Seriously need to stop typing without my glasses… “despite”
Oh the competitive school argument.
Don’t even get me started on separate but equal in terms of education - it’s a lie.
I happen to have attended elementary school in a district party to Brown vs the Board of Education. For those of you who don’t recall that facts of Brown - by the time it reached the supreme court it was 5 cases combined. My district was one of those cases. My state in the 70s instituted a “forced desegregation” to comply with Brown that combined several districts into a massive district. In 6th grade I was bused for about 45 minutes (instead of attending a school a little over 2 miles away) to a city school. Wow the difference. I don’t think it had air conditioning. The windows were kept open. I sometimes had trouble hearing my English teacher over the sound of automobiles being crushed in the junkyard across the river. After getting a band-aid dirty making ceramics in art class - a nurse would not give me a replacement bandaid because the injury did not occur in school.
Imagine taking one of the most competitive, affluent school districts in the state - and combining it with one of the poorest. So suddenly your population was completely mixed in terms of test performance. That is what I experienced. And it was eye opening. The parental support and resources I had and took for granted - were not there for almost 1/2 of my classmates. Their parents did not go to college - or expect them to go to college.
Here is what I think goes on with the “oh if my kid went to a less competitive school argument.” My kids currently attend one of the highest performing districts in Texas. It has 8 high school that all have the same academic options and opportunity. Two are considered “urban” and the gpa for graduates at that school in the top 10% are lower than other schools in the district. So people think “If I went to X school - I would have more opportunity.” They have the same class options, right? But it is not that simple. If you think it is, then move there. But what people do not realize opportunity that you take for granted is not there for others equally. If I want to drop a couple hundred on SAT/ACT prep, I can. But there are many students who don’t have the financial opportunity to take tests more than once. And that is high performing district that is recognized for having some of the best performing 'urban" schools in Texas.
If you look at smaller, rural districts - their class options are just not anywhere near what the “competitive” schools offer.
I am a firm believer that the population and number of highly qualified students in Texas has far outgrown the spaces available at TAMU and UT. Students really should be open to TTU, UH, UTD, UTSA, UTA, UNT, Texas State, etc. And I think they should look at their major at those schools before considering moving out of state.
@nomatter - very thoughtful responses.
I do, however, have to disagree with how much of a role gpa plays in holistic admission. I believe the way the data set is written is misleading and it contradicts itself.
C7 says what you are talking about. But if you go down to C11 - there is no gpa data. It should be there if they collected HS GPA for the admissions decision. Additionally C12 as N/A for average HS GPA and N/A for percent of students who submitted HS GPA.
I believe the conflicting info is due to the fact than only 80-85% of students come from ranking schools. And TAMU has to use the GPA from those students to create a class rank. But for the 83% of students from ranking high school last year - GPA was not a factor in their admissions. And for the 17% of students from non-ranking HS in the 2018-2019 - GPA was a factor in determining rank.
Not sure I am correct - but that is how I interpret the data based on what the prospective student centers tell prospective students and what people on the board report.
@AggieMomhelp and @Thelma2 can probably weigh in more.
I looked back here today to see where everyone was headed to school. Instead, I found a whole thread on how unfair the admissions are and a basic superiority complex by people who think their high schools are simply better than other peoples schools. I feel like all of you who are unhappy with your admission offers need to come to grips with the realization that you are going to be success where ever you land. As an HR manager at a large corporation, I can tell you that while we think A&M is a great school, we hire and pay the same for ALL tier 1 research universities. So go ahead and attend U of H or TTU or head out of state and go to a different tier 1 school. The ranking doesn’t matter to us unless you attend an Ivy or a big 5 business school.
