@IzzoOne Actually, thinking back over it, I agree with you. I even looked at the (grad school) rankings from USNews, and UVA is ranked substantially higher in each of its science programs. I stand corrected.
I’m talking about bachelor of science completion rate not bachelor of arts in the sciences lol. Tech does offer significantly more BSs than BAs each year. Our president has made comments there’s a “reputation gap” where departments don’t deserve their rank. every UVA student knows she was referring to our science and math
You are referencing a quote from 6 years ago. In the interim, TS made tremendous progress in hiring faculty and closing the salary discrepancy with peer institutions ( as was probably her agenda with this quote.) She was didn’t handle PR well (see Rolling Stone fiasco) and as an advocate for UVa alumni and student body but made significant strides with the faculty.
Back to the original argument - a comparison based on the number of degrees being granted in the sciences is a curious one. Just because degrees are bestowed that doesn’t speak to their quality only their quantity.
As an aside, I am beyond excited to have started the Jim Ryan era at UVa. This quote just reminded me why…
Ouch. Way to dump on my BA in mathematics without knowing me. It’s okay though, my mediocre math education from UVA enabled me to qualify as an Actuary in under two and a half years and reach a six-figure salary before the age of 26. What a disappointment.
Also, your BA vs. BS argument for comparing the strength of UVA’s and VTech’s math and statistics departments is invalid. UVA doesn’t offer a BS in math due to the philosophical preference in the College of Arts and Sciences to only award BS degrees to natural sciences. Math is not a natural science nor is it really a science for that matter (in my opinion)- it’s an art. Math is an art that uses human-defined axioms to help us quantitatively describe natural and artificial phenomena occurring around us.
Oh yeah, Berkeley also only offers BAs in mathematics: http://guide.berkeley.edu/undergraduate/degree-programs/mathematics/ - be sure to tell them how bad they’re at the sciences and mathematics focused disciplines.
Go look at graduation archives and count how many bachelors of science are awarded every year. In the 2017 commencement archive UVA granted about 167 science degrees and tech awarded 1171 science degrees. That is approximately SEVEN times as many. I can’t believe you guys are seriously arguing with me on this without looking at the facts
My community college has 2 times as many biology labs offered than UVAs biology department. I am going to agree with the person who said UVA is worthless in science and math.
@mtk4yu the State Council of Higher Education Site, which is considered the definitive source in Virginia, says UVA awarded 1,509 STEM-H Bachelors degrees in 2016-17. That was 37.6% of the total number. Tech awarded 3,031, which was 50.9% of the total. http://research.schev.edu//completions/stem_trends.asp
So VT awarded about 2X as many STEM-H degrees, but of course it is larger. Adjusting for size, VT awarded about 35% more.
thanks for sharing the website it was interesting however
here are links and page numbers for graduation archives listing the number of bachelors of science awarded at each school
on page 29 bachelors of science awarded in astronomy, biology, chemistry, physics and environmental science
Tech
https://vt.edu/content/dam/vt_edu/commencement/spring-2017/2017CommencementProgram_final.pdf
on pages 40-45 bachelors of science in agribusiness, agricultural science, animal and poultry sciences, biochemistry, crop and soil, dairy science, environmental science, food science and technology, human nutrition food and exercise, and environmental horticulture
on page 70-72 bachelors of science in meterology, fish conservation, wildlife conservation, environmental informatics, environmental resources management, forestry, natural resources management, sustainable biomaterials, and water resources policy management
pg 73-78 bachelors of science in biochemistry (you can get a version in the life sciences or the science department), biological sciences, chemistry, geosciences, mathematics, physics, statistics, computational modeling and data analytics, microbiology, nanoscience, and neuroscience,
go ahead and count them and compare. I only counted the science related ones and not the ones in the social sciences or business. this method has a direct breakdown of each major. I am new here so I hope the links work
@You focus on BS degrees and I think that is misleading. There are differences in how institutions decide on BS or BA designations. As indicated in a prior post, UVA does not use BA for math or statistics and they are not alone in that, and computer science majors can get a BS through the engineering school or a BA through arts and sciences The SCHEV data counts degrees by field and that should be a better indicator.
