NMSF you get a full ride. It’s a small school but not an LAC.
Alabama (5 years tuition, 4 years housing and a stipend), UTD, Maine, some of the Florida Schools and more - are aggressive. UAH is aggressive too - just based on auto merit for a smaller, more STEM focused school
Then some have possible scholarships - USC, BU, Fordham, etc.
It’s not to say it’s right for your family. If it’s not - then don’t look at it. Of course, first you need to get the score, etc.
Best of luck.
Colleges with Great Scholarships for National Merit Finalists - College Kickstart
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YES! Union sounds like a great match for this young man. And saving tons and tons of money, if he makes NMF, at some of the schools that reward NMF, would be wonderful.
We don’t know if OP’s kid is likely to be NMSF, do we?
As for Union, I would put in the same group, vibe wise as Bucknell. Sporty and affluent. A bit less of a Greek presence, but it’s still noticeable.
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Stanford is on the quarter system and definitely felt intense. I think the kid could handle it, especially if there are fewer courses per quarter than the usual 4-5 – but at this point I’m speculating. I’m putting a lot of stock in the comparative value of campus visits. He thinks he likes snow. We’ll see… (mwahahaha)
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If he’s not engineering, then your list is great. You mentioned the possibility. That’s all I was just noting a 3-2 has lots of costs, both monetary and social so if engineering is potentially on the table, it might be best to go to a school with four year engineering in my opinion.
You mentioned Bates. If it was the top choice, you can ED. Merit isn’t an issue.
314/657 got in. Yes that will include athletes and other hooked. But still a high percentage. They also have a low test submission rate which bodes well for your son. So I’d think ED the odds would be strong.
But remove the ED from the overall numbers, then yes it’s a tough get.
If he loves it great but it sounds like you’ve not been to LACs yet. Not sure I’d put it above your list per se but sounds like fit will be particular for your student so let’s hope some on your list fits or some are such bad fits that it directs him to other sizes, environments and geographies that fit better. That’s actually pretty common I think.
Ps I think Lehigh is known for drinking but I’m a believer is kids can find their crowd most anywhere. Sorry your niece’s experience hasn’t been good for her. I’d find it hard to believe the entire school is that way.
One other thought - a student did a write up on Connecticut yesterday that might interest you.
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That’s true, but it should be noted that a typical course load at Carleton is three classes, not the four that is more common at semester schools. If a student prefers at a particular point in time to focus on fewer things but spend more time on each, their approach might be a better match. If however the student prefers juggling more classes but each goes a little more slowly, a traditional semester system might be better. Some students have no preference, but there are some whose learning style more easily fits one approach or the other.
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Was thinking the same thing.
Union has partying but is less preppy. It’s less under the spell of New England and more culturally NY. It could be worth a look. I’ve known kids who were a bit quirky who were really happy there. And their schedule is very good for a kid with ADHD.
OP, your descriptions of why Trinity would not be a fit is really helpful.
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Update: PSAT scores came back and were solid (720 R&W/760 M) but probably a point or two shy of NMSF for California. So that won’t be a decision factor for us.
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Think that might just make the cutoff in CA, actually.
My sense is that your list is well thought-out, but perhaps not “ambitious” enough. Your son will be competitive at a number of more “competitive” LACs, particularly with the ED boost – Grinnell comes to mind, but others as well – these schools offer. With strong essays and those stats, the ECs won’t matter as much at any but the top tier, or so I would think?
I think part of the point is the OP’s kid does not necessarily want to go to the most competitive college that will admit him.
Updated with a question: among Bates, Wesleyan, and Vassar, is one of these obviously more/less "reachy"for a male ED candidate than the others? I’m planning a spring road trip. Bates is pretty far out of the way but I’m keen to take our son to see it…unless there’s no point.
Also – I know people have said that College Vine’s chancing tool is useless but I’m wondering at which point a reach becomes pointless. If one has a hypothetical 20% chance, is that too much of a roll of the dice? Would one be better off spending an ED slot on a school where the chance of getting in is much higher? (e.g. Kenyon, Denison, Oberlin, Occidental – all schools that seem to favor ED applicants and schools that are listed as targets for my son but might be much harder to get into RA)?
