<p>Nope, no one is debating it. It’s just an interesting defense mechanism when something bad is pointed out to say, “well, something else isn’t perfect either.” True, but not the point. </p>
<p>^But isn’t that exactly how the discussion of Alabama started–after Consolation brought it up as a distraction from the subject of frats at Dartmouth? And then you added to it with your comments about fainting and smelling salts?</p>
<p>As someone who has lived in the south and has a child in college there, it frustrates me that so many people–including a number of my “enlightened” friends-- cling to stereotypes rather than take an honest look at the facts. The thing people seem to forget about the south is that it has had tremendous in-migration from northern cities and states. It’s not all new racists with '50s attitudes moving there. I know people who have never set foot below the Mason-Dixon line (except for DC) and yet they insist the south is horrible and unwelcoming and so much worse than where they live. It’s just naive and provincial.</p>
<p>alh, try this:</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.census.gov/2010census/popmap/”>http://www.census.gov/2010census/popmap/</a></p>
<p>I couldn’t get the map to come up for some reason, but when I lived in Chicago back in the late 70s it was first
in in Hyde Park/Kenwood, which is an unusually–perhaps uniquely–integrated area. (My sib also lived in Kenwood for many years.) If you went south of the Midway, or west of Cottage Grove, the area was all black. When I moved up to the north side, I lived in a 2-block strip of mostly white people along the lake. At the end of my block, there was Latin Kings grafitti, and one block further in you would find bodegas where no one spoke English, only Spanish. To my eyes at that time, Chicago was remarkable in its ethnic focus, a lot of which involved Eastern European immigrants. There were not only the Chinatowns and Little Italies that I was familiar with in Boston and New York, but Bohemian neighborhoods, Polish neighborhoods, Hungarian Neighborhoods, and so forth. I worked in the Sears Tower for a year or so, and the trash was marked with signs in Polish, because the cleaning staff was mostly Polish immigrants.</p>
<p>Yep…my husband grew up in an area where conversations in Lithuanian were as common as those in English. Things have changed since then, but I do think some of the segregation in the city can be traced back to the strong tradition of ethnic enclaves. </p>
<p>Disclaimer…I did not read all the many pages of this thread, so I apologize if this has been said.</p>
<p>On page one, the OP said they were trying to compile a list of “pie in the sky” schools. What about UCLA and UCB? Both are fabulous, and not a guarantee even for instate applicants. </p>
<p>Also, I’m very unclear about the impact finances will have on this student’s college choices.</p>
<p>Consolation, I believe Hyde Park/Kenwood are still pretty integrated. Oak Park is too. Interestingly, when I lived there I learned that homeowners were not allowed to put “for-sale” signs up on their lawns when they were selling their houses. This was designed to minimize white flight when people would see someone of color moving in and see more signs going up and join the exodus. (Nearby Milwaukee offers an extreme example of white-flight hysteria–and as a result it is today very segregated, with a large swath of racist towns to the west of the city in Waukesha County.)</p>
<p>sally- please repost. The link isnt working</p>
<p>Here’s the link again.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.census.gov/2010census/popmap/”>http://www.census.gov/2010census/popmap/</a></p>
<p>So this happened at San Jose State…proving once again that racism is not only a problem in the Deep South.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/05/04/us-usa-california-hazing-idUSBREA4300820140504”>http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/05/04/us-usa-california-hazing-idUSBREA4300820140504</a></p>
<p>Horrible.</p>
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</p>
<p>I probably would have ended up going to MIT anyways, but I think if I had known what I know now about its Greek life, the choice would have been much harder. If it wasn’t such a great fit academically, I might not have gone - not just because it has frat housing, but because of its affect on campus life.</p>