<p>
CGM said it best.</p>
<p>Seems to me that the parents tried to do a lot of things to investigate the situation and to get help, but they were blocked by everyone who should have helped them including the school district.</p>
<p>I feel very sorry for the parents and for the girl, who is probably not going to live the fairytale happy life she imagines. I wonder how the couple will financially survive as I can’t imagine that he’ll get other employment opportunities in teaching or coaching.</p>
<p>"The Hagers contacted police; they even tried to get a restraining order. </p>
<p>“We’ve tried everybody. We’ve been to the law. We’ve been to the school board,” Betty said. “Our family has come and tried to talk to her. We’ve had people on the phone with her for hours — family, friends. We’ve been to our pastor asking for guidance. We’ve been to his pastor.” </p>
<p>Meanwhile, the Hagers say Windy withdrew, refusing to speak to them until she asked them to sign a consent form so that she and her coach — a man more than twice her age — could get married."</p>
<p>“I see things is that you two see a fourteen-year-old as a child”</p>
<p>A 14-year old IS a child, without question. A YOUNG child, at that.</p>
<p>It is only rather recently in history that most people would agree with any of the most common statements in this thread. While history is not always a good judge of what’s right or wrong, it points out that this is definitely not a “no question” issue. There are lots of questions. The ones I’m most interested in are scientific, not emotional and circular. kelsmom is the only one here who is responding to me with any attempt at logic at all. I’m sorry, but “without question” at the end of your sentence doesn’t make your statement any less emotional than it otherwise would be. I was never a fourteen-year-old child, and I know many people my age AND in their twenties, thirties, and forties that feel the same about themselves at such an age. If, by some chance, Windy ends up happily married for the next fifty years – which, based on the situations of many people I know and many people those in this thread know, is completely possible (even if not likely) – the very existence of such a happy marriage proves you wrong. This is why it is so popular to pretend that one can be a victim their entire life without even knowing it. It justifies your bigotry. </p>
<p>If you truly thought I was a child (as a seventeen-year-old), I find it hard to think that none of you would be more concerned for the welfare of a child who believes as I do than you are with making me look quite incorrect. If you don’t think I’m a child, it’s ridiculous to assume Windy necessarily operates like one either.</p>
<p>“I was never a fourteen-year-old child, and I know many people my age AND in their twenties, thirties, and forties that feel the same about themselves at such an age.”</p>
<p>Really? You skipped from 13 to 15? Your posts sound very young, so I’m curious about that. As far as recent history, this is the age in which you live. A 40-year old man and a teenager is sexual abuse. I wonder why you’re trying to justify pedophilia. I have to admit, though, on a purely emotional basis, your posts are quite disturbing to me, as a mother of two teenaged daughters.</p>
<p>dis-grace, you avoided the questions</p>
<p>what if you had a little sister, 14 years old, who was dating and haveing sexual intercourse with a 40 year old, someone like your father</p>
<p>or, say your Father or your uncle, dating one of your friends little sisters</p>
<p>Let go back to your own father, shall we</p>
<p>It would be just fine with you if he was divorced from your mom, and started having sex with some freshman girls at your high school</p>
<p>or your uncle dating your best friend?</p>
<p>you talk about books, and studies, etc, you don’t talk about real life breathing people</p>
<p>and it has nothing to do with ditzy, for heavens sake, I have an 18 year old and a 16 year old, and if a man my Hs age tried to hook up with them- well…</p>
<p>disgrace, do you honestly think that a mature, healthy, together adult male would be interestesd in a 14 year old child</p>
<p>go watch any program on adults who pursue teens, almost ALL the adutls say they can’t hand;e real relationships, sp they go after teens or younger</p>
<p>disgrace, where do you draw the line, 14, 13, 12?</p>
<p>disgrace, as you are so defensive of pedophilia, as zoosermom said, I wonder what is going on with your own life that you think this way</p>
<p>and just because historically it was “okay” to marry at 14, well, slavery was also “okay” to many, doesn’t make it right</p>
<p>disgrace, have you ever heard of Nambla…your so called logic goes right along with theirs</p>
