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Daughter sent out her app just ahead of the deadline. OOS applicant. Skipped the “optional” essay for the business school. Probably not the best way to play that, but I didn’t want to have the fight. UNC oos is expensive. She is excited, parents less so based on price.
Hopefully you gave her a max out of pocket, if that’s the case.
If not, then you run that risk of - she gets in and you are in essence, forced, to fork it over.
Best to have that absolute max budget discussion prior to applying. For example, mine would have applied to UVA but we are full pay and gave her a $50K budget (which at the time worked for UNC), so she just applied there. If a school mas merit, but she doesn’t get enough to hit the budget, agree up front - it has to be gone.
Any school yours applies to - you want to ensure - at least the chance it could get to your budget.
Best to ensure all are on the same page up front, if you haven’t done that. It could save you heartache later. No one wants to tell their kid no, especially when the application now becomes an opportunity.
You are 100% correct. She has been told she can apply to any school she likes, as long as it’s a good faith effort. But I emphasized we may not just pay for anywhere she wants to go. In theory she understands that. Will her 17 yo mind remember? Not sure. But I totally get and agree with your point.
daughter applied OOS. I think it’s a reach school for her. She’s a 4.0 UW with 9 ap classes. Her school doesn’t rank and doesn’t do honors classes, just AP. She is NMSF and finalist pending, but SAT wasn’t great at 1540 (740 math and 800 RW). It’s not her top pick so not crushing. Good luck to everyone.
1540 is incredible and above the 75th percentile at UNC (and not everyone provided a test so you know it’s really higher than that).
Yes, UNC is a hard admit OOS so reach is fine but plenty get into reaches and she’ll likely, at least academically, be above the norm at UNC.
Really the only question is - do you want to spend $65-70K a year where you can go for near free, thanks to NMF.
Best of luck to your student - while it’s nice to assume it’s a reach so there’s no disappointment, and there’s no assurance she’ll get in and it’s a hard in - but to say her SAT wasn’t great tells me your expectations are beyond insane And with a 4.0 and all APs, why not her?
Best of luck to her. I’m sure she’ll be great wherever she ends up.
I should have clarified that those are her words, not mine. She is very competitive. I don’t actually put a ton of merit in grades because in many schools these days, it’s like an episode of Oprah. “you get and A and you get an A and you get an A”.
I’m more in line with what the Kinko’s founder once said, "A students work for the B students, the C students run the businesses, and the D students have their names on buildings"
However, it is all relative. For many kids, a 740 math is great. For my D, it wasn’t great by her standards. Obviously the 800 RW is great and it positively skewed the over all number.
Everyone’s standards are different. Your standards, for what you believe to be great, are based (presumably) on either your experience or your child’s experience, so my statement was obviously ridiculous for your scenario.
As it related to NC, my D is OOS. If you are here on this thread, you know how competitive it is for OOS applicants. As another commenter mentioned, she already has full ride options based on her academic accomplishments. To get accepted and remain pari passu with other schools, she’d need merit money which is pretty tight for OOS applicants.
So, if her SAT scores aren’t sufficient enough for NC to offer merit money, than how would you (situationally) describe her SAT scores?
Agreed - As are given out like candy on Halloween. Hence, the inflation. That’s why they have rank (where they do) and many are going back to tests, even if they remain optional (it’s a reality, they’re often not, except for few).
I hate, though, she puts that much pressure on herself. 1540 is crazy and National Merit is unbelievable.
UNC merit is highly unlikely but not impossible. Last year, we had a parent from New England who still posts - their student won a full ride via the Morehead Cain program she might look at - if she wants to invest in UNC (you said it’s not the top choice). The high school has to nominate and I’m not sure if the deadline has passed.
The NC publics have an overall cap (in the system) and the overall % they can accept from OOS. But they do accept many OOS. It looks like UNC is 18%, as updated earlier this year. So it’s still a healthy #.
UNC says - Criteria include academic achievement, leadership qualities, commitment to service and potential for success at the University. Scholarships range in value from $3,000 all the way up to full cost of attendance. If you are selected for an Academic Scholarship, you will see your scholarship offer letter in yourMyCarolina portal. Academic Scholarship offers are extended at the same time as admission to Carolina, as are some University Scholarship offers.
I don’t know as I’m not an adcom - but I’m guessing a 1540 or 1590 or 1500 won’t impact the merit she gets. That will be but one small piece of an overall application.
UNC gave 275 merit scholarships last year, averaging $7,233. Now, if that includes in-state $s, then OOS could be higher. That’s out of 4,632 first years.
So I think:
For some schools that she’s applying RD, she can retake for a higher score. I wouldn’t. I don’t think it moves the needle. Others where she’s applied, that 1,540 is baked. She’s competitive, as you say, but it may be also a great time to have her understand that not everything in life will go your way and sometimes you have to look at the potential of getting higher vs. what it cost you (in time away from school or college apps or friends) assuming she preps. Could be a good life lesson for her to decide if that tradeoff is worth it or not to her - for really RD apps I’m assuming.
I can’t imagine a 1550 or 60 or 70 etc. moves the needle for merit - as opposed to the entirety of her application doing so.
Statistically, it’s unlikely she gets merit - just based on the #s.
When you said, this, I wondered - what are her top choices? If she has schools she would 100% choose over UNC and that she’s likely to get into, why apply to UNC at all?
Or was saying that (by her) a mechanism to deflect if she doesn’t get in.
I just think it’s too hard to know -
If you get in and
if you get any aid, let alone enough aid (they do meet need if you have “need”
But I do think, based on what you described academically - if the rest of the app holds suit - LOR, essays and more - she’d be in the upper 10 or 20% of OOS apps - and while they restrict, there’s still a healthy amount accepted.
Best of luck to her.
Below is the % of OOS allowed at each school, updated earlier this year.
A. The cap shall be 18 percent for Appalachian State University, North Carolina State University at Raleigh, University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, University of North Carolina at Charlotte, and University of North Carolina Wilmington.
B. The cap shall be 25 percent for East Carolina University, Fayetteville State University, University of North Carolina at Greensboro, University of North Carolina at Pembroke, and Western Carolina University.
C. The cap shall be 35 percent for North Carolina Agricultural & Technical State University,4 North Carolina Central University, University of North Carolina Asheville, and Winston-Salem State University.
D. The cap shall be 50 percent for Elizabeth City State University.
My daughter graduated OOS several years ago. It isn’t just test scores that determine merit (many have high scores), it’s other things as well. Fyi her scores are excellent.
Your assumption is that scores drive out of state merit. It is only part of the equation. As someone else mentioned, look at the Morehead qualifications to get a sense of what Carolina values.
I would describe the score as necessary but not necessarily sufficient for OOS acceptance and/or merit. +40 more points wouldn’t mean as much as 4-year varsity sports captain or part time employment or first generation etc. This is one of the hardest acceptances to predict for OOS.
UNC values leadership and giving back to your community, among other things. As noted, it is hard to predict out of state acceptance. Also keep in mind that OOS applications are typically much higher than in-state, and they have to abide by the OOS cap.
This is getting real.
And with a 4.0 and all APs, why not her?