Transfer: Amherst vs Duke vs Columbia, decision needed! [Economics]

Hello! I’m a transfer student that was super lucky to be admitted to the following schools. I have a big decision to make but am lowkey a little worried about everything that’s going on with Columbia and worried if maybe a lack of funding + bad publicity will make good profs on high wage bills leave the school plus tank the prestige of the school (this is what happened at my old school that I’m transferring from). I’m looking to do economics and then law, and I’d describe myself as someone who is a little introverted and takes some time to warm up, but once you get to know me I’m pretty loud, passionate, and animated. I super value having a great community, one that’s genuinely passionate and engaged like me and not one that maybe feels a little stiflingly polite or PC (I’ve felt that sometimes at my old school). I’m also super worried about getting internships and want to factor that in as well. Please help me decide, this is so so hard because turning down any single one of these truly hurts my heart :sob:

If you would like a survey-based perspective on overall student satisfaction, note that Amherst apoears in this site:

Congrats on your acceptances. The schools on your list are each pretty different. Have you visited all?

How do the costs compare/does cost play into the decision at all?

Are you drawn to Columbia’s core? An urban setting? If no on either or both, drop it.

Amherst is small and feels rural, has an open curriculum with plenty of research opportunities. One can take classes at the consortium schools.

Duke is suburban and will have the biggest sports interest and attendance.

All these schools will be rigorous academically, and offer research opportunities.

None of these schools will have an advantage getting internships, nor will they necessarily help you do that, beyond the basic career counseling activities like resume writing and interview tips. It will be on you to find internship opportunities from all.

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Since you plan to major in economics, look over the course offerings in econ for each school.

Columbia University should be an easy yes or no as the most distinguishing factors are the core curriculum and the location in NYC.

Are you currently attending an LAC or a National University ? Do you want to continue in a small or large environment ?

Any special programs or housing for transfer students at Amherst College or at Duke University ?

Many at Duke will have joined a frat or sorority which might affect your decision.

Since you plan to go to law school, Amherst College may be of interest to you as it sends a very significant portion of its students to elite law schools.

If you want Columbia (core & NYC), then the decision should be easy.

If you want a small school, then Amherst College is the clear choice.

If you prefer more moderate weather and thriving sports scene, then Duke University should be at the top of your list.

If your major is the most important consideration for you, then you need to scrutinize the course offerings at each school for economics.

Congratulations on 3 great options !

(Are you willing to share more info. regarding your current school ? What do you like & dislike about your current school ? Are you a rising sophomores or a rising junior ?)

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Congrats on 3 great choices. This is a win-win-win scenario, so don’t sweat too hard on it – whichever you pick with end up find.

Some other commenters have hit on some of the differences between these schools, but want to comment on some of your specific concerns…

Very little chance of this happening and to the extent it may, it won’t be the for the reasons you say and it will likely happen at those other schools too. Let’s break it down. First, in terms of funding cuts, the media has focused on a couple high profile examples because the Trump Administration used them to draw attention. But the reality is they have started cutting research funding to most universities that receive federal money, not just those few examples. This is because they have frozen or cut the underlying program and agencies funding that goes to hundreds of colleges. I just saw in the REU subreddit recently people lamenting Duke canceling an REU because they had lost funding, for example. Trump also named Bowdoin as a target, so even LACs like Amherst are not safe. It would be a mistake to pick the possibility of federal funding cuts as a primary reason to pick one of these over the other.

Second, it’s very possible Columbia will end up being the “example” Trump uses of “making a deal” just like he did yesterday with the UK trade deal. Both the administration and the Republican Congressional committee praised Columbia’s quick response to the brief protest in the Butler reading room. The administration will want a counterpoint to Harvard to show – which is exactly what he’s doing with the UK to encourage other trade partners. Columbia continues to be in negotiations with them and unlikely some other schools the Administration has not this far escalated the cuts which suggests they are at least still in productive talks. Also, Columbia, like Harvard has options if they wanted to exercise them, such as following Harvard and Princeton’s lead in taking out bonds using the collateral of their $15B endowment and real estate (they are the largest private land owner in NYC).

If there is anything that may chase a few professors away it won’t be the college going broke, it might be the fact that the college DOES make a deal with Trump. But it would likely be a margin number of profs if so, and so far that hasn’t happened. Regardless of people’s personal views, leaving an Ivy tenure is a personal sacrifice.

To put things in perspective, if you added up all of the students involved in the protests, encampment and occupation of Hamilton Hall during the prior school year plus the students involved in the brief Butler protest this week, it’s less than 1% of the Columbia student body. The vast, vast majority have had nothing to do with it and have mostly be able to go about their normal college student lives. The occasional spotlight of the media presents a very distorted view of daily life on campus, which is pretty normal. Prior to the Butler thing this week, there’s been very little protest activity on campus this school year, and no encampments. The only attempts at occupations (the Butler one and the prior one at the Barnard campus nearby months ago) were shut down within a few hours and all the students involved immediately suspended and barred from campus (pending fuller reviews that either did or may lead to expulsions. It’s a very different situation that the prior year.

Any of these 3 colleges can be great environments for all you describe, though I would say its easier to find community in an LAC like Amherst than the other two which are far larger.

No matter where you go, the bulk of internship finding will be up to you just massively working it – tons and tons of applications, working alumni contacts via LinkedIn, etc. All 3 will have resources to help with resume, interviewing, etc., but none will personally get you the gigs. All will be competitive for most gigs, though there’s a handful of elite hedge funds that would likely bias toward Columbia (based on my personal experience in hiring at one). That said, Columbia would have the locational advantage of being able to consider school year internships or work in NYC finance if that’s an interest.

