Obviously, the two Asian Kids here view the order of preference something like Yale>X schools>Williams>Z schools >UPenn based on what they wanted to pursue in college. It can be very different from someone else’s preference like Yale=UPenn=X schools=Williams. But that is really their choice, how can they be faulted for that.
Keep in mind though CC exists precisely because “applicants are viewing admission as some kind of trophy”.
I want a Ferrari, but if I get a Mercedes instead, I would not expect people to feel sorry for me. The Mercedes will take you to great places as well.
If you are paying $300,000 --which is the price of private college these days–you better hope for a Ferrari. I think most people would feel sorry for you if you ended up with a Mercedes for that kind of money.
Most students are not full pay.
So for full pay kids and their families they get to pick their favorite car then 
No, but they can get something really, really nice.
You are all seem to be misunderstanding the author regarding Yale vs Upenn.
How so? The whole premise of the piece is that the author had a better admissions outcome than the “control Asian” who got into Penn (but seems to have chosen to go to Williams instead, a perfectly reasonable choice).
Life isn’t perfect. @gibby often writes about how his kid who really wanted to go to Yale only got into Harvard, and his kid who really wanted to go to Harvard only got into Yale. Sympathy for them is usually pretty limited.
Fundamentally there are so many great colleges out there, such amazing faculty strength all up and down the system. The relative advantages of going to HYPS vs. the absolutely sensational institutions that may be 20 or 30 meaningless rungs down the USNWR ladder are ephemeral and overvalued. The “problem” of smart, high-achieving students not being accepted at the most popular universities simply does not exist as a problem. There are a zillion other things to worry about, even just in American education.
At most top colleges outside of HYPM and a few others (Amherst, etc), colleges that meet full need but give little to no merit, most undergrads are full pay. More than half of freshmen are full pay at Stanford, Penn, Brown, Cornell, and Northwestern, for example.
Indeed. I was born in a country in Asia, so my D put that on her common app. Neither she nor I are ethnically Asian.
Yes indeed. What college one gets into and attends makes a lot more difference there than here in the US.
^If I recall correctly, in common app you only have to list your parents education not birthplace. If the parents work in professions that do not require an advanced degree, such as running a family restaurant, it is possible for someone to game the system by omitting info like parents foreign degree.
^^I think even at HYPM 40% are full pay and another 40% probably have a small discount that brings down the tag from $300k to $200k, still a whopping sum for most families earning a pay check. In gibby kids case going to Harvard and Yale according to him cost less going to a state school, so any offer in that situation would be a great outcome. Hey, if its Penn at $100k vs Yale at $300k I am sure most families including Asian’s would take the former in a heart beat. “The Price of Admission” is costly precisely because its so costly.
To me, and to many families with real need, the issue is not about which car the rich kids get to drive, it’s that we have
to walk, or if we are really lucky, we might be able to catch a bus.
It is of course easy for people with lots of money to forget about the privileges they have. I could not possibly care less if someone else paid $300,000 for a Mercedes - I don’t begrudge people with money or how they spend it.
Since highly selective colleges are not cars, the analogy is of course flawed. But going with it, the idea that someone would feel sorry for you for ending up with a Mercedes - when demand for the Mercedes is also so high that if you gave it up, 19 other people would happily pay that amount. So it would appear that “most people” would not feel sorry for you, instead my thoughts are that some would be jealous of you, while others would be genuinely happy for you.
HYPSM… costing less than a state school is not unique. Harvard claims that their cost is less than state schools for >90% of students in US. The net cost to parents for different income levels using Harvard’s NPC and Yale’s reported FA stats is below. The decrease in cost is quite substantial for typical lower/middle class families. They mention ~70% of families receive some form of aid (~55% via Harvard grant), and ~20% of parents have no expected contribution. It’s true that a significant portion of families that are full pay, but it’s also important to note that many of those families are quite wealthy. Harvard and most other HYPSM… schools have approximately the same portion of parents in top 1% income as bottom 60% income, so the portion full pay is not a good representation of the degree to which families are struggling.
Harvard NPC (Assuming 2 kids with 1 in college + typical assets)
$65k income – $0 cost to parents
$100k income – $5k cost to parents
$150k income – $15k cost to parents
$200k income – $39k cost to parents
Yale FA Stats (subtracted $3k student employment from median net cost to get cost to parents)
Less than $65k-- $2k cost to parents, 97% qualify for aid
$65k to $100k – $5k cost to parents, 98% qualify for aid
$100k to $150k – $14k cost to parents, 92% qualify for aid
$150k to $200k – $33k cost to parents, 86% qualify for aid
$200k to $250k – $38k cost to parents, 83% qualify for aid
Although not for >90% of Harvard students, since way more than 10% pay list price that is more than any in state public for undergraduate.
Harvard and Yale are going to be (ballpark) 35-40% full pay students. Which you can back into from their income demo data.
The median family income at Yale is $193k; 45% of students from the top 5%; 19% from the top 1%.
The median family income is $169k at Harvard; 39% of students from the top 5%; 15% from the top 1%.
The full pay line is probably between $250k and 300k.
@evergreen5 ,
Thank you for pointing that out. We pay full price. No merit- based. Several kids we know who go to the same college as our D pay full price. I don’t know where @stardustmom got the info from. I wish it was true.
I want to point out that assets are also considered in those calculations. A frugal family making $100K with significant assets because of their investments is also considered ‘full pay’ at those institutions. I’ll wager many CC families fall into that category.
Information is available directly from https://nces.ed.gov/collegenavigator .
For 2015-2016:
Harvard: 45% of frosh get no FA grants, 56% of all undergrads get no FA grants
Yale: 50% of frosh get no FA grants, 48% of all undergrads get no FA grants
https://nces.ed.gov/collegenavigator/?q=harvard&s=all&id=166027#finaid
https://nces.ed.gov/collegenavigator/?q=yale&s=all&id=130794#finaid
Should have blown our savings on annual vacation to exotic destinations and luxury cars. Well, get punished for savings!!! Oh, well.
Note that they mention the Harvard undergrads total includes thousands of non-degree students who are not eligible for aid, which reduces percentages. You also can have issues where students receive large scholarships from non-included sources. Quotes from the respective websites are below. That said, yes, there are a many full pay students and many students from wealthy families.
Harvard Website
Yale Website