Sorry if this question doesn’t make much sense.
I would definitely check out Bates - strong sense of community, great kids, strong academics. It’s worth the trip.
Of your first 3, I suspect that Vassar would be easiest for a male, but I also suspect that one of them may rise to the top when you visit and that if that happens, that should be the ED1 school. While all of them attract students of a certain type, the vibe at each is different. And yes, check out Bates. Probably the most mainstream of those 3 but a really special place. (Plus… Maine!)
You can also look at who in your next group has ED2 if you’re feeling panicked at that point.
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Completely agree. Of course if you are not in the competitive range for a college, you should consider not applying at all. But if you are in the competitive range for a college, but it still has a low admit rate, but it is your clear favorite, and it would be comfortably affordable–go for it!
Just for the record, though, male admit rates from the last CDS cycle (followed by female for comparison):
Bates 510/3757 (13.6%) (627/4516 (13.9%))
Wesleyan 1010/5458 (18.5%) (1086/9063 (12.0%))
Vassar 848/3283 (25.8%) (1281/8129 (15.8%))
I actually didn’t know Bates was so close to gender neutrality. Wesleyan has an imbalance, but then Vassar is crazy different. This is well-known, but the fact they get 2.5 women for every 1 man applying is really amazing.
But this would not make me think, “Oh, a man should obviously ED Vassar even if they prefer Bates and Wesleyan.” Actually, it would make me think if you preferred them, you could ED I at one, maybe then ED II at the other, and then still have a real shot at Vassar in RD anyway.
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I actually don’t think it’s useless – just one of many tools with its own limitations. For a student who doesn’t have many ECs, it might be less helpful, because CV can’t assess the intangible strengths, strength of essay, LORs, etc. It also can’t take into account upward trends in GPA, which an admissions committee usually would notice. But for my D23, I was surprised at how on-the-mark it was. She got into her less reachy reaches (but not the most selective reaches), almost all targets (save one wait list), and all safeties. Of course, we could have predicted the safeties, but many of the so-called targets were based on College Vine chancing, not actual admission percentages (which were more selective), so the CV formula was pretty much spot-on. The only thing that was way off? CV gave her a very strong chance of getting into her ED choice, and she didn’t. But other than that, I was surprised at how accurate the CV chancing tool was (in some cases, it predicted results better than Naviance, which uses fewer variables).
So – grain of salt? Yes. But it could be a helpful tool alongside other tools like Naviance.
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Vassar really just is in its own class. My oldest kid actually had a category on his spreadsheet when he was applying to show which schools gave the biggest admissions advantage to males, and there was nowhere close to Vassar. It was one of his 2 top 20 LAC acceptances, and it didn’t surprise me at all even after a hellish March of waitlists. Need blind? needs boys? yeah, checks out.
Going back to the original post, said oldest kid was similarly high stats with what I’d call solid but unremarkable ECs (piano lessons, some volunteering at the library, some community theater stuff, the occasional math tournament) and it worked out fine for him. LOTS of waitlists like I said, but he ended up with plenty of solid choices (Vassar, Oberlin, Hamilton, St. Olaf, etc) and went to Macalester. Got offered a spot off the waitlist at Emory by the time it was all over, too. I would guess most of his waitlists would have been acceptances had he ED’d, but no way to know for sure of course.
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Bates has a a high ED acceptance.
Per the last CDS, they took 314 of 657. Now, how many were athletes I don’t know. Overall, 282 females and 236 males enrolled. That tells me their ED % of overall is high.
Wesleyan 424 of 1047. They have gender balance - and 743 enrolled - so another very high ED school.
Vassar admitted 363 of 940. 681 enrolled. So another huge ED school. Much higher percentage of men admitted than females.
In the end, it’s not just ease of admission but where you like - which may be these three or may not.
Good luck.
Just keep in mind that RD admits are a multiple of RD enrollees.