<p>If assuming a black kid and an asian kid had the exact same stats, I wouldn’t mind if the black kid got in.</p>
<p>However the line between qualified and unqualified is very vague, so they can claim a 1800 black kid is more qualified than the 2400 asian kid, and you can’t prove them wrong.</p>
<p>get over your racist views username, it is worn out.</p>
<p>ok entertainer, i’m sorry, but you post too much to read all of it, and it’s always half what i said in quotes, followed by half rebuttal, and is like 2 pages long. and for all of your “have you even read what i said” comments well you quoted something i said then repeated it in your rebuttal, diversity is good, but not based on skin color. Diversity of thought and culture may add to the learning experience, but i know black kids that are as white as can be, and white kids who wish they were asian, so the only diversity you achieve is that of physical traits which adds nothing to the learning experience. is what i said, then you said, Who cares if a black kids act white or vice versa. That has nothing to do with diversity. Every house hold has different values, beliefs, etc. Culture is different in every house hold. Culture is something that you live with that affects your thoughts, actions and perceptions. I don’t know what you consider acting “white.” I honestly take that statement to be offensive and racist in some regards., well i just dais that it’s the cultures that make diversity special, not the skin colors, now if someone of different skin color has had experience with norse seamen or tibetan monks, then cool he’ll be a valuable member of the university. if a black kid was born and raised in new york, and next door lived a white person and they both grow up in new york, i bet they had similar experiences, that is not diversity, that is two new yorkers. you also misunderstand that it’s not the 50th % it’s the middle 50% that means a range from the 25%-75% so being any amount below the bottom number of any sat score range means you’re in the bottom 25%, so what’d you score on the sat math section?</p>
<p>you guys need to get over calling people a racist, it is just unproductive, and ridiculous. people use the word racist to shut down further discussion because the accused is afraid of being labeled as such, but in reality their views are not racist at all. all username is saying that if they have comparable stats sure let the minority kid in, but if one has 100’s more vol. hours, higher gpa, test scores, course rigor, etc… then it’s ridiculous to let the less qualified applicant in. and entertainer, someone has to be the valedictorian, if the highest gpa in your class is like 2.4 then that’s the valedictorian. there are 32000 valedictorians in this country every year, it’s just a title and not very rare.</p>
<p>Last time I checked 50% of the Penn’s class was made up of valedictorians and salutatorians. It obviously does matter to top prestigious universities. So regardless Universities look at who is the best in their class. No one has a 2.4 and is valedictorian. Seriously!</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>What’s the “real world” then? Would a rural, white-dominated place be any more “real” than a black-dominated inner city neighborhood?</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Rather than using a bunch of arbitrary results from one location, let’s look at the actual data:</p>
<p>[The</a> State of Black Student First-Year Enrollments at the Nation’s Highest-Ranked Colleges and Universities](<a href=“http://www.jbhe.com/features/57_freshmen.html]The”>The State of Black Student First-Year Enrollments at the Nation’s Highest-Ranked Colleges and Universities)</p>
<p>In most of the schools here (with the notable exceptions of the UCs), blacks have a higher acceptance rate than the overall one. What does that mean?</p>
<p>Yes, we don’t care if you guys want the diversity. Is it fair to blame society for your failures and try to get in through the backdoor? Compare this. One Asian comes from a poor family and one black also comes from a poor family. If they are both poor, what advantages does the Asian have over the black person? What if the Asian tries to succeed, by working his ass off, just to have some black person with lower grades get in through AA? If they both live in the same conditions, what does race have to do with anything? Are Asians just naturally born smart? No.</p>
<p>ok so that leaves the other 50% that were just regular smart students, and i don’t know what valedicatorian has the lowest gpa, but it was just to prove my point that valedicatorian status only means that you had the highest gpa relative to the rest of you class, it does not mean you had a high gpa although i’ll admit that it USUALLY does. and for someone who loves diversity so much do you think that 50% valedictorians is diverse? last time i checked 50% was not a minority, and i know, that doesn’t say anything about race, but if you want to look at a larger picture of diversity why not include religion, socioeconomic condition, and criminal record (lmao username).</p>
<p>Well obviously colleges won’t admit someone with a criminal record. They often deny applicants based on that if there isn’t a viable explanation for it. They ask for it in the application. Socioeconomic diversity, religious diversity is all important to me. </p>
<p>50% of Penn’s students are valedictorians or salutatorians. Does that mean there isn’t religious/socioeconomic diversity on campus? I can be valedictorian and be christian/rich, while my roommate can be valedictorian and muslim/poor(low-income). </p>
<p>Well usually colleges/universities look at the bigger picture. In prestigious colleges I will admit that there are a lot of rich kids. Not too many poor kids, but that doesn’t mean colleges don’t admit low-income students.</p>