I’m sorry, I shouldn’t have highlighted just 2 of the other tier 1’s. UNT, Baylor, SMU, UTA and UTD will also get you the same starting salary with our multi-national company. I am surprised that people on this thread fail to recognize the other Texas schools as “worthy”. But after reading a few posts about how your high school is “more competitive” thereby making you more worthy, I can see how your vision has been jaded by your own self importance. Do not let that folly lead you to failure. Go out and grow where your seed has been scattered. I understand you are upset that you did not get to attend the school your heart was set on, but it is not the only way to reach your goals. In 4 years you will be in the work force and the Carnegie system is an HR favorite for determining your value.
@AggieMomAgain sorry my comment about the underachievers isn’t that an A/B student is an underachiever… I’m trying to point out that if you tell “johnny” that he could take AP english or on level english and they are weighted the same, then 9 times out of 10, little johnny is going to take the easier path because he’s in high school and taking a class requiring less effort to make a great grade will free him up to do other things. Therefore, he’s not challenging himself because if he’s not going to see an extrinsic benefit, then why bother? Hence… underachieving.
No other hidden meaning or dig… pinky promise! = )
@agforlife while my child was extremely disappointed (tears. LOTS of tears) with the PSA offer she received and really still doesn’t understand that offer in comparison to some others from her school, she has moved on.
She regrouped, toured U of H and loved their Business College (she wants to be a CPA), and loves that they have a 5 year masters program. While I think she still carries a little disappointment, she is excited about what awaits her at U of H and she has heard only good things about the business program and the possiblity of internships here in Houston.
We are not from Houston originally. However, all of her schooling has been here in the area. And I will say, the UT/A&M stuff is really preached to them by many from an early age and, while we tried to let her know they weren’t the end all, I think many of these kids grow up thinking that they are.
My older daughter, who graduated from Univ of Arkansas, said it best to her sister when she told her that college is not the final destination, it’s the just one of the roads you may travel to get you to that destination!
I hope all the kiddos who didn’t get what they hoped for at A&M find their place and have nothing but success!
I am so happy for her! She is going to do great things at U of H and after. I do understand being disappointed about not getting the first choice school. But there is so much out there and in the long run, as I see everyday, your college choice has little to nothing to do with your promotions or hiring. Hard work pays off. A&M is a fantastic school. UT is a fantastic school. In Texas, many people see those as the only choices. However, it shouldn’t be that way because in the hiring process there are MANY line items on a resume we are looking for and hiring to achieve.
@agforlife : The last posting of an admissions offer was on March 19, back on page 378. Since then, several topics have been discussed, various train of thoughts which arose out of comments on this thread. These topics are not actually connected to “Admissions Decisions” category per se, but still related to this thread as part of the “Discussions” category.
Please peruse the pages before 378 to catch up on the various admissions offers received by the families participating on this thread. There are a lot of postings.
I agree that TX is a big state with a lot of great schools and a lot of opportunities.
My daughter got PSA and is sticking with it. Since she has been in a small private school setting most of her life, a smaller and more structured situation suits her best for this first year.
A senator in the state of Texas is introducing a bill that excuses TAMU from the 10% rule exclusively. This admission year was bad for our college prep school. All of our kids do well but even the highest achieving kids had a hard time placing in the school in Texas. Everyone got into the out of state school of course. Kids with 1360s on PSAs at UT and A&M!! Meanwhile Baylor and TCU giving huge scholarships . So crazy!
Good luck to you daughter. She will do great I am sure !
@TMImomof2 what do you mean by ‘excuses TAMU for the 10% rule exclusively’?
