<p>@Pizzagirl, "anyone can sit and contemplate the finer points of “deciding” between Harvard and Yale and Princeton and Dartmouth and Stanford and other fine schools … but it’s a fool’s exercise unless one actually has these acceptances in hand and must choose. " I don’t get your point. You need to consider details about schools in order to decide which ones to apply to. Just throwing out a zillion applications then saying, “Oh, I didn’t know that school was so dominated by Greek life, I guess I wasted my time and money applying because that’s not what I want” doesn’t make any sense. Yes, it matters to some kids. My daughter would have crossed Dartmouth off her list if she learned about that (though it wasn’t on her list for other reasons). </p>
<p>IJustDrive, the Greek system at MIT is unusual. Residential houses have personalities. Grad dorms also have personalities and social life. I don’t think any MIT kids would accept or not this school because they have frat housing as well as other housing. </p>
<p>I do not mean to come off too strong. Do you have a child at MIT or thinking of applying there? </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>I wouldn’t be so hasty calling other people “fools”. Besides the fact that it is condescending and insulting, it doesn’t add to the knowledge that the alleged fools need to escape their lowly status compared to the accuser. (I am not one of the cited fools…up until now…I guess.)</p>
<p>I think it is very important to evaluate schools prior to acceptance for the following reasons:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>To determine SCEA/ED/EA strategy.</p></li>
<li><p>To allocate time and financial resources needed to make visits</p></li>
<li><p>To allocate time and financial resources required to complete applications</p></li>
</ol>
<p>I think it is wise to create a list of acceptable schools across a wide range of acceptance rates rather than exclusively focus on building a dream list of schools with acceptance rates below 15%. Every year we hear moans and groans from students who went zero-for-ten in their elite-school applications because they refused to consider any school they deemed not prestigious enough.</p>
<p>The OP’s daughter will be applying to some California schools.</p>
<p>Sigh. The OP doesn’t need to hear about the differences between super-duper elite school A and super-duper elite school B. She needs her horizons WIDENED beyond super-duper elite schools that are reaches for everybody, not narrowed to HYPSM or bust. </p>
<p>Perhaps the OP feels it’s only worth paying double or more for a school which is super-duper elite when solid in-state options are available and much more affordable. That may not be your opinion but I think it’s a very valid one.</p>
<p>No, because she was adding U Washington and BYU to her list. </p>
<p>The OP (in my opinion) shouldn’t be on this site at all with a kid as young as her daughter is. She has actually been calling colleges to find out how they compute GPA and carefully calculating all the things her child should do to get into “top” schools three years from now. Really, does anyone think this is OK? Since when do we obsess about the nuances of particular long-shot schools for kids who are barely in their teens? What happened to letting our kids have their childhoods? And for those who would defend this, where is the evidence that all this micromanaging actually pays off?</p>
<p>Maybe. Assuming a small merit award, UW is probably only about 10K more per year than Berkeley for this family, that’s a lot less than many top private schools. And it has some very strong STEM programs. Not sure why BYU is on the list but perhaps there is a personal connection or cultural reason.</p>
<p>I’m not defending micromanaging a kid into the “optimal” college applicant or pushing them into certain majors. I’m defending the idea that someone may feel that certain colleges are worth paying a lot more for than a good instate option, whereas others are not. Doesn’t mean they aren’t fine schools, but perhaps the OP feels they aren’t worth the extra money. </p>
<p>I’m not even sure how knowing how these schools compute averages matters. These schools will expect very high grades. I don’t see what else one needs to know, unless the grades are a weak point and the question is whether they are high enough to bother applying. But we know that’s not the issue because this kid doesn’t even have enough of a record to say yet.</p>
<p>The OP may find the lists of schools near the bottom of this article from the NSF interesting. Top Schools From Which S&E Doctorate Recipients Received Bachelor’s Degrees <a href=“http://www.nsf.gov/statistics/infbrief/nsf08311/?govDel=USNSF_178http://www.nsf.gov/statistics/infbrief/nsf08311/?govDel=USNSF_178”>http://www.nsf.gov/statistics/infbrief/nsf08311/?govDel=USNSF_178http://www.nsf.gov/statistics/infbrief/nsf08311/?govDel=USNSF_178</a></p>
<p>Just an aside: There are undercurrents here that people are missing. </p>
<p>To put it in raw numbers, since this is a top 20 thread: californiaaa has hit another homerun with this thread of 3,300 views already. And if you check out her list of threads, she’s got several that hit that mark. She also had quite a presence in Why have parents gone crazy in the last 10 years?</p>
<p>don’t know if this will help.
<a href=“http://www.thebestcolleges.org/rankings/top-50/”>http://www.thebestcolleges.org/rankings/top-50/</a></p>
<p>You might want to consider schools outside the US (the most over-priced market for higher education in the world). My d is an undergrad at Cambridge U in the UK (rated #5 worldwide), her first choice by far and the best option we found financially. She also liked Smith and Bryn Mawr, but WITH financial aid, they would have cost us a cool 1/4 million$. Cam will cost 1/4 that for a first-rate degree. </p>
<p>@mathyone, thank you for the link to the chart. (four posts before this one). My D is very interested in two of the colleges on the list. (Rarely mentioned on CC, but fine LACs.). Nice to see a bit of confirmation of my gut instincts about them.</p>
<p>I think this thread has gotten so much traction because it’s emblematic of the sad pattern on this board: A parent or student spends months (and sometimes years) obsessing over the nuances of only the uber-selective schools, then in April we see their ‘shut out’ post. </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>And the Greek system at D is also unusual. </p>
<p>Which is why it is misleading and deliberately inflammatory to simple cite Greek membership stats in regard to either school. And to travel around CC doing it over and over again is to reveal an agenda.</p>
<p>It would be as if a poster brought up the comparatively high acceptance percentage of a great school every time the school was mentioned, with no context that explains that there is a very strong degree of self selection at work. And did so deliberately to put the school down. This would be like trying to suggest that the student body of the pre-Common App U of C or an elite women’s college was somehow inferior. Get it?</p>
<p>The idiocy of this list-in-the-making is another matter…</p>
<p>I was beginning to suspect that Dave Barry may have adopted a nom de plume because his recent attempts at click-bait really haven’t taken off. </p>
<p>@consolation, would you care to explain how the Greek system at Dartmouth is unusual? And why would it be “inflammatory” to note Greek participation on campus. Given the popularity of these organizations, many people like them. Is it “inflammatory” to mention that a college has a great football team and that the students are enthusiastic fans of football? A lot of kids want that, but like Greek organizations, it’s not for everyone and people who don’t want that may prefer a different school.
<a href=“Dartmouth in the Glare of Scrutiny on Drinking - The New York Times”>Dartmouth in the Glare of Scrutiny on Drinking - The New York Times; Dartmouth in the Glare of Scrutiny on Drinking
I see nothing unusual about these particular fraternities.</p>
<p>“I was beginning to suspect that Dave Barry may have adopted a nom de plume because his recent attempts at click-bait really haven’t taken off”</p>
<p>LOL! </p>
<p>I feel sorry for the OP’s daughter. </p>