<p>“I’m not putting Berkeley on the pedestal. I just think it deserves to be in the top 15 or 18. But then again, USNews is not a ranking of academic quality, so it’s acceptable that Berkeley would not be ranked in the top 20.”</p>
<p>It’s so obvious the formula at USNWR has been further tweaed to favor rich, private schools.</p>
<p>OK, my data was a year behind, it has not changed much. It is now 520-640 for CR at UC Davis. I will give them credit, they only have a little more than 15% of their students below the national average. <a href=“http://www.sariweb.ucdavis.edu/commondataset/cds20092010.pdf[/url]”>http://www.sariweb.ucdavis.edu/commondataset/cds20092010.pdf</a> Page 10</p>
<p>Doesn’t change my point in the least.</p>
<p>Schmaltz. Michigan, along with quite a few others, is academically SUPERIOR to schools like ND, Georgetown, and BC. I don’t care how well/high either of the forementioned ones are ranked by USNWR, nothing is going to change my mind on that. The only thing that I am getting tired of is all of this anti-catholic paranoia nonsense and anti-catholic bias I keep hearing about from several posters on CC when it comes to these schools not being ranked even higher than they currently are. The main reason that those schools are rated as highly as they are is PRECISELY because they ARE Catholic institutions to begin with. Roman Catholics are the largest single religious group in this country and there are many top students who want to attend those schools simply because they are Catholic affiliated. Overrated if you ask me, because their academic quality isn’t nearly as good overall as other highly ranked schools that are listed closely near them at USNWR. As to why their PA suffers, I think whoever stated that these schools are being devalued by other institutions is correct. Oftentimes, because of the true lack of academic freedom in all aspects , many top professors would NEVER go to any of these schools. Once again, you can’t have it both ways.</p>
<p>@alam1 actually the ranking is wrong and Rice + Vandy = 17 ; Emory = 20… sorry =p</p>
<p>Can ANYONE defend the ranking of UC Davis at #39 when over 25% of their students are BELOW the national average regarding their SAT CR score. UC Davis 25th% for CR: 490!!</p>
<p>I think some of the UCs have a high % of folks who are immigrants and for whom English is a second language…</p>
<p>rjkofnovi, you must have missed my zillions of posts in which I cautioned people NOT to interpret minor differences in ranking as indicitive of actual differences in academic quality. So I’m the last person who’d claim that, for example, Wake’s ranking means it’s “better” than Michigan. These rankings are good as a parlor game…that is all.</p>
<hr>
<p>“The only thing that I am getting tired of is all of this anti-catholic paranoia nonsense and anti-catholic bias I keep hearing about from several posters on CC…”</p>
<p>“I think whoever stated that these schools are being devalued by other institutions is correct. Oftentimes, because of the true lack of academic freedom in all aspects , many top professors would NEVER go to any of these schools. Once again, you can’t have it both ways.”</p>
<p>So you make wild claims about academic freedom at Catholic colleges while at the same time you’re tired of hearing about anti-Catholic bias? I think you’re the one who can’t have it both ways. And do you really think there is academic freedom for conservative thought in the poli sci, history, and English departments at most top colleges?</p>
<p>^^I am not the one who is constantly bringing up this issue to attention on these boards. Mine is ONLY a response to others who do.</p>
<p>columbia!! 
roar lion roar!!</p>
<p>@ seadogoverseas</p>
<p>i hate to say this…but confidentialcoll told you so
(and you were soon to call his predicted rankings crap 
)
guess his list was pretty credible huh?</p>
<p>RML,</p>
<p>I’m sure it’s been mentioned in this thread somewhere, but if we were to use the PA scores, I’m sure Berkeley would be ranked much, much higher. I don’t have a premium subscription, but Cal usually has a high PA score.</p>
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<p>For graduate school, Berkeley is equal to, if not above Stanford in virtually every field.</p>
<p>While I realize that graduate strength does not translate into a strong undergrad program, the two definitely have a strong correlation.</p>
<p>^^^Not according to the “experts” here on CC.</p>
<p>“And do you really think there is academic freedom for conservative thought in the poli sci, history, and English departments at most top colleges?
Schmaltz is offline” </p>
<p>Perhaps not Schmaltz, however it doesn’t seem to be hurting those schools who are listed at the top academically from attracting the best talent.</p>
<p>Congrats to Columbia, Wake, USC, Holy Cross, Boston College!</p>
<p>Even people on CC recognize that Berkeley is among the top five universities for grad school (including professional schools) in the world. Other ones being a combination of Harvard, Stanford, UChicago, MIT, Yale, Cambridge, etc.</p>
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</p>
<p>^^If this ever happens, I would call 100% ********. I know plenty of kids who go there, and they’re not the same students as kids who go on to the Ivies. Yes, I began the nasty.</p>
<p>ND is a great school, and maybe it’s because I’m very liberal and therefore biased, but from what I’ve seen, ND attracts different students than the Ivies (mostly white Catholic).</p>
<p>Notre Dame should not be 17. It should be like 5-10 rank down.</p>
<p>this reminds me of people at my school fighting over the rank of fraternities and sororities :)</p>
<p>Fordham will catch up to BC soon.</p>
<p>
Why? Does that mean that the undergrad education at Williams and Amherst is poor, or even not as good as at UCLA? By your reasoning that has to be so, since they have no graduate school.</p>
<p>
To the extent that the same professors teach both undergraduate and graduate students, yes. Faculty strength is only a part of educational quality, however. A number of other factors - the breadth and number of courses offered, class sizes, ease of getting into classes, and even the availability of undergraduate research - are also important for most students, though rankings typically do not take those factors into account. </p>
<p>I have nothing against publics - I am very fond of my state’s flagship (UNC), and I’m attending a public university myself. Posts like the one below, however, recently gave me pause.
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<p>There’s no question that Berkeley has one of the highest concentrations of brainpower anywhere. The question is, what are they doing with it, and how accessible is it to students in a timely fashion?</p>