<p>I know we have had several thyroid threads recently but I can’t quite find what I’m looking for.</p>
<p>As a young adult I was diagnosed with hyperthyroidism (had the typical symptoms - weight loss, rapid heart rate, etc.). Took a beta blocker for it for a brief time but never anything else.</p>
<p>Fast forward to around age 37 (12 yrs ago) - was undergoing infertility treatment and the reproductive endocrinologist ran some lab tests and diagnosed me with hypothyroidism. He said it is very common for a person with hyperthyroidism to experience burn-out of the thyroid and end up with hypothyroidism. I was initially given Synthroid but was later switched to Levoxyl (100 mcg). I guess it has helped. I could tell a little difference when I switched from the generic to brand name rx but I still have some of the same issues (hair loss, low energy, weight gain, etc.)</p>
<p>So, recently several people I know have been diagnosed with ‘sub-clinical hypothyroidism’ and given Armour Thyroid which not only includes T4 but also T3. My sister was one of them and raves about how great she feels. </p>
<p>I know there is some controversy with the whole ‘sub-clinical’ diagnosis and that Armour itself is considered somewhat controversial with mainstream physicians - not least because there have been some manufacturing issues with the drug.</p>
<p>I have asked my primary care physician several times about Armour and he has basically ignored me (he’s a great PCP, not sure why he’s taken this tack on this particular issue). He does say my lab work is within normal limits but I’m not sure if he’s been testing for T3 as well as T4 and TSH. I have an appointment with him Monday and am trying to decide whether to ask about the Amour thyroid again or just ask him to tweak my Levoxyl to try and get some of my symptoms under better control. I’ve read bad as well as good experiences with Armour, so I know it’s not a cure-all. Have even considered seeing an alternative medicine physician who specializes in hormones or endocrinology. I guess I feel like it won’t hurt to try a different medication and if it doesn’t make a difference or I have side effects I could switch back.</p>
<p>I definitely plan to talk to him about this but am curious whether anyone have any experience with Armour?</p>
<p>I don’t have experience with Armour (and I’ve been taking Synthroid, or the generic equivalent, since 1985) but I suspect the reason your PCP is “ignoring” your comments about Armour is because he doesn’t know anything about it. If I were you, I would find an endocrinologist to test my blood and manage my thyroid levels. And answer your questions about Armour.</p>
<p>Tell your PCP you want a referral to an endo. He shouldn’t have a problem with giving you one.</p>
<p>And if he does have a problem, that’s a whole other story.</p>
<p>You should ask him to print a copy of your most recent blood test results and give it to you. The TSH reading is the primary marker they use to dial in thyroid dose. I guess it’s the brain’s signalling chemical to say “make more thryoid”. So, when it’s high, it is the body saying “up my dose”. There is some dispute about what level is acceptable or desireable.</p>
<p>I noticed in the order for the next round of bloodwork that my doc also included a direct T4 thyroid measurement.</p>
<p>The synthetic thyroid is T4 thyroid which is converted by the body to T3 thyroid used by the cells. The argument for the armour thyroid is that it is both T3 and T4, so could potentially be better if your body is not good at the conversion.</p>
<p>The synthetic thyroid medicine must be taken on an empty stomach. Eating or drinking anything a couple of hours before or an hour afterwards will reduce the effectiveness of a given dose.</p>
<p>I just got diagnosed with hypothyroid. A tense week until we got the results of the biopsy. Now I need to see an endocrinologist. Finally got an appointment for june 13. I didn’t know how common this was until I started talking to people.</p>
<p>TSH is Thyroid Stimulating Hormone, and it’s produced by the pituitary. There’s a delicate balance, and if the thyroid isn’t producing enough thyroid hormone, the pituitary gets busier and busier. So TSH is really a measure of what the pituitary’s doing in response to what the thyroid is doing.</p>
<p>I know a lot of people who have done very well on Armor. But not all endocrinologists are supportive of it. I would definitely try to get in to see an endocrinologist, better yet, a thyroid specialist. And definitely get your T3 tested.</p>
<p>This is a pet peeve of mine: the “normal limits” of thyroid tests. I’ve had horrible experiences getting treatment for my thyroid problems because a lot of doctors just dont know how to treat the disease. They will tell you you’re fine if you’re above the lowest bound of the lab range, are not familiar with the recent changes in “normal ranges”, or will try to treat you based on your TSH levels (your TSH levels are almost useless and shouldn’t be used to determine if you’re at the correct dosage).</p>
<p>Before you try switching to different meds, I would get your levels tested again and see for yourself whether or not your dosage is good. Many people don’t feel better until they’re in the upper half of the lab test range.