<p>Well, the Hagers obviously didn’t try hard enough. I saw them on the news, and it would appear that the coach is older than the girl’s father. As someone else pointed out, the coach and the girl look so much alike; she could pass for his daughter–easily. That’s neither here nor there, just a little weird. </p>
<p>I’m actually surprised the school couldn’t have fired him, simply for talking to her at 2 am for all hours of the night. While Windy and her parents obviously have issues, the coach has got to be certifiable and/or mentally- and emotionally-challenged, at the very least. Windy probably is, too, but she’s only 16, so she has an excuse. Someone should have been looking out for her. I’d also suggest that the entire community from which they sought help and guidance (and received neither, apparently) has to be off their collective rocker, too.</p>
<p>Dis-grace, there is much that you don’t know about the world. I realize you don’t see that … but someday you will. The adults posting here do not believe teens are incapable of thought or emotion. We understand that you have adult feelings. However, we truly feel that these kinds of relationships are predatory. Our beliefs are motivated by concern, not condescension.</p>
<p>The very fact that you state you have had so many relationships is a red flag to me. What have you been searching for at such a young age? Please consider spending time learning to love yourself instead of searching for that love from others. Mature relationships are built on a foundation of mutual friendship and respect … and they are strongest when both partners come into the relationship with a secure sense of self and a healthy love of self. Please do not confuse people taking care of you as a healthy relationship IF it is because you cannot provide that type of caring for yourself. Having someone to care for you is wonderful … NEEDING someone to care for you is not. I agree with the other posters who are concerned about why you feel as you do. Please do not view these posts as critical of you. They are not. We are a caring community, so please accept the comments in the spirit in which they are intended. </p>
<p>And if all else fails, at least we all said what we felt we needed to say!</p>
<p>There’s no psychologist on the planet that counts attraction to a fourteen-year-old as pedophilia. If they do, they obviously haven’t taken a look at the DSM in quite a while.</p>
<p>If I seem like I’m avoiding questions, it’s because I feel that I’ve had this argument many times before. Admittedly, I am taking the lazy route in recommending entire books. </p>
<p>kelsmom: </p>
<p>Thank you for reminding me that such opinions are out of concern. </p>
<p>I’ve had a lot of relationships, yes. I balk at the idea that any of them were predatory except possibly one – and he was the youngest person I ever dated. I react so strongly to you all because I am protective of the people I have loved, and I am quite aware that those of you who have been replying to me would count them as predators. On a purely emotional basis, that hurts me. Aside from all of the reasons I have for my opinions, reasons I believe to be logical, I do have an emotional stake in this.</p>
<p>I have wondered and thought about why I search for love from relationships, particularly relationships with older men. I would say my reasons are many, but I don’t find it unreasonable to say that it is partially because I grew up without a father, and so I’m seeking that. Is it unhealthy? I don’t know. Maybe. But if the relationships are pleasant, I see no reason to “fix” how I feel. Another reason, which is undoubtedly the most pronounced for me, is that I find myself incapable of being attracted to boys my own age. I really don’t think ANYONE can blame me for not thinking teenage boys are teh hotness ;p</p>
<p>But I have been single since January and plan to stay so until I am at least eighteen. I feel that, while I don’t regret my past relationships, I really do need to operate on my own at least for a while before I enter another.</p>
<p>As a side note, the age of consent in my state is sixteen; I’ve never done anything remotely illegal except that one time I stole the lipgloss from CVS when I was ten.</p>
<p>yuck .</p>
<p>“Fourteen. This seems like the most natural age, considering that almost all people of this age are well into their capability to either get someone pregnant or else get pregnant.”</p>
<p>dis-grace, your point about puberty is irrelevant. There have been frequent media reports of increasing numbers of girls going through ‘early puberty’, and it has long been known that any age between 9 and 18 is ‘normal’ for menstruation to begin. Are you therefore arguing that if a girl of, for example, 11 has gone through puberty it’s acceptable for her to be engaging in sexual relationships? </p>
