Value of a broad Undergrad vs. Specific Masters degree

Parents Forum
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<p>Firstly, I think I should explain why I’m asking here rather than the College Life forum. I am hoping to get responses from people who have been out of college for some time. I am also asking this same question in Engineering Majors forum, because I think I may get a different perspective there. </p>

<p>There are a lot of classes out there beyond any major I could pick that I would like to take. But this takes a lot of time and more time to take all of these. So say I can take a 5th year in college and do something. Is it better to spend 5 years as an undergrad and take a lot of these classes, getting a much broader education than I would otherwise, or to just pick a major, take the minimum requirements for that major, and then get a masters in it? </p>

<p>I do plan to one day get an MBA, and I am not sure how that should affect my decisions today. An MBA will marginalize any sort of employment benefit I would get from a Masters in Engineering, where as [I imagine] it will amplify the flexibility of a broad undergraduate education. However, stuff happens, plans change, and I don’t want to burn the bridge of ever getting a graduate degree. </p>

<p>When I say better, I mean in all aspects. I am going to take it as obvious that the masters degree will lead to better employment right out of college. There is however, a benefit from having a broader education (at least I think so) which can allow me to be more flexible in what I can do in my life. Can anyone help me weigh the pros and cons of each in this respect? Especially…</p>

<ol>
<li><p>How much value is there in the broader education in a work-place setting? Presume I double major or triple minor or something like that in complementary fields. </p></li>
<li><p>How does that value compare to the value of an undergraduate and graduate degree in the same field? </p></li>
<li><p>How much value is there in a broader education outside of a work-place setting?</p></li>
<li><p>How much flexibility in employment opportunity is really added by having a broader undergraduate degree? </p></li>
</ol>

<p>Obviously when I say “How much” I don’t mean any strict sort of quantification. I mean what do you view as the main benefits of such, and what relative magnitude you assign.</p>

<p>Thank You</p>

2

<p>I’ll give it a shot:

  1. Value in workplace will continue to be: communication skills, critical thinking skills and the individuals ability to demonstrate flexibility and adaptabilty. So you are on the right track with a broader edecation. The undergrad means litttle. BA,BS,BC etc. They are all a bit watered down. Many jobs require a bachelors and hardly ever specify which one.
  2. Masters degrees, when required, are usually very specfic to meet a job requirement. A fifth year in undergrad is not the same value as a Masters degree. While it will provide you with more choices of classes, it could be a waste of resources. Dollar and time values are better maximized in Masters level. The distiction between undergrad level intellectual work and masters level intellectual expectation creates the value differential.
  3. Value of broader education outside of work is very impractical IMHO. Old wives tales will far exceed the value and practicality of any education out side of the workplace. A grandfathers storytelling will far and away exceed value of education outside of workplace.
  4. The MBA, is a broader degree as is your undergrad multiple minor plan. Flexibility also waters down the degree at either level. It means you know a little bit of everything. It could also be interpreted as reflective of a person who is unable to focus indept on a problem.</p>

<p>What you have not considered is a new “product” in educational offerings. The certificate. The recession, as it continues, has forced alot of people back to college to add skills. They may already have masters, MBA or just the Bachelors. University are offering post bachelor certificates. These are 4 to 6 courses of the best core classes in a particular field. They are focused and have practical application. For example say you left school with a generic MBA and thru some work experience have a career in marketing. You could obtain a certificate in International Marketing in 4 to 6 courses that greatly expand your career opportunities in this new global marketplace. In your example a MBA could be generic but with a certificate in green technology building design would be added value. </p>

<p>More and more universities are adding these certificates. They are available now due to the recession. I dont know if this is the way of the future for universities.</p>

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<p>“Is it better to spend 5 years as an undergrad and take a lot of these classes, getting a much broader education than I would otherwise, or to just pick a major, take the minimum requirements for that major, and then get a masters in it?”</p>

<p>Better for what? Better to get a high paying job, better to enrich yourself as a person, better to get into graduate school?</p>

<p>“An MBA will marginalize any sort of employment benefit I would get from a Masters in Engineering, where as [I imagine] it will amplify the flexibility of a broad undergraduate education.”</p>

<p>If your goal is to be in a managerial position at a tech or industrial company, that statement above is entirely false. First, most people can’t get into a top MBA program without significant work experience. And the prestige of your MBA means EVERYTHING when it comes the job opportunities you will be offered post-MBA. Having a master’s and getting a good job out of college leading to an impressive work history in combination with your academic record will determine how competitive you are for top MBA programs. Second, you have a huge advantage getting hired AFTER MBA school by tech/industrial companies if you have an engineering undergrad or master’s degree.</p>

<p>“1. How much value is there in the broader education in a work-place setting? Presume I double major or triple minor or something like that in complementary fields.”</p>

<p>Depends on the work-place setting. Are you talking about applying for a job marketing food products or a job marketing medical devices?</p>

<p>“2. How does that value compare to the value of an undergraduate and graduate degree in the same field?”</p>

<p>Depends on the field. Are you talking about the fashion industry or the software industry?</p>

<p>“3. How much value is there in a broader education outside of a work-place setting?”</p>

<p>Depends on the person. Regardless of the person, though, if what you care about is becoming educated in a subject because it will enrich you as a person but are not interested in pursuing a degree in that subject, you can learn it on your own or take a class as a non-degree seeking student at a local institution after you get out of college.</p>

<p>If your university has a world renown expert in a particular subject that is not in your degree area but you are interested in, by all means, take advantage of that. But if you are just talking about taking classes on ancient Egyptian history taught by a generic professor, I wouldn’t spend an extra year in undergrad to take classes like that. You can learn it on your own or take it after college as a non-degree seeking student.</p>

