<p>baylors gonna go way up in the national universities with top professors from ivy leagues and other top schools coming to teach in a faith based environment. also the acceptance rate falling to 40 percent helps too.</p>
<p>Um people, last time I checked, ND had, on average, higher SAT scores than Virginia, Wake Forest, Michigan, UNC, and USC. </p>
<p>As well, ND alumni are probably the most faithful alumni you will find at ANY school (except for Princeton). Simply put, the alumni are fanatical; they will go to any length to help an ND grad. This strong alumni network alone almost makes ND worth the cost. </p>
<p>It’s also sheer ignorance to say that most of the above schools are better academically than ND. Look at the faculty to student ratio: ND only has 1900 in their freshman class.</p>
<p>One thing is that ND does not have a lot of minorities; it has always had a “jock” stereotype. This turns a lot of Asians off, and they don’t apply in large numbers to ND. I agree that this may weaken the applicant pool. But, pound for pound, I don’t know how anyone can say, with a straight face, that Wake Forest and USC are better schools academically that ND. </p>
<p>Yes, ND is not, and will never be an Ivy league. But it’s not far behind.</p>
<p>I have a straight face and am saying "WAKE FOREST IS A BETTER SCHOOL THAN nd! (In My Opinion!) and I respect yours! :)</p>
<p>Well, I KNOW that UM, UNC, UVa are all better, deeper, more accomplished schools than ND. Goes to show how placing too much emphasis on the students leads to bad decisions.</p>
<p>"Um people, last time I checked, ND had, on average, higher SAT scores than Virginia, Wake Forest, Michigan, UNC, and USC. "</p>
<p>Notre Dame (in my opinion) is better than all those schools. Wake Forest is overranked in US News; most people compare it to George Washington and the like or at least NYU. </p>
<p>Note: This is all my opinion but most of it is based on fact which I’m too lazy to pull up. These facts include Notre Dame’s higher yield, peer assessment, SAT scores, and quality of student body.</p>
<p>I have a lot of time now. lol
1.princeton
harvard
3.yale
4.stanford
5.mit
6.caltech
7.duke
8.penn
9.dartmouth
10.columbia
11.cornell
12.northwestern
13.brown
14.washu
15.johns hopkins
16.chicago
17.rice
18.notre dame
19.berkeley
20.vanderbilt
virginia</p>
<p>Notre Dame is a great school and usually ranked 16-18th every year. It has a top 20-25 endowment, great physical campus, and top 5 alumni network. As a Catholic school, it does not appeal to all potential students, nor has ND watered doen its Catholicism as Georgetown has done in an effort to attract more non-Catholic applicants. But ND is in an academic sense a better school than the 'new money Emory, WashU, Vandy, and certainly Wake Forest. By most polls Wake is only the 4 best school in the tarheel state with Duke way ahead, and Davidson and Carolina slightly ahead.</p>
<p>First off, the highest Sats does not make the better school. Many a slacker has a high Sat… Just because a school is expensive does not make it lesser… and just because it is old does not make it better- new money can equal new ideas. Get with the times, and learn, people! And remember, there is a lid for every pot!:)</p>
<p>If you don’t want to go by SATs, njmom, how have you determined that ND is not as good academically as Wake Forest? SAT scores don’t tell the whole story, but they’re a pretty good indicator of the average student’s intelligence.</p>
<p>I never said do not use them- I said the higher they are does not mean it is a better school. Define better first of all, I think the U.S. News rankings are quite fair, be happy with ND’s ranking. I PERSONALLY prefer Wake (My son sure does, he will be attending in the fall!:)) He is a very good student, but Wake had the academics, small class size, great sports, (maybe not basketball this year!:() liberal art type school, not to mention fabulous weather for those who like to be outside. BETTER to him! As I said before, to each their own.</p>
<p>I never said do not use them- I said the higher they are does not mean it is a better school. Define better first of all, I think the U.S. News rankings are quite fair, be happy with ND’s ranking. I PERSONALLY prefer Wake (My son sure does, he will be attending in the fall!:)) He is a very good student, but Wake had the academics, small class size, great sports, (maybe not basketball this year!:() liberal art type school, not to mention fabulous weather for those who like to be outside. BETTER to him! As I said before, to each their own.</p>
<p>ACA, your “facts” need some looking up. You say, with so much confidence I might add, that;</p>
<p>“This is all my opinion but most of it is based on fact which I’m too lazy to pull up. These facts include Notre Dame’s higher yield, peer assessment, SAT scores, and quality of student body”</p>
<p>Yes, Notre Dame has a higher yield rate most universities, primarily because it is a Catholic school and its applicants really want to go to a Catholic univeristy. But I am not sure how you figured that Notre Dame has a higher peer assessment score. Accordong to the latest USNWR, here are the peer assessment scores of the 5 universities in question:</p>
<p>Michigan: 4.5/5.0
UVA: 4.3/5.0
Notre Dame: 3.9/5.0
USC: 3.9/5.0
Wake: 3.5/5.0</p>
<p>With the exception of Wake, Notre Dame’s peer assessment score is not higher than the other schools. In “fact”, Notre Dame’s peer assessment score is significantly lower than UVA’s and Michigan’s.</p>
<p>And Notre Dame’s SAT ranges aren’t higher than USC or higher than Michigan and UVA if you consider that those two publics report their SAT ranges according to the higher score in one sitting rather than the highest scores in multiple sittings.</p>
<p>Next time you state facts, don’t be too lazy to look them up first!</p>
<p>SAT’s indicate intelligence? Why didn’t anyone tell me this?</p>
<p>Alex I said it was my opinion that ND was better than those schools. </p>
<p>When I listed the categories, I did not mean that ND was better in EVERY category than those schools. I wasn’t really focusing on UVA/Umich as I was on ND vs USC/Wake.</p>
<p>ACA, you are missing something here. No offense to Indiana or the Midwest, but there aren’t a LOT of prestigious schools located in that neck of the woods. Meanwhile, NC and CA have IMO the two best higher educational systems in America. Wake has CH, Duke, and Davidson down the street. Vanderbilt, Emory, Georgia Tech, UVA, W and M are all within close proximity. Name one major school near Notre Dame. Oh wait…you can’t. Its an unfair comparison. Perhaps if USC or Wake was in the middle of America they would be considered “more prestigious” because they are not overshadowed by the likes of UCB and Duke.</p>
<p>U Chicago, Northwestern for starters. Both within about an hour of ND.</p>
<p>They are both 90 miles away and they are the closest schools.</p>
<p>OK 1.5 hours. So how far are Duke and CH from Wake?? About the same.</p>
<p>I don’t want to interrupt the nice brawl you guys are having, but am I being paranoid when I sense some anti-Catholic bias in the peer assessment ratings? Georgetown, ND, and BC all seem to get underrated. Sorry if somebody already mentioned this. I was at mass lighting a candle for the soul of Frank Sinatra and didn’t have time to read all 26 pages of this thread.</p>
<p>I am not sure I follow your reasoning Willmingtonwave. Winston Salem is 70 miles away from Davidson, 80 miles away from Chapel Hill and Durham. I don’t see how 90 miles is so much worse than 70 or 80 miles. </p>
<p>And then, you list schools that are a good 200-400 miles away from Winston Salem, like UVA, Emory, Vanderbilt, etc…Within 200-400 miles from Notre Dame, you have Chicago, Grinnell, Michigan, Northwestern, Oberlin, Washington University and Wisconsin-Madison.</p>