Hi all- I’ve been following this thread for awhile, just joined last week and have commented on the PSA thread, but not here. I am a class of '98 grad, BIMS. My husband is '97, socialogy, Coprs Regiment Officer and Marine officer (got out a few years ago.) Our oldest will be a 3rd generation Aggie, with all prior males in the family having been in the Corps and then on to military service. We were SHOCKED (and so was his councelor) when he got his PSA offer. He is top 18% at a VERY competitive high school (and yes it matters. I am science teacher who has taught in many districts and I can tell you the school does matter but that’s a whole different discussion. The op 50% at our high school has an “a” average. Very few kids that are in the top 10% are “well-rounded.” They played the AP game to get class rank and did nothing but school work. No band, sports, etc.) Back to my son’s stats: 1280 SAT, 99.7 GPA, mutiple AP credits, multiple DC’s. Texas Boys State officer, NHS, Choir All State, (other ec’s), worked a part time job consistently since age 14 and had recs from our state rep (who is an Aggie), our principal (who only writes them for 5 students year) and the Dean of Mays Business School. He accepted his PSA offer immediately- pleased it wasn’t an outright denial! He has chosen Tarleton for next year and is determined to whatever it takes to make that transfer back to A&M a reality.
Some things we learned. ( A friend someone I used to teach with is the Head of Admissions. We spoke to her after his PSA decision came in):
- This was the most competitive class A&M has ever seen. Close to 51,000 applicants.
- Yes they are considering doing away with academic admits so they can have more students under holistic review.
- 85% admitted were auto admits, only 15% were holistic AND out of state! Very few kids were holistic in the state of Texas. Which goes to my earlier point- it doesn’t matter what these kids did or didn’t do in high school- it all came down to their GPA number for the vast majority. Makes me sad because as a teacher, and I’m sure all of us as parents know, there is so much more behind a number.
My question- how many of you here, that got the PSA offer, are your kids planning on accepting it?
My daughter received PSA offer and is planning to go straight to Blinn because she wants to be in Cstat. She had basically the same stats as your son. It is a little tricky because she has plans to apply to med school so taking most science there is a no-no (except Physics). She was originally BIMS but will transfer in as Psychology BS instead because she is genuinely interested in the neuro focused Psychology classes and it is more friendly for transfer because BIMS requires almost all your science before transferring. In the end, she will graduate as an Aggie so it is all good 
@aggie1998 My son got the PSA offer (top 13%, 29 ACT-met minimum in both English and Math with 28 in both,some ECs and worked parttime), he will be attending TAMU CC. Definitely not happy with the decision, but he knows that it’s not where you start but how you finish. He will be majoring in Biochemistry (might try to change major to BIMS if it works out that way - but will be fine with BCHEM).
I haven’t seen anything new about the Top 10 percent rule - @TMImomof2 and @52AG82 - This is appears to be the last thing that was before lawmakers (2017) - http://www.dailytexanonline.com/2017/04/21/top-10-percent-rule-stays-under-new-version-of-bill
But with the population growth - and the record number of applicants TAMU received this year - I bet the school is getting closer to the 75% that UT reached before being allowed to scale back to eventually 6%. But TAMU still has a way to go.
If you look at this overview - “only” 47% of the students are Top 10 percent admits from last year. Even with TAMU at 10% and UT at 6% - there is still at 28 percentage point difference in the number of auto admitted students between the two school. TAMU chooses to allow academic admission (about 20% last year). Meaning that 67% were academic or auto admits. Still below the 75% threshold that UT deals with.
So I suspect before TAMU, which has embraced the 10 percent rule as an alternative to affirmative action, does anything about relaxing the 10 percent rule - they will eliminate academic admission. Diversity has been an issue on the TAMU campus and the 10-percent rule has helped tremendously. https://www.texastribune.org/2016/06/19/m-student-diversity-increasing-without-affirmative/
According to the provost link - LESS THAN 50% of student admitted to TAMU come from the top 10 percent of their high school class.
If you look into the proposals to change the Top 10 percent rule - some suggest 30 - percent of the students must come from the top 10 percent - while others suggest 50 percent. TAMU hasn’t reached 50 percent yet.
Over the past month I’ve been looking at the rules other states have for their auto admits. My favorite is Florida. They have a top 10% rule too- but they don’t say “pick any public school in the state and if you want to go there, and you’re top 10%, you get an auto admit.” What they do is guaruntee that you will get accepted to a public school in the state, but it may not be Uof F or FSU. This allows their flagships schools to have more of a holitic process into who gets in. Now you’re activities and leadership and the person you are factors in to consideration more than just a number. I think due to our population size, we need to look at moving to a system like that or similar.
