<p>Odd that you don’t challenge the idea that the Greek system at MIT is unusual…</p>
<p>You might start by contemplating the fact that such a high percentage of people join at D. Many, if not most, of those students would not have rushed elsewhere. There is very little of the exclusivity one might see elsewhere, pretty much limited to a couple of houses. The system is very open. Houses vary widely, and are very diverse: fully inclusive of students on full FA and minorities. Several are coed.</p>
<p>Personally, I think that D–and ALL schools–would be better off without a Greek system, and with something like residential colleges instead. (So does my S, a recent grad and fraternity member.) But this is not the University of Alabama.</p>
<p>No, it’s certainly not Alabama, as Tuscaloosa appears to have a wider variety of activities that don’t involve binge drinking. And, if you’ve ever been to Tuscaloosa, you’d know how damning that statement is. </p>
<p>SOG, I was referring only to the Greek system at Alabama. Big news lately when a sorority accepted a BLACK member for the first time. Remember? Greeks saying that the frats would no longer socialize with them? People resigning? Big brouhaha? </p>
<p>@consolation, I responded to the post you made this morning and specifically to your use of the word “inflammatory”, not to the post made yesterday some pages back. That is “odd”?</p>
<p>There’s little comparison between normal Greek systems and systems in which the very idea of a black person in a house generates all kinds of horror and fainting and waved-handkerchiefs and smelling salts. Dartmouth may have its faults (as every school does) but please, don’t EVEN begin to compare to the backwardness of the system in Alabama.</p>
<p>Alabama has a long way to go (although as I recall it was alumnae, not current sorority members, who objected to the selection of black members). But let’s not kid ourselves that racism doesn’t exist everywhere. To wit, the “We too are Harvard” project. </p>
<p>As this article demonstrates, we are not “post-racial”–even though many white people want to believe we are.</p>
<p>Neither pizzagirl nor I has said or implied anything about our society being “post racial.” We were simply talking about the difference between integrated Greek systems and those that are not. The fact that our society as a whole is not “post racial” does not in any way invalidate my point or hers. </p>
<p>Of course not. I just think the continued emphasis on Alabama obscures the point that it is not only schools in the Deep South that have issues with racism–whether inside the Greek system or outside it. For some people (not you or PG), it’s easy to become complacent about these issues when there’s another situation to point to that seems far worse. I see this all the time where I live.</p>
<p>Well, I think worse situations are indeed - well, worse and more worthy of pointing out. Archie Bunkers in the north may not have wanted their daughters to marry black people, but they didn’t think black people should be relegated to the back of the bus that took them both to their factory jobs, or that they shouldn’t be allowed to drink from the same fountain or use the same bathroom. It was inherently far more dehumanizing and I don’t see why we are supposed to pretend otherwise. </p>
<p>You are painting “the South” with a really broad brush. There is absolutely a terrible history of institutionalized racism there, and vestiges of it are still seen in the Greek systems at schools like Alabama and Ole Miss. But things are changing, albeit too slowly for most of us. Also, I don’t think you can speak for the Archie Bunkers in Boston, Philadelphia, New York, Chicago, etc. on their support for equal rights. Many of those people hold views that are every bit as offensive as those of their counterparts in the South. And it’s not like they are living lives of blissful integration side by side with people of different backgrounds.</p>
<p>Anyway, we should probably get back to the subject at hand on this thread. californiaaa only has three years to figure out which top college will be perfect for her child.</p>
<p>PG: you are absolutely correct when you point out what was happening in the south 50 years ago. What do you think about Sally’s current map of Chicago?</p>
<p>And once again - for the umpteenth time- the “normal” fraternities and sororities could absolutely cut loose the awful racist ones. When they don’t they share the blame. period. </p>
<p>If you come visit us down here, we’ll bake you a cake. If you stay home, that’s okay by us, too. : ) </p>
<p>I’m satisfied with my national house’s response to the Alabama situation - they made it abundantly clear that they were just as horrified by that mentality and reinforced that alums should have no role in membership selection (other than procedural). If they had found that our chapter at Alabama acted that way, I’d have no problem if they cut them loose. </p>
<p>But whatever. I’m supposed to pretend there’s no difference between systems in which there were black presidents in houses 25 years old and everyone yawned and systems in which the mere suggestion of a black person causes “controversy.” Sorry, I won’t pretend they are equivalent, and I’m tired of pretending that some parts of the country aren’t behind the times. </p>
<p>Those maps are indeed fascinating. No one said any part of the US is perfect in terms of integration. But some things were objectively worse than others. Jim Crow. </p>
<p>And what do you think of universities that still have all-black houses on campus? There are a number of them at NU and many other schools that may also have had a black president in a predominantly white house 25 years ago.</p>
<p>If I understand correctly, according to the map, Birmingham is less segregated than Chicago, though both are very highly segregated. I don’t know if the map is correct. Sally - Is there a map that shows more cities and urban areas? </p>
<p>If the map is correct it is showing us a snapshot of this particular moment in time, or at least 2010.</p>
<p>Well it was a surprise to me how segregated Chicago is. I still love Chicago. Just not that aspect. And there are a few other areas where the city isn’t absolutely perfect. I don’t think anyone really debates that fact. </p>
<p>Chicago is even more segregated when you look at the data on a block-by-block basis. Even in areas that appear “integrated” there is a lot of micro-segregation going on. My daughter’s school seems very diverse (with almost equal white and Hispanic representation) when you look at the data, but in actuality, it’s two schools under one roof. </p>