<p>Just recently a 24-year old man was sentenced to jail for having sex with a 10-year old. Yes, a 10-year old. His excuse? “She looked 16 and it was consensual.” Presumably, she had gone through puberty because even doctors thought she was in her mid-teens. The more important question is, can a 10-year old consent to sex? Presumably your answer would be yes, since she’s post-pubescent. </p>
<p><a href=“http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6237480.stm[/url]”>http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6237480.stm</a></p>
<p>There is alot more to sex and relationships than biology. Just because someone is biologically capable to have sex does not mean that they are emotionally ready.</p>
<p>Good point, Layla. I realized the flaw in my idea before you replied to my post, which is why I deleted it. My question is, I guess, what emotional factors are important in being ready to have sex? Not asking to provoke argument. I honestly want to see what you all think because I myself am not as clear on this as I should be. It is difficult for me to understand how somebody could judge the emotional readiness of, say, a sixteen-year-old versus an eighteen-year-old, etc. It’s more difficult when context comes into it. Who’s more ready: The legally emancipated seventeen-year-old who’s already in college, or the drop-out twenty-year-old who lives at home? Is it really accurate to say the seventeen-year-old is less mature and more of a child? Merely an example, there…</p>
<p>dis-grace, I’m sorry if I came off as harsh in my previous post, I didn’t mean to. It’s just that this topic tends to rile me up! </p>
<p>As to your question about emotional factors… I guess my answer would be, do you know what to do if the worst happens? For example, do you know where to go for the Morning After Pill? Do you know where you can be tested for STIs? Have you recently been tested, so you know you aren’t passing anything on? Are you strong and secure enough in yourself to say ‘no thanks then’ if someone refuses to use a condom? </p>
<p>These are the practical, immediate issues. Beyond these are… would you be able to talk to your partner if you got pregnant, or you contracted an STI? If not, do you have someone else you can talk to? Would you be able to take care of a child, if you had to? If he left the next day and never called you back, how would you feel about yourself? If you left the next day and never called him back, how would you feel about yourself?</p>
<p>Essentially, I think people need to be aware that sex can be fantastic, but it comes with responsibilities, both to yourself and your partner.</p>
<p>That’s alright, Laylah - almost everyone gets riled up by such topics! I understand and wasn’t offended. I get riled up as well, though it may not be immediately obvious. I think it’s just hard for me to see any situation as all one way or all another way… I’m like that about all topics. I imagine my views will crystalize/solidify as more time passes.</p>
<p>Your suggestions for what people need to be able to know/do in order to have sex are quite accurate imo. It’s still difficult to define though, isn’t it? I can answer all of those questions for my forty-something mother though, and the answers do not bode well for her. </p>
<p>Do you know where to go for the Morning After Pill?
I’m fairly sure she knows, but she certainly never went to get it.</p>
<p>Do you know where you can be tested for STIs?
Aware, but…</p>
<p>Have you recently been tested, so you know you aren’t passing anything on?
Never been tested in her life.</p>
<p>Are you strong and secure enough in yourself to say ‘no thanks then’ if someone refuses to use a condom?
No. She wasn’t.</p>
<p>would you be able to talk to your partner if you got pregnant
Her “talk” to him involved, “Well, now we’ve got to get married.”</p>
<p>or you contracted an STI?
The one question I really don’t know about for her. It’s not like she would’ve known she’d had one anyway unless it would be a physically obvious one. She never got checked, never even thought of getting checked.</p>
<p>Would you be able to take care of a child, if you had to?
Apparently not, since I’m in foster care. I mean, I didn’t starve to death, and I never went without shoes, but…</p>
<p>If he left the next day and never called you back, how would you feel about yourself?
She routinely cried on my shoulder and claimed she wanted to die when such things happened.</p>
<p>If you left the next day and never called him back, how would you feel about yourself?