But more to the point, quantity doesn’t equal quality. If that was the case, both VT and UVA might be able to claim supremacy over Caltech in sciences. If you want to evaluate quality of department faculty, you might want to look at graduate ratings in science fields in USNews and research spending. But these are probably not very good indicators of undergraduate education quality.
Just to follow up on my previous post, if you look at graduate science rankings in USNews, UVA is ranked higher in Biology, Chemistry, Computer Science, Math, and Physics. Virginia Tech is ranked higher in Earth Science and Statistics.
how would uva claim supremacy over Caltech in the sciences? cal tech awarded 163 degrees in science with only 979 undergraduate students. UVA awarded a pathetic 167 with an undergraduate size of 16331. that’s not even a comparison Caltech destroys UVA in science. once you normalize per size cal tech actually awarded the most bachelors of science compared to both UVA and va tech.
http://commencement.caltech.edu/documents/80-caltech_commencement_program-2017.pdf
Here is the link to University of Michigans graduation.on pg 46-52
http://commencement.umich.edu/spring-commencement/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2014/01/2017-Program.pdf
I can’t take you guys seriously if you actually don’t think our science departments are seriously underperforming
@mtk4yu above you say “I can’t take you guys seriously if you actually don’t think our (UVA’s) science departments are seriously underperforming”
On the Virginia Tech forum you point to this thread and say “the UVA students on the UVA board are actually trying to argue UVA’s science departments are better than tech’s even though tech grants 7 times as many bachelors of science every year than UVA.”
Which school are you really aligned with?
@mtk4yu “how would uva claim supremacy over Caltech in the sciences? cal tech awarded 163 degrees in science with only 979 undergraduate students. UVA awarded a pathetic 167 with an undergraduate size of 16331. that’s not even a comparison Caltech destroys UVA in science. once you normalize per size cal tech actually awarded the most bachelors of science compared to both UVA and va tech.”
If you read it again you can see it was a rhetorical comment about quantity vs quality since not too many schools can go toe-to-toe with Caltech in sciences.
Those BA’s is Math from UVA have pretty good starting salaries, does it really matter how many degrees are awarded?
UVA class of 2016 bachelors degree in Math average salary $76,000
https://career.virginia.edu/uva-first-destination-reports/university-virginia-class-2016
Virginia Tech 2016 bachelors degree in Math 25% 28,900 medium 50% salary $50,000, 75% 61,250
https://career.virginia.edu/uva-first-destination-reports/university-virginia-class-2016
@momofthree55 , I think you posted the same link twice above in #33.
sorry, here is the VT link
https://db.career.vt.edu/scripts/PostGrad2006/Report/DetailReportSalaries.asp?College=00&Majors=Y&Cohort=2015-2016
- I didn't see anyone on this thread say anything bad about Va. Tech's programs.
- Please do not confuse the number of degrees issued in any major by any college with the quality of the graduates.
- There is always room for improvement, so let's concentrate on any ideas to improve UVa's programs, instead of just making unsupported statements.
According to the links, the average math major makes more than the average commerce student lol
Also if 53 kids get into medical school, then that means only 7 percent of kids get accepted into medical school
You only need to be top 20 percentile in the premed classes to get an A or an A- and top 20 percent on the mcat
It should be significantly higher than 7 percent for a school of UVA’s rank
those numbers just don’t add up
Not sure where you get your numbers but the most recent statistics are for the class of 2017. And UVA had 150/250 (60%) accepted at medical schools.
Interesting note from this is an increase in percentage accepted but a decrease in the number applying to medical school. It seems to coincide with a national trend.
http://career.virginia.edu/pre-health/medicine/applications#Statistics%20for%20Medical%20School%20Applicants
The applicant numbers @Cavitee linked to correspond with the numbers on this site for prior years. (Association of American Medical Colleges):
https://www.aamc.org/data/facts/applicantmatriculant/86042/factstablea2.html
It does not provide acceptances. I don’t know of a composite view for acceptances across institutions.
The other link provided earlier is from student survey data and obviously surveys are not 100% complete or accurate. I believe the AAMC data is directly from the medical schools.