Team Captains

Parents Forum
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<p>At our school, which is private, every coach can make his own decision. Mostly, however, the team votes and the votes are counted by current captains and the coach and decisions are made. Coach has final say.</p>

<p>When my Son (hs class of 09) was a junior the team voted, the captains/coaching staff reviewed all the votes and then the head coach named the kid with the second most votes as a singular capt of the football team at the season ending banquet, adding that he MIGHT name one more would be named the following fall. My kid was pretty heartbroken. He had been a starter since sophomore year and felt very much that he had earned the role both on the field and off. The current captains actually went to the coach and then to the Athletic Director over it. But the AD said it was the coaches decision. </p>

<p>Personally, because capt parents end up doing so much work in terms of organization, gear, volunteers or whatever the team needs, I was glad to not be a singular captain parent. Still, S was extremely bummed because while he was friends with the other kid, other kid also had a sort of eddie haskle personality, if you know what I mean. I was furious with the coach simply because he should have listened to his team more. Yes, coaches know kids better than parents, but kids know kids best. And while the whole cliquey thing on a team can be an issue, that usually doesn’t happen with boys. </p>

<p>But instead of making this a thing about a “title” or a star on his letter jacket, this is what I told my son: If you are a leader at heart, no one can ever tell you you are not. You don’t need a title or a label to lead. You need character and integrity. If you have that, show good judgement etc, people will follow you regardless. Being appointed a leader does not make it so. </p>

<p>S showed up to fall practice in the best shape of his life and basically ran the entire camp. Of course it helped that he had played his other sport all summer and so it wasn’t like he intended to do that just for Football. But that’s just who he is. And at the end of the first week of early fall practice S was named captain as well.</p>

<p>And here’s the thing… the other kid got a minor during the summer, failed to tell the coach (or his parents for that matter), and lied to the cops about the school he attended hoping the paperwork would get lost. It finally traced back to him the day of the first game, where had it not, he would have played and risked forfeiture had it come out later. He was then stripped of his capt-ship and embarrassed himself (and his parents) by his choices. But the truth was, ever since fall practice began, the kids were looking to S regardless.</p>

<p>Again, no one can tell anyone they are not a leader. Only you can decide that for yourself if you’re willing to be one regardless of the title. There was no desire to usurp this named captain in this case, but only to be seen as qualified as well. At the end of the day, the kids had gotten it right and the coach looked ridiculous for touting this kid as “the only one prepared to step up as captain.” And I will also say that I was pretty proud of the ousted kid as well in the end because despite his duplicity he owned up to all of it and was the poster child for what NOT to do… and admitted it regularly to the underclassmen.</p>

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<p>Ah, well, captain’s parents responsibilities… I know about this, as D1 was captain of a sports team junior & senior year of HS. This team does not require much from the parents. Some driving to meets (which I always volunteer to do – I think I drove to every meet this year, even though I work full time). And I actually filled in for the coach at a meet this year (he asked me to) when he had to be out of town. Last year no one had done anything about a gift for him at the end of the season (and he put in a lot of time for low pay), so I emailed the captain’s mom & captain and asked if they had something in mind (said I would be happy to contribute). The mom never got back to me…eventually the captain asked if I would help her organize something, and I did (collected checks, shopped, bought a card for the kids to sign, etc.). This is the same captain as this year… I emailed her again a few weeks ago to ask if she needed help with this task again this year, and did not hear back from her. But D says nothing has been mentioned at practice or in emails.</p>

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<p>In our school each team has their own way of selecting. We have seen the outgoing seniors select (practically destroyed the school newspaper this year). We have also seen the coach select. And we have seen voting. You aren’t going to get perfect results with any of these since you have the human factor. </p>

<p>Did you D express interest before the selection? If she didn’t I would consider this her mistake. My D (a rising sr) is being considered for 3 different leadership positions. She has actively met with the coach/advisor, and talked to the seniors who are selecting. In one case it was to say- please don’t consider me. In two other cases it was to explain why she would be great in that role. </p>

<p>Given the conversations she is having with her peers in these activities, this is what most of the kids are doing. </p>

<p>Perhaps he/she didn’t know D was interested?</p>

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<p>I was thinking about this some more. This coach has actually been indicating for a few years that this boy was (in his mind) a possible future captain. Which is so wrong on so many levels…and I think every time he ever implied it to any of that kids agemates or their parents, people have said so. The kids in his grade who would be most affected have put some pressure on the coach in general about this kid’s behavior. Three of them (D was with them) met with the coach at one point when he was in a sort of “sub-captain” role (just for some individual matches) and went over issues they had with him (not listening to the team on group questions, making excuses for poor play that embarrassed the team, sometimes taking other actions that cost the team points, general immaturity and rudeness). After that the coach took him out of the sub-captain role.</p>

<p>So the coach knows that the other seniors do not respect this kid. I sort of think the coach picked him out early (because he went out for the team in 8th grade), and never looked at his classmates again as possible captain material. And the coach had made comments to several people (me included, but also players on the team) that he expected X to be captain in a few years. I think the kids hoped he would figure out that X has not grown as a player, does not put the team first, and is really not considered any kind of leader by his peers. D is on another team with him (where she has no desire to be captain), and the captains kept giving him assignments he did not complete. When he didn’t get them done, they would give them to D because they knew they could rely on her, and she would take care of them. So it isn’t just this team that has trouble with him.</p>