<p>Seriously do you know any valedictorians with a 2.4 GPA?</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Whoever said that they didn’t?</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>This is a complete straw man. I don’t remember anyone ever saying or thinking that.</p>
<p>Sorry for double posting, but I already know the argument I presented was wrong. </p>
<p>Now, regardless of if blacks have higher enrollment percentages thats good, but most of the black population never takes advantage of the opportunities presented to them, which is also sad. </p>
<p>I agree with Will’s statement. I guess socioeconomic AA should replace racial AA. </p>
<p>Once again colleges and universities look at this as a white and black issue. But even though you presented the statistics about enrollment, a recent gallup poll study showed that blacks think whites have the advantage when it comes to college admissions. It’s surprising how statistics don’t correlate to overall viewpoint.</p>
<p>Chaoskita look at Maho’s points. Like the page before. My arguments have been towards him.</p>
<p>I really want to ask this question: Why does everyone think Asians are overrepresented in colleges. I mean, most colleges have over 50% of it’s students are white. Which leaves Asians and everyone else in the miniority. So, where is everyone getting this data saying Asians are ORM, do tell?</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>lol, sarcasm, that’s original</p>
<p>Blacks hardly have better “qualifications” then whites. For SAT, it’s pretty obvious to see. As for other stats, I don’t have the actual black admission rate for this school, but it can be seen that blacks are less “qualified” overall then people of other races:</p>
<p>[News:</a> Testing for ‘Mismatch’ - Inside Higher Ed](<a href=“http://www.insidehighered.com/news/2009/04/20/mismatch]News:”>http://www.insidehighered.com/news/2009/04/20/mismatch)</p>
<p>They also receive lower GPAs on average than students of other races. </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>You “guess.” Ok.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>If it’s surprising to you, that’s great.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>At most top-level colleges, Asians make up 10-25% of the student body, even though they make up 4.4% of the overall US population.</p>
<p>oh I see. It seems everyone when talking about AA and stuff on this thread are talking about top level colleges and not just the state University/other lower tier colleges.</p>
<p>Entertainer, it was clearly revealed in a previous thread of yours that Michigan accepted you based on the wrong ACT score. You’ve also bragged about benefiting from AA even though a parent is a doctor. We’re all dumber for having read your posts.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>yeah, I couldn’t really think of anything else… but I wanted to get back on topic :D</p>
<p>i really liked my other one though, but no one commented on it, so I’ll try again:</p>
<p>I know these people who do the EXACT SAME THING as someone else who is a year or two older, just because they got in ivy league schools. I’m not even exaggerating. It’s like they study the same books for the same amount of time each day, with the same extracorriculars, same classes, same tutor/teachers, same EVERYTHING.</p>
<p>and they assume they’re in for sure because their friend got in. It’s so common over here.</p>
<p>yea you really got to stop repeating stuff after i’ve explained it, the 2.4 valedictorian was to illustrate that the valedictorian only has the highest gpa relative to the rest of the class. and no i don’t think valedictorians make up a variety of ethnicities and races at top universities. i think the majority are white, asian, or indian and i know around here i haven’t seen anything different in the past 5 years. and as for asians being orm, i think someone said this already, but they make up a much higher percent of the population at a given school than their representation of the overall population. and as for whites making up 60+% at some places, well they are the largest group in the country. if blacks or asians made up that high of a % then whites wouldn’t get into college at all.</p>
<p>jajdude, we talk about high level universities because that’s where most people strive to go, and that’s where the urm boost really counts. if these kids applied to lower tier schools then they would probably get in on their own merit either way because the standards are lower.</p>
<p>things that gave me a ridiculous sense of false security:</p>
<p>my SAT score (2330)
getting regents for UCSD and UCLA
getting the tanner dean scholarship (aka unofficial early acceptance) for Cornell in March
getting the National Merit Scholarship
having my sister be a finalist in the Charles M Rolker prize at Columbia
being on ASB (student council), yearbook, and taking every AP class at my school less 3 (and getting 5’s on them).</p>
<p>Scenario 1:
Colleges look only at the merits that a student has. In this case, there would be virtually no diversity. What happens to the students? They aren’t able to learn in an environment that’s similar to the real world. How are these students going to succeed when they’ve been sheltered all their lives? Let’s say that they go into business: they are unfamiliar with many of the markets, limiting the business’s focus. </p>
<p>Scenario 2:
It’s harder for some people to get jobs – true. Without a good education, it’s nearly impossible. As a result, a larger gap would most likely result among the races. </p>
<p>Both could happen.</p>
<p>You guys make it sound like URMs are never rejected. That’s so exaggerated.</p>