<p>“4. How much flexibility in employment opportunity is really added by having a broader undergraduate degree?”</p>

<p>Depends on the employment opportunity.</p>

<p>I think if you want helpful advice, what you need to do is tell us what kind of a position you envision yourself in long term. If the answer is – I don’t know – then for sure I would not get a master’s in engineering. Get a master’s in engineering if you think you would like to work in the tech/industrial fields. By that I don’t mean just as an engineer; I also mean as a manager, marketer, etc. post-MBA.</p>

<p>I think the answer you want to hear is that a broader education will serve you better in life. Well that entirely depends on what you want to do with your life. If you want to be a power player in the Silicon Valley tech scene, a master’s degree in engineering will get you much farther than a broad liberal arts education - both with and without an MBA.</p>

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<p>“Value in workplace will continue to be: communication skills, critical thinking skills and the individuals ability to demonstrate flexibility and adaptabilty.”</p>

<p>It totally depends on the workplace. With regard to communication skills, I can assure you that there are some workplaces where a someone who can write high-quality code is valued far more than someone who can write a high-quality memo. With regard to flexibility and adaptability, that just depends on what you mean by that.</p>

<p>The problem with the OP’s questions is that she hasn’t given us enough information to answer them. Specifically, we need to know more about what kind of field/workplace/job she envisions herself in long term. Does she plan on starting a small business or climbing the corporate ladder? Is she looking to work in the tech/industrial fields or the fashion industry? Because unless we know more, the answer is, it depends.</p>

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<p>thanks vladenschlutte for referencing the ‘engineering majors’ section on cc. i hadn ‘t noticed it before, but will now quit the parents blog for one where my comments may benefit someone. i’ve been following parent comments for awhile and am tired of being one of the few voices here that stress the need for a job-applicable undergrad degree. being a chem e myself, i DON’T happen to feel that humanities, or liberal arts, or any other education-for-education sake studies, are so great at developing skillls for ‘problem solving’, ’ critical thinking’, ‘cultural sensitivity’, or any of the other vague terms used to justify what i believe is becoming an obsolete area for the majority of kids to focus four years of college. technical people today can think, communicate, interact, organize, and do a whole host of other remarkably human activities due to major improvements in, of all things, their diets. this is known fact!</p>

<p>in answer to your question, i think the best thing is to get the bs engineering done as quickly as possible. it isn’t easy, but you’ll be employable in an economy that is going nowhere for some time to come. a masters in engineering won’t necessarily get you a better starting job in most fields, but applicable summer experience is very useful. work for a few years, make some money, see how you like what you have developed to date. then consider grad or business school as there is a limit to how far you can go in business as an engineer. </p>

<p>as for another year to broaden your education, if you still feel like you need it, do so in the year following graduation WHILE you look for the best opportunity in the workplace. one thing is clear from your inquiry - you already have the ability to express yourself, consult different sources of info, and develop alternative paths to an objective. surely this is an important part of what you think you need to develop.</p>

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<p>This is simply not true. Does the status of a school make a difference, yes definitely, but not nearly in the black and white sense you seem to suggest. </p>

<p>Big name employers hire from a very very wide swath of MBA programs and every MBA program has a wide range of employers recruiting from that school. Across almost all occupation groups and levels of management, you find folks with MBAs from a large range of schools as well. </p>

<p>Although much has been written and debated about the return on investment of getting an MBA, you get a leg up in the market with an MBA from a 100 different schools.</p>

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<p>“This is simply not true.”</p>

<p>It is absolutely true. The top job offers go to the grads from the most prestigious MBA programs and it is no where near 100 schools that are considered top. It is not like medical school where everyone gets a job after residency no matter where they went to medical school.</p>

<p>That doesn’t mean someone going to a lesser school can’t get any job; they probably can get a job. We aren’t talking about having any opportunities; we are talking about being in a position to have access to the best opportunities. Or at least that is what I was talking about.</p>

<p>I am not even going to bother trying to find a link for you to back up my position since it is a position so widely accepted by those who make the top job offers that it isn’t necessary.</p>

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<p>Interesting! In that case, I’d recommend a year of high fiber and multivitamins instead of EITHER a fifth year of undergrad or a masters degree. :)</p>

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<p>"Quote:
technical people today can think, communicate, interact, organize, and do a whole host of other remarkably human activities due to major improvements in, of all things, their diets. this is known fact! </p>

<p>Interesting! In that case, I’d recommend a year of high fiber and multivitamins instead of EITHER a fifth year of undergrad or a masters degree."</p>

<p>I know you are being sarcastic, but I wanted to chime in that I found that statement by toodleooo wacky.</p>

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<p>Actually, I’d suggest you at least start your coursework in engineering & see how that goes before you start making plans for a 5th year, grad school or crossing off other potential majors from your list. There are many people who start out in engineering who decide to pursue other fields for many reasons.</p>

<p>IF you get inspired by something that happens when you’re in school–perhaps research, a summer job, or something else, you may find your direction and it will influence whether you go straight into a job or pursue further education/research. You may decide you hate and/or don’t have the aptitude for engineering and/or business, making much of this entire discussion pretty moot.</p>

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<p>The extra year of undergrad might be helpful if you can get another major out of it. Like if you had a double major in engineering and English, it might set you apart from other engineers and make you attractive for somebody hiring for a writing-intensive engineering project.</p>

<p>I would think it would be tough to cash in on the increased well-roundedness of a 5th year unless it gave you a second and complementary major.</p>