<p>On another level, I think this is just wrong for a coach to pick out a kid in 10th grade (who is showing no captain-like qualities at the time, I might add) and start telling people this kid is a probable future captain. The coach, however wrong-headedly, might think it… but keeping it to himself, and assessing the whole group of rising juniors/seniors when the time gets close would have been a smarter strategy. Does he see the problems with this kid now? No telling, as he did hem himself in with his “tell early” strategy. </p>

<p>I know that this year’s captains know she is interested, as she talked with them at one point earlier in the season. No idea if they passed that info to the coach, though. And again – while she would like to be a captain, most of all the other seniors just don’t want to spend their whole senior year (all nine months of it) under the thumb of this kid.</p>

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<p>I think you are way too invested in this program and the picking of the captain. In 10 years, will you even remember this? I think it is time to move on to more important things.</p>

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<p>Intparent, I’m with SteveMA on this one. </p>

<p>And I’ve been in your shoes more that once with each of my three children. They all had a time or two when they were on the receiving end of some kind of unfairness–from coaches, teachers or peers. A couple of times I probably dwelled on it too much. I did intervene one time, when there was a serious bullying problem. Otherwise I threw some empathy towards my kids, and let them learn that life isn’t always fair.</p>

<p>Awhile ago, I heard a psychiatrist from one of the Ivies explain who the students were who “cracked up” (his words) in college. He said they were the “home town heroes”, who had experienced nothing but success in their short lives. At college, they were just part of the crowd, and they couldn’t deal with it. (I would have guessed that all students at the Ivies could be called “home town heroes”–but that’s another story.)</p>

<p>Go back and read all your posts on this thread. Respectfully, you’re over analyzing this. And remember that your reaction to this situation is setting an example for your child.</p>

<p>And if this counts as a big deal in 10 years, you and your daughter will have led charmed lives.</p>

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<p>I havent read all the posts thoroughly, but I would not dismiss the possiblity that the coach is sexist. I agree with the comments about email. Have you spoken to any other parents?</p>

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<p>My daughter was involved in an EC where something like this happened. The teacher sponsors of the activity chose student leaders for the following year–they chose three kids, two of whom hadn’t really put in much work for the activity, while not choosing another kid who had done a tremendous amount of work and was well-liked. (My D was not interested in being a leader, so we were just observers.) A bunch of the staff members went to the teachers and complained, and they responded by giving the excluded kid a better position, but not one of the main leadership positions. It left a sour taste in everybody’s mouth, and subsequent performance by the chosen leaders has pretty much confirmed that it wasn’t a good decision. Teachers, like anybody else, can make bad decisions. The problem is that it’s difficult to undo them. In the OP’s case, the teacher has the opportunity to partially undo his mistake by naming one or two additional co-captains–and he can even say that he always intended to do so. So the D’s e-mail, which allows for this possibility, has some chance of working.</p>

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<p>Well, the plot thickens. D sent her email (a very nicely worded email that did not slam the other kid, but laid out her qualifications and request to be considered). The coach stopped her today and said he had NOT announced that this kid would be captain, in spite of what this year’s captains and that boy have been telling people. Somebody is playing loose with the truth… can’t tell who, though. My money is on the kids, although I think the coach has fed this idea over the years. Maybe they were trying to make it seem inevitable by saying it was so (and they definitely said “The coach said it, it is true, it is a done deal” – I was there and heard them say it.).</p>

<p>Apparently one of the other juniors went to the coach today and told him she would not play for the “chosen one”, also. I think this happened before he saw D and talked to her.</p>

<p>He has called a team meeting for Friday to discuss the topic, and has explicitly not invited the current seniors. D is feeling more hopeful. She and the other seniors are truly comfortable with any one or combination of them (except this kid) being captains next year. They just want a drama free year (well, as drama free as senior year can be). So maybe some drama this week will pay off with a better year for them next year after all. I am very proud of her for standing up politely, but firmly to something that was being railroaded through. She will be practicing a speech for the team just in case he asks those who want to be captains to speak. Will let you know the final outcome next week. :)</p>

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<p>thanks intparent. I’m glad you were able to step aside and let your daughter handle the situation, while supporting her right to speak up. </p>

<p>This is a really great learning experience, imho, when a kid speaks up for themselves and gets a respectful response, regardless of the outcome.</p>

<p>do update us.</p>

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<p>While i agree with SteveMA and others who say you need to walk away… I also understand the need to at least vent it through and if not here, than where? To her kid? To the H so the D overhears? There are worse places to come than here to dump out the frustrations and the “crappy other kid bumped my kid” obsessions we’ve pretty much all dealt with at one time or another in raising kids to this age.</p>

<p>I am, however, very glad you let your D handle things with the coach and her peers. And I hope you didn’t inadvertently get involved by talking to other “real” parents. Seems to me that the quickest way to undercut our own children’s credibility with their teachers and coaches in HS is to speak FOR them instead of letting them speak for themselves. We had a mom a few years ago whose son was captain of a team. She felt that gave him automatic starting position for some reason and went on a rant with the coach, the AD and every parent who was within earshot. Kinda made her look like a crazy person, IMO. At what point did she not think that at the end of the day every single varsity coach would rather win than lose? And while I will note you aren’t saying your kid is the only one capable of being captain or anything, I just don’t want you crossing over to the crazy side in “real life!” :)</p>

<p>let us know how it goes!</p>

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<p>Nope, I have not said a peep to other parents at school. Just you guys, the best sounding board around. :smiley: I had no intention of talking to the coach, either.</p>

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<p>From intparent’s original post:

</p>

<p>A lesson to us all, parents and kids – if you didn’t hear it yourself, it may not be true.</p>