Her AI (roughly) based on the information you provided is a 208. That is quite low for an Ivy–but not an insurmountable problem for a top recruit. . Further there are no bands in Ivy recruiting with the exception of football I believe. The band system is NESCAC. I looked the concordance and an SAT of 1350/1380 is equivalent to a 28. The SAT is generally a harder test with more time per question. The ACT is much easier but fast. So the difficulty of each is based on different aspects of the test.
That is the same AI we came up with. The coach definitely mentioned “Bands”, so I assumed they use the band system. I always thought it was only football too. Her math is a 26, so hopefully that is “okay”. Thank you for your post!!
@midwesternmomof4 --interesting. I am sure that coaches use terminology of their own maybe to make distinctions for for the students/families. But–I dont know. I have not heard the band thing personally. Nonetheless. The AI can theoretically be as low as 176 (I believe that is the technical minimum). The Ivies differ of course from one another and the AI levels can shift from year to year based on the student body and team make ups. Good luck! I would have your daughter try a practice SAT and she how she does. More time may suit her.
Yes! I told her pray that the other recruits all have perfect 36 or 1600 scores!
For my kids when we went through the process, the coaches signaled a “30” ACT as what they would like to see to be “safe” with the AO. I am sure there are recruits with lower scores, but you then get into the rubric with what average the coach needs to hit for his/her team as I am pretty sure that certain teams, like football, get more leeway which has to be made up for by the other sports to hit the required average for all recruited athletes. Did your daughter take any SAT2’s because they can be used to calculate the AI. Also if your daughter got mostly 4/5’s on AP’s, I’d definitely send those scores to the coach so that he/she has additional ammo with the AO. Hopefully you won’t need any of this. Good luck!
They coach also said they would like to have seen a 30, but thought her 35 in English (she got that twice) and 30 in Reading would be sufficient with the major she likes. (Not math or science related at all). She did not take subject tests because they weren’t required for the college she likes. I am hopeful the team average is high enough to offset her 28. The coach also said they lost a top recruit and was going to have a little more leverage in saying that they need a strong team, and since a top recruit changed her mind, they can push a little more. What do you think? We come from a public school where the guidance counselor offers zero help and they think a 28 is great. Ugh.
It sounds like the coach is willing to go to bat for your daughter vs just putting in for a preread and see if the AO signs off on her. I do think having the high scores in English and Reading helps vs say 27’s across all subjects. However, you just don’t know what other options/cards the coach has. You might want to run some hypo’s on an AI calculator and have your daughter take some practice SAT 1’s and SAT 2’s, and see if she is more likely to raise her AI going one of those routes. If she will likely test well in SAT2 History and Literature because she is strong in those areas, it may be a better option.
Good advice. I told her maybe take the Literature and French SAT subject tests. Yes, the coach is definitely fighting for her. He said they are “doing everything they can” and “trust the process”, whatever that means.
She also offers some geographical and socioeconomic diversity on the team, for whatever that is worth.
The 4 band system is football only in the Ivy. A similar system is used in basketball and men’s hockey afaik. That is by conference rule. Of course, a particular school’s athletic department may use that language when they are dividing up lower AI recruits among certain sports.
@midwesternmomof4 has the pre read request been submitted yet? My guess is that is gonna give you the best information, and I personally would wait until that comes back before deciding on next steps.
Yes, they submitted the pre-read Friday. Coach is hopeful we will have an answer in 1-3 weeks, he thinks more on the quicker side. They submit 5 pre-reads at a time (Men and Women both). He definitely said the team average was important. It’s interesting, because from what I seem to be seeing, the IVY’s are placing more emphasis on the ACT/SAT than they are on grades. Coach even said they got in a boy that had some C’s and D’s but a 1450 SAT. This school is her dream…
Standard test scores make up 2/3 of the AI, i.e. 160 out of the 240. If you take the SAT then very easy to translate, i.e. a 1450 SAT = 145 in the AI
Interesting. They told her that they calculated her AI and it is a 201. Maybe you are looking at an older version?
^^^they may have calculated gpa in only core subject classes, eg, no PE, art, other electives
@midwesternmomof4 --Some schools do that. I understand why because they are trying to exclude easy A’s but on the other hand maybe someone loves art. I feel like required electives should be included.
I’m pretty sure they used her entire GPA from all classes.
I talked to several ivy coaches in a non football sport. None used the word “bands”, but I think to a certain extent they all think along those lines. It may be their pull with admissions, or just how they meet their AI#. But pretty much all said something to the effect of the top recruit needing a certain score, the bottom needing something else, with the rest falling in between. To oversimplify, if they need an average 32 ACT, they can take a kid with a 27. But those extra 5 points have to come from somewhere. So the bottom 2 recruits need a 34 and 35 to keep the team average where it needs to be. Even if they aren’t formally working with bands I’m guessing it ends up working in a similar fashion.
I’ve read here many times that an ivy pre-read is most successful if the act composite starts with a 3. I’d say a retest should be done and get your hands on every online and test prep book practice test and make your way through them. My S19 did it this way and throughout a month or two of pretty consistent practice, his scores began to settle pretty much where he ended up. I would say the delta between the initial cold practices and the final was about five points on each section. And follow on DD20 is using this method as well.
If the coach tells your daughter to increase the test score then she will have to retest. If not then the coach may be able to make up for her 201 AI. The coaches usually have some degree of control over the average team AI. I believe many lower profile sports have team averages around 210. HYP may be higher.
Do you happen to know if the team average is men/women combined or just the women’s average and just the men’s average? I happen to know that the women’s average is much higher than the men.
^There is an overall average all recruited athletes have to hit (the 1 standard deviation in AI vs. the general student body). Because of the bands in football which allow for greater deviation, and reported lower standards for other sports (typical suspects, basketball, hockey and lacrosse), the other sports have to make up for it. I don’t know, but I strongly suspect each coach is allocated a minimum average each year (which may very well be different by sport and gender) so that the athletic department can hit its overall minimum. Might there be some horse trading between coaches at any given year or the AD and AO letting one sport go lower than their target because other sports have exceeded theirs, would not be surprised.