Ha. Haha. She assumed sex=her future husband.</p>
<p>Honest to God, aside from the fact that I’m glad I’m alive, the woman should not’ve been having sex.</p>
<p>disgrace, I ask you, if you had a little sister, age 14, would you care if your 40 year old boss had a romantic or anyother kind of relationship with her</p>
<p>this is a valid question which you have avoided answering, as you want to speak in generalities when it comes to adult relationships with minor children</p>
<p>I am harsh, because this is a very important issue and if minor children think its okay for adults to pursue them, or their friends, that is something that needs to be discussed</p>
<p>If you had a little sister who was called at night by a 40 year old, who said she loved him, who was having sex with him, and you found out about it, are you saying that you would be okay with it? really?</p>
<p>I would think that someone who has been in the system, would see that often children will accept love from the wrong people just to have some sense of being cared for</p>
<p>I have two teen girls, and if they thought a teacher was going after one of their classmates, they would be disgusted, as no adult should be going after children</p>
<p>I’d be upset about it from a legal standpoint. It’s against the law, so it’s pretty dumb. But aside from that, I’d honestly have to look in-depth at the context of the situation. The ages alone are not enough context for me to make a decision either way. I would say it would be unhealthy in the large majority of cases, but I’d say there would also be a few cases (even if only five in one-hundred - I don’t know) where it would not be harmful. </p>
<p>I do see a lot of people my age looking for love in the wrong way. I also see many adults doing so. It is quite easy for me to say that I’ve known many fourteen-year-olds that were more emotionally mature than my mother, for instance… though she obviously is not a good measuring stick. But she is an example of age not always been an indicator of maturity.</p>
<p>When you say that there are some circumstances that you would find it okay for a 40 year old to be sexing up your sister, there is nothing more to say, legal or not</p>
<p>Can you honestly say that a grown man of 40 or a grown woman of 40, that go after tweens is of the maturity level that is acceptable to you for your little sister</p>
<p>they idea that you think 14 year olds are at a maturity level to date men that could be your fathers age is disturbing at its very core, no matter how swell the guy seems</p>
<p>any man worth his salt would not even consider dating a 14 year old, his morals, ethics, values would stop him from going to that place, and any man who thinks it is okay does not care for the girl, no matter what he says, he cares about himself, and getting some young stuff</p>
<p>and just because the adult is immature, does not make the 14 year old mature, apples and oranges, and if the adult is immature, it doesn’t balance out if the 15 year old is “mature for her age”</p>
<p>believe me, no man or woman who actually has a good inner core would think about dating a 14 year old, those that do, well, are losers, as most of us have seen, and even those that have done it often admit to</p>
<p>harsh words, but they need to be said, and when you have a daughter and she is 14 and you see what you wrote, I can almost guarantee you will be shocked at your own words</p>
<p>no matter how wonderful that old guy is, how rich, how sweet, what he buys, how much he builds up the self esteem and ego, if its will a girl, it is wrong</p>
<p>well adjusted adults see that dating teen girls is wrong, so those that do think its okay, usually have serious issues dealing with people their own age, who wnat nothing to do with the, so you have to wonder why those adutls are rejected by those that are more and adjusted, so that the adults have to resort to children…what is wrong with them that they must turn to those that are so young for a relationship</p>
<p><a href=“http://teenadvice.about.com/od/teenlifefaqsandqas/a/agedifferences1.htm[/url]”>http://teenadvice.about.com/od/teenlifefaqsandqas/a/agedifferences1.htm</a></p>
<p>Adult-Teen Relationships: What are the Facts?
Directions: Mark each statement below T for True or F for False.
T 1. The majority of teenagers have sexual intercourse with partners close to their own
age.
T 2. Many babies born to 15-year-old teens are fathered by males 20 or older.
T 3. The younger a girl is when she first has sexual intercourse, the more likely it is that
she does not agree to it, and does not want to do it.
F 4. The “age of consent” to sexual intercourse is the same in every state.
T 5. The closer in age a teen girl and her sexual partner are, the more likely she is to use
contraception the first time she has sexual intercourse.
F 6. A teen girl is less likely to be exposed to a sexually transmitted infection (like
HIV/AIDS) by a partner 3 or more years older than by a partner closer to her own
age.
T 7. The younger a teen mother is, the greater the age gap is likely to be between her
and her baby’s father.
T 8. Half of fathers aged 20 or older whose infants are born to 14- to 17-year-old girls
have completed fewer years of school than is expected for their age.</p>