I’ve found online message boards for thyroid problems to be really helpful during my treatment. I don’t think I’m allowed to post links, but if you want, send me an email and I’ll give you the urls of the two message boards I find most helpful - there are people with a ton of knowledge that can help you understand your lab results and such.</p>
<p>Concur on the recommendation to see an endocrinologist. My doc insists on brand name synthroid…he says there really is a difference with the generic in the case of this medication.</p>
<p>I had my thyroid removed a week ago yesterday…not a “fun” procedure.</p>
<p>I had a nodule the size a walnut growing on my thyroid and had been treated with high dose radiation as a kid for swollen glands…right now I am still on the same dosage of synthroid that I was on prior to the surgery, .137 mcg. It will be interesting to see if and how the dosage changes over time.</p>
<p>That has been my suspicion all along. I know we have a major shortage of endocrinologists in my city but I’m within 2 hours of two major cities, so I need to do some research and see if I can find someone who specializes in thyroid issues.</p>
<p>Apparently, there * is * a big difference between the generic thyroid medications and brand name. A while back I was complaining about how the thyroid medication wasn’t working and my doc told me to try the brand name one and it did make me feel better. He said that thyroid medication is one of the few where the generics don’t always work the same.</p>
<p>One of the problems with thyroid issues is other than the lab results, a lot of the symptoms are subjective and very universal, so it can be hard to get them to take you seriously. And it’s very common, so a lot of physicians treat it as a ‘run-of-the-mill’ problem. They want to just use standard dosing but hormones can be very tricky to get just right.</p>
<p>I’ve been hypo since I was 8 years old, went through adolescence, fertility issues, vision difficulties, every possible complication. I strongly urge you to see an endocrinologist and to be very careful of, as interestedad said, how and when you take your thyroid medication. You should take it on an emply stomach and, if possible, hours away from tea or a multivitamin. Also, for synthroid, bear in mind that for many people generics aren’t truly equivalent. THere is a great deal of data on that.</p>
<p>By the way, have you considered the possibility of anemia pairing with hypothyroidism? That happens fairly often and the symptoms are similar. I’m one of those lucky folks and the fun part is that iron conflicts with synthroid absorption so timing is tricky.</p>
<p>Yes! Thats why its really important to find an endo who treats not just based on your numbers, but also based on your symptoms. And believe me, that can be very hard to find! I had to deal with that for a long time before I found my current doctors - all the others would write my symptoms off because I was young (15) and my TSH was normal (ignoring the fact that my T3 and T4 were far below the normal range). Its hard to find a good endo, but its worth it.</p>
<p>Uh oh…I take mine with a cup of tea and several vitamins every morning. I’ve never heard that before. Maybe that’s why it doesn’t seem to be very effective.</p>
<p>It doesn’t get absorbed well in the stomach. It has to pass thru to the intestine, where it is effectively absorbed. Anything you eat or drink triggers digestion in the stomach, which is ineffective.</p>
<p>What works for me is to take the pill in the middle of the night when I get up to use the bathroom. Hours after I’ve eaten, hours before my morning coffee.</p>
<p>Minimum 2 hours after eating or drinking anything and one hour before eating or drinking.</p>
<p>I want to add that you don’t need an endo to treat hypothyroid. Many primary care providers treat hypothyroid disorders. And yes, treatment should be based on lab tests plus symptoms and many providers do make the mistake of treating the lab test (of which “normal” ranges from .4-3.5, a huge range. Same for B12 but don’t get me started). Unfortunately, there is no accurate lab test for T3 so it’s often a guess to start someone on Armor. That is why many providers are uncomfortable with it as the T3 effects can’t be measured. I’ll often have people on both Armor and Synthroid. Cytomel is another option that I’ll use alone or in combo.</p>
<p>I’ve taken synthroid for 15yrs and did find I can not take the generic. I had to fight the insurance co. but now have no prob. I now take cytomel in addition. I have to keep my levels on the very low end or I feel lousy. They have to be taken on an empty stomach and 4 hours from vitamins/mineral supplements, iron, or antacids.</p>
<p>My mom had thyroid cancer and lived another 50 years on Synthroid. I, OTOH, found I felt worse on Synthroid. I use generic Levothyroxin, which is a ton cheaper. However, I am always exhausted, now anemic and Vitamin D and B-12 deficient PLUS I have gained so much weight that I am a huge fat pig so now I’m depressed on top of it all.</p>
<p>I am getting an appointment with an endo. My PCP tries but I’m not sure that she manages it perfectly.</p>
<p>For years I was taking my birth control pill at the same time as my Synthroid. It was actually someone here on CC - not my endo - who said that might be the problem. About three weeks later, I stopped taking the pill altogether. By then I was on both synthroid and cytomel. I lost about 15 lbs until my next endo appointment. Stopped the cytomel. Then I decided to go gluten free, which many recommend if the thyroid issue is autoimmune. Lost more weight. Endo is out of the country and people keep asking why I am so thin.</p>
<p>Long way of saying, other meds and even food can have an effect and it can take a long time to get the dosage right.</p>
<p>My endocrinologist, at Mayo Clinic, told me that in her opinion there’s no difference between the generic levothyroxine and Synthroid, other than the price. She urged me to take the generic, and if that didn’t work, then switch to Synthroid. I had read the opposite, but decided to try the generic, and always get it from the same manufacturer. So far, I haven’t had any problem.</p>
<p>I have read that people who don’t feel well on Synthroid or generic levothyroxine alone do feel better on Armour. And, I have read that patients do have a hard time finding a doctor who will prescribe Armour. Some people who don’t do well on Synthroid or generic alone do add Cytomel to the mix.</p>
<p>I do take it on an empty stomach, and wait one hour before eating/drinking. I wait 4 hours before taking my calcium, and don’t use soy products, which block the efficacy of thyroid hormone.</p>
<p>Cytomel is T3- immediately available to your body.
