I am sorry because I think it is sad to think that no one can be redeemable or can unlearn bad behavior.
I’m sad because so many people are quick to excuse bad behavior,blame the victim, and not hold people accountable for their actions.
Our entire juvenile justice system rests on the assumption that youth can be redeemed. Plenty of evidence that people can be taught empathy for their victims and not recommit crimes
@momofthreeboys You took the sarcasm right out of my mouth.
I have absolutely no problem with the young woman defending herself against the crime of sexual battery by stabbing the assaulter in the hand with scissors.
I also agree that high school boys should know by now that they shouldn’t lift girls’ skirts.
However, I am with @roycroftmom that adolescents are impulsive and don’t always think through their actions. We shouldn’t throw up our hands and say “There is nothing we can do to change their behavior. We give up.” They’re still kids, they still have growing up to do, and adults can teach them to be better. I don’t know whether the particular strategy @roycroftmom’s school used will work, but I’m not willing to dismiss it out of hand on the belief that teenage assaulters are hopelessly irredeemable.
Yes , such a wonderful and successful system @roycroftmom .
I don’t believe that teenage assaulters are irredeemable, I believe that being held accountable for their actions is appropriate and necessary.
@caroIinamom2boys, I tend to agree with you as it relates to learning empathy by that late age, though I do believe people can change behavior if for no other reason that the desire to avoid negative consequences.
Yes which is what happened in this incident. But we are beating the proverbial dead horse.
@Nrdsb4 I agree that people can change their behavior for a variety of reasons ,but I would think that they would know that behavior would warrant negative consequences.
@momofthreeboys I’m glad that you included yourself in the beating.
So do I. I’m assuming that @roycroftmom’s solutions are aimed at preventing the next sexual harassment and the next sexual battery. No matter what you think ought to be done with this student, if there are ways to discourage boys from harassing girls in the future, we should do them in addition to disciplining the offender for this incident.
This is precisely why I think the girl should not be punished for defending herself: endorsing her self-defense sends the message that sexual battery is a serious enough offense that it can legitimately be defended against by hand-stabs. How much violence is proportionate in self-defense? Clearly, it depends on the seriousness of the offense. Sexual battery is not as serious as rape, but it’s more serious than name-calling. She shouldn’t be forced to just shrug it off.
Not always, I am sure the girl did not have a moment of conscious recognition that using scissors to threaten and attack was not legal given the circumstances. I agree that teens don’t often think through things and I happen to believe they can learn through their mistakes. I remember a few years ago parents talking about arming their kids with pepper spray before heading off to college And I remember thinking Yikes hopefully they are being instructed when they can use it and when it could land them in the pokey.
Carolinamom2boys, can you point out one post where anyone said the boy should not be held accountable? I’m glad the kids are spared the rush to judgment and erroneous assumptions displayed here. Reasonable people can civilly disagree about the most effective methods to respond to and deter this behavior without being sexist pigs or harassers.
Yes @roycroftmom reasonable people can disagree.
The laws tell us what is inappropriate for both…no one is arguing that the boy should not have flicked or lifted the hem of her skirt and the law tells her response was not a legal retaliation and the only thing being argued is whether kids can learn better behavior toward one another. I for one think they can.
It’s an educated guess that the kids involved here are black, as the school is composed of mostly black students. It sounds like some on here would love for this teenager to go to jail. Just what we need, another young black man in prison. I guess these boys are irredeemable. Forget providing better role models, school discipline or harassment and bullying education. Just lock em up as soon as they come out of the womb.
I missed it. Did anyone actually say this? Esp with high school kids? One should check out the 9th graders coming in and the 12th graders who graduate and one will see a lot of learning that has gone on.
Some kids have it harder, usually due to their home life or sometimes due to being on the Aspie scale or similar, but very few are incapable of learning. It’s only the methods that need to be variable to get through to them. I can’t think of any one method that works for all kids.
Some kids are golden from the start. Some learn manners and more from their home life. Some need more time and effort. A few miss out on all the above and there may be a very small percentage who are incapable of learning, but most can.
Whether they reject the conclusion that doing these things are bad/wrong is a whole different issue. There’s definitely a segment of those folks in the adult world and they have kids they bring up (see home life issue above).
Post 179 seems to state that this boy can not be rehabilitated. What undisclosed facts and assumptions warranted that conclusion is a mystery.
MODERATOR’S NOTE: Closing thread since there is debate going on.