Good luck.

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Personally, I would lean toward Amherst. It doesn’t depend on government money to the same extent as your other choices.

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These analyses may offer you insight on the economics departments of your three choices:

How does the core curriculum apply to transfers? I would look into if one would have to take them “off cycle” from their peers and how that might affect the overall experience.

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Still usually have to do most of the core, though you can petition out of some classes depending on circumstances. For example, probably easy to substitute Global Core or language, harder for Lit Him, etc.

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As many posters have mentioned, I have seldom seen three more different (though all excellent) schools listed as final choices.

A SLAC in a classic small college town, a southern D-1 sports powerhouse with greek life, the NYC Ivy.

If I were making the decision, I would remove any and all concerns about excellence, placement in post-grad careers or schools, quality of profs. I’d instead focus on the rather significant differences between the three schools overall.

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These are relative peers in terms of program and overall strength.

Setting, vibe, and curricular differences should help you make the right decision.

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I’ve not yet had the chance to visit Amherst or Duke but I toured around Columbia and definitely like it a lot as I’m a city boy at heart! I would say I’m neutral/slightly negative towards the Core because I’m looking to double major. I did, however, watch this one video of a dad walking around Duke with his daughter and the facilities and campus looked absolutely GORGEOUS. I’m sure visiting in person would clear up some things but considering the poster wasn’t an official promoter of Duke material or anything, deciding to post such a video of his own volition makes me think that Duke campus/dorm/dining wise must at least be better than Columbia. Funnily enough, I’m hugely into sports but not basketball! I’m more of a soccer guy but I’ve definitely considered the sports craze at Duke to be a good thing because I get super into it as well and I love people who are genuinely passionate about something. I’ve spoken with some Amherst students about their time there and they definitely say a lot about how many resources they have to find jobs, internships and stuff and really emphasize how good the professors are as well as a tightly knit community. I come from a liberal arts college too with a professed “tightly knit community” that has alienated a lot of us that are transferring out of the college so it kind of scares me if Amherst is the same, despite the almost sure outcome of being more supported career+academics-wise. I would say the biggest trouble for me is that each of the schools seems to have a pro or a con that makes me wonder how good a school will fit me, and I’m not sure how much I want to step outside my comfort zone which I’m aware I may need to do to really find the college experience I’ve been looking for.

Comparing your current school’s retention rate to that of Amherst may offer you perspective on this: https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-liberal-arts-colleges/freshmen-least-most-likely-return.

I’m currently at an LAC right now, and I’d say the tough part is that one half of my brain is telling me I should give the small environment another shot (I’d say the circumstances my current LAC are under are not reflective of all LAC environments) and the other half is telling me I should go to a large one that brings me out of my comfort zone socially but challenges me in the best kind of way. I’m pretty sure that for transfers at Amherst, they have a specific house that houses all the transfers which is nice because, as a student there told me over the phone, it’s like you automatically have 20 friends right off the bat. Meanwhile, I’m not really sure what Duke’s policy is, but I’m probably not considering joining a frat at the moment, although I did hear they moved all the frats and sororities off campus recently. You make a good point for Amherst’s feeding into law schools, but Columbia and Duke don’t seem to rank too far behind. Columbia is not the easiest option for me because I’m also looking for how good my career prospects may look depending on the economy (I’m planning to really dig in my all 100% into law if it takes a turn for the worse, but if not, my economics degree I would hope would give me an option to come out of undergrad directly and work). However, socially, I’ve seen people say completely polar opposite things about Columbia with some saying that you can have a really great time, and others saying that it’s the worst thing in the world. I would say right now, the defining factor for me choosing a school would be how social the community is, and how genuine they are (I worry about Columbia and Amherst’s students often being labeled as arrogant or pretentious).

My current school is an LAC, and I would say my main problems with it are that it’s pretty bad for Economics (the economics department here is known for being quite awful, and some of the professors here are not the best in that specific area including some of my current ones), and that socially, the school has felt alienating because many students are polite to your face here but also do things like ignore your hellos, pass rumors behind each other’s backs, and are hard to talk to at times because they don’t appear to be genuine (I’ve heard more fake laughter in around one month at this school than anywhere else in my life). It’s getting a little exhausting because I would describe myself that’s usually quite happy otherwise, but it’s really sent me spiralling because sometimes I wonder if I’m doing something wrong by being too cheerful or trying to reach out. The purported sense of community that I heard about again and again is what drew me to this school, but it’s also now what is driving me to leave (some acquaintances/friends I have say the exact same thing and are also in the process of either transferring out or wanting to transfer out next year, which, for such a small school, seems to be a lot of people).

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Perhaps I missed the information, but, for clarity, will you be transferring into your sophomore or junior year?

Well, it certainly sounds as if you are leaning toward Columbia. It’s the one school you’ve visited; it still seems to be in the running despite a lot of negative publicity that is unlikely to let up for the foreseeable future.

Go with the devil you know rather than the ones you don’t.

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The Duke campus is stunning. The food is superb. (I have no connection to Duke). But it is a bit of a walled garden. You’ve seen Columbia. Amherst has a tiny downtown that adjoins the campus. No-one would ever mistake Amherst’s dining hall for Duke’s. :slight_smile:

The smallness of the LAC community and course offerings/professors is having a negative effect on your experience. Clearly, you need a larger environment.

I wonder whether Columbia might be too much of a change as it is not a docile environment.

Regardless of your choice, all 3 options should offer a much better academic & social experience.

Do not understand this at all. Columbia is a fine place to launch with just a BA (certainly equal to if not superior to your other choices).

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