“My favorite is Florida. They have a top 10% rule too- but they don’t say “pick any public school in the state and if you want to go there, and you’re top 10%, you get an auto admit.” What they do is guaruntee that you will get accepted to a public school in the state, but it may not be Uof F or FSU. This allows their flagships schools to have more of a holitic process into who gets in. Now you’re activities and leadership and the person you are factors in to consideration more than just a number. I think due to our population size, we need to look at moving to a system like that or similar.”
I think that it’s rumored that UT may lean in that direction - I read an article somewhere about this, and this was one of the suggestions.
I’m not sure how UT could lean towards this. It would have to be a statewide program passed by our legislature or not- which is where we come in with communicating with our representatives!
Back here again.
Daughter is still deciding… the wait is killing me.
Another question: would you consider TAMU a commuter school, or not?
My daughter is struggling between TAMU, U of Pittsburgh, and University of Utah for Engineering (and Baylor- but the most expensive even with merit aid)
The 3 schools couldn’t be more different … and sadly they are all far away! (We are in so CA)
I would love her to go to TAMU (Blinn Team makes OOS not so horrible price-wise for first two years)
But she is wondering about the student life on campus. She will try out for Pep Band. She wants to go to a school where kids live there.
TIA!!!
My son applied to TAMU Galveston as his backup - we are Aggies, so going anyplace else was a non-starter. He was offered a PSA, but had already decided against that. He wasn’t thrilled about TAMUG at first, but so many of his friends will be there too and many from our HS have gone in the past that he is well-aware of the advantages of spending a year there. He will be an Aggie, get great football tickets with his sportspass, spend game weekends in College Station and take his gpa with him to TAMU. Those that do decide to stay for 4 years get a degree that says Texas A & M - not A & M Galveston. It’s not what we had hoped for but it’s a nice transition to college with smaller classes and less distractions for a teenage boy.
My son had a 4.43 gpa in HS but was not in the top quarter. He decided his freshman year he wanted a traditional, American HS experience - 4 years varsity golf, marching band, debate, lots of EC, many, many hours of community service and a part-time job.
The top 10% in our school chose to eschew any classes that were not AP/AA and would give them a gpa boost.
They did no community service, rarely participated in sports, music, drama, or choir programs. They told my son he was crazy to spend 2 classes a day in golf and band. Some told him they checked their gpa after every posted grade.
Several of these kids were close friends from elementary school, so he knew when they said they did nothing but study, they meant it. Cheating by the Top 10% is a huge problem at our school - the kids see it as a means to an end
and will tell you that they would rather get in a little trouble at school than face the wrath of their parents or drop out of the Top 10%. The vast majority of our school’s Top 10% are Asian and most likely did not miss the traditional American HS experience as they were raised in a different culture. If they made a 98 or 99 on a test or assignment they, or their parents, would pester the teacher for an additional point or two. One AP teacher quit in the middle of the year because she could not deal with that all day long. Other AP teachers confided that the reason we had 3 new Principals in 4 years was because of the teachers complaining about bias - the white students who cheated were (rightly) suspended, but the non-white students were given a slap on the wrist. Most were National Merit Scholars and
our school administration treated them with kid gloves.
This is not sour grapes in any way - my son and I are both happy with the path he chose - he made close friendships and wonderful memories and I had a great time going along for the ride. A parent commented previously that their child had skipped the EC in high school and often spent sleepless nights studying. That is not what I wanted for my son.
His varied outside-the classroom-experiences have shaped his personality, contributing to his mental toughness, maturity, flexibility, common sense and social graces. He is a true Aggie.
My issue with the Top 10% law is that the University is no longer allowed to choose, in a meaningful way, who they want as students. The State tell them who they MUST accept. All Universities have their own personalities; they should have more input into choosing the type of student they want.