I cannot live without it! It helps when for some reason you cannot convert T4 to T3. I also take T4 in a new form. gel caps, produced in Switzerland, called TIROSINT. It is cleaner, gets absorbed more quickly, so there is less re-uptake with stuff that gets stored in the gall-bladder or liver.</p>
<p>I am one of those who has never tested by blood below the range but have always been at the low end of the range. Hypothyroid is universal on one side of my family.(D1 was just diagnosed, too late to avoid the insulin/blood sugar driven PCOS, unfortunately, and also heavy in her case with muscles, as she is an athlete-we are all major “storers”…) So I have been on the look-out. My body temp was always low, and when my doc heard it was 96, I started on thyroid supplementation. The T3 is what helped me most initially.
I am now seeing an endo who has a whole different approach. Thank goodness, because menopause has made all this even more challenging, as lower levels of estrogen exacerbate any storage tendencies we have, but I am avoiding supplementing the female hormones.
He checks by feel and then with sonogram the thyroid gland- mine is sore and swollen and has a bump on the left. The inflamed thyroid gland is unsteady in its production of hormones, so he basically puts it to sleep, the way we do the ovaries with BCP, by providing you with 100% of your thyroid needs by meds. He feels this gives us more control over how much you are actually getting, otherwise we are hypo, then hyper, etc. I continue to need T3, too, and the new high levels of Vit D (actually another hormone) supplementation. He also prescribes metformin preventively, to keep the blood sugar level lower, reducing insulin sensitivity, and helping with weight problems, and this is particularly important at three stages of a woman’s life: puberty, post-partum, and menopause.
As for Armour (and Naturthroid), the natural supplements, that is basically the opposite approach- and it might result in a much more varied level of hormone. I have never tried it because it was not being produced for a while ( about 1 1/2-2 yrs ago), and the new stuff is apparently less effective- it is manufactured in a different base, I understand. My original doc retired while this happened, so I switched to the endo and this is what I am now doing.
OP or any one else, please PM me if you would like contact info about this endo. People come to him from all over the world.
best of luck to all</p>
<p>After the birth of my second child about 15 years ago I was diagnosed as overactive thyroid. This was in the UK and I given Carbininzole. After a while on the drug I ended up being severely underactive so I took a combo of Carbininzole and Thyroxine. After tinkering around for about a year trying to get the dosage right, my GP mentioned it was a lot easier to replace the hormone than to try to monitor it with the gland intact. He recommended radioactive iodine and I agreed to the treatment. I went into his office, took a pill, and other than having to sleep separately from my husband for a week, I’ve had not other ill effects. When I moved to the US from the UK I was advised that Levoxyl was closer to Thyroxine so that’s what I’ve been taking for the past 10 years. </p>
<p>I ALWAYS insist on the name brand not generic. I started out on 150 MCG. I have a Mirena (5 yr IUD) and this does impact the absorption of the Levoxly so for the first 2 years or so I stick with the 150 MCG then evenetually scale back to 125 MCG. I take it everyday at the same time as my vitamin. My endocrinologist told me it didn’t matter when I took the vitamin as long as it was the same time every day so the blood tests would be accurate.</p>
<p>I do agree that seeing an endocrinologist is key. They gradiate the results differently than a GP might using a more granular approach to reviewing the results. So what might look within a “normal” range for a GP might be “slightly under” or “over” for an endocrinologist. Even 25MCG could mean a bit different to how one feels .</p>
<p>Thyroid problems cause such a wide range of symptoms when ever I hear someone say they just don’t feel themselves I always advise them to get their thyroid checked.</p>