Wash U Is Distasteful!

Colleges & Universities Washington University in St. Louis
61

<p>oldolddad,</p>

<pre><code>Your admonishments are well taken, but you can’t speak for everyone on this board. In most cases, our child’s interest in Wash U was cultivated long before we knew what the EFC and scholarship outcomes would be. Some of us did know, however, what their SAT and GPAs were, and we assumed that our sons and daughters would be competitive. And though you say WUSTL warned applicants that competition was “fierce” (your word), nowhere on its website or in any of the scholarship materials that they sent us do they describe the odds in quite such daunting terms. In fact, this is what their own website says:
</code></pre>

<p><<scholarship and=“” fellowship=“” recipients=“” generally=“” score=“” in=“” the=“” top=“” ranges=“” on=“” sat?s=“” or=“” act?s.=“” most=“” are=“” 10=“” percent=“” of=“” their=“” classes=“” high=“” school=“” have=“” followed=“” an=“” extremely=“” rigorous=“” curriculum.=“”>></scholarship></p>

<p>Sounds doable to me, and I’m sure many families proceeded accordingly.
Hey, it’s good marketing. And I’m realizing more and more each day, reading the posts on CC, Wash U is all about marketing. Makes some of us wonder if they’ve “marketed” their way into US News’ top 15. </p>

<p>How some of us choose to define affordability is our own business, of course. Some of us have spent a tidy sum already, sending our kids to private elementary and high schools. That was our choice, and we believe it was the right thing. Now we come on CC and hear people chastising us for not saving enough for college. </p>

<p>My complaint is not that we were “entitled” to anything. My complaint is that we were “hustled.” Yes, hustled. We were sent the fancy brochures. We were told to, yes, apply for this, apply for that. And we ended up swallowing both the bait and the hook. </p>

<p>Does a top 12 school really have to market itself like that? If the school is legitimate, shouldn’t the market create itself?</p>

<p>I apologize. I’m starting to get off-topic here. I appreciate everything every one of you has written, because it was heartfelt and has been immensely valuable to our family. Despite it all, we still believe in Wash U. We hope that an acceptance letter arrives soon. And we will do our darnedest to make it happen. Good luck to all of you.</p>

62

<p>Er…I have to disagree with pretty much everything shoe66 wrote. Wash U isn’t unique in “marketing” itself. In fact I’d say Wash U deserves to market itself more to gain the reputation it deserves.
I wouldn’t claim that Wash U tricked people or hustled them by encouraging them to apply. Are you saying that any college that sends out mail is hustling people when it issues a rejection? That’s ridiculous.</p>

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<p>I agree. WashU is no worse than HYP etc. when it comes to getting its name out there. The difference is that WashU isn’t as well known and so is working on improving that. So where is the problem?</p>

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<p>Olin regular decisions are out. Now the real complaining can begin when the student is accepted and there is no scholarship. </p>

<p>Question: Have you been tricked or hustled if your S or D is accepted but gets no schoalrship?</p>

65

<p>The web site says only people with top SAT/ACT should consider. It also says something about 200 awarded. In their facts brochure they list the 22000 total applicants ,and the acceptances and yields are on Princeton Review and/or CB site among others. Are people as upset about not getting the Coke? Do all the 100,000 applicants beileve they have a chance? I am sure they do or they should not have applied. That program is marketed. Only 250 get awards. Do they feel duped? Maybe some do. I still say if one likes the school for the right reasons the scholarship decision should not change that. At least at this school and several others ,top students have a chance of getting something. That beats the zero chance at HYPS et al.
I say it is best to plan with the assumption you will not get in and will not get money. That way you have a plan B, C, D, and maybe more, if things do not work out, and you are ecstatic if they do. As we have learned many times there are a ton of amazing kids out there and there are things we also cannot control. IMHO. Usually though, things do work out for good kids, one way or the other, and every setback seems to provide different and often unexpected good opportunities.</p>

66

<p>I find it to be in very poor taste for someone (an adult of all people) to post on a school specific forum that they think that particular school has marketed their way up to their current ranking. Shame on you!</p>

67

<p>“Wash U. is no worse than HYP etc. when it comes to getting its name out there. The difference is that WashU isn’t as well known and so is working on improving that. So where is the problem?”</p>

<p>The problem as I see it, is that Wash U. must spend a flaming fortune on “getting it’s name out there.” Last year, our mail box was jammed with a continuous flow of Wash U. materials–far more than our daughter received from any other single school. It was quite flattering until we discovered how many other kids we knew who were getting this same snail-mail spam bombardment. … I know that Wash U. is a very fine school; I understand that admission and merit scholarships are not guaranteed; I also realize that PR is important in cultivating name recognition. But the cost of such relentless self-promotion must be stratospheric. Perhaps fewer gigantic mass-mailings might free up additional $$$ for their highly touted scholarships. Eh?</p>

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<p>It might be good to keep in mind that Wash U is a private institution, and we are the ones seeking membership–free, at that!</p>

69

<p>Statistics and numbers are often very strange. Different people tend to interpret them in different ways. Yes, WashU states that merit finalists are in the top 10% of their HS class. But if you consider that 2 years ago 93% of those admitted were in the top 10% of their HS class that means almost everyone is in that top 10%. My experience has been that most finalists are in the top 10% of admitted students, not only with stats but as holistic candidates. Consider a freshman class of approximately 1,400 with approximately 150 + merit awards. Just a bit over 10%. So by checking on the WashU profile one can ascertain that top 10% of SATs and HS class is just about average for WashU.</p>

<p>In any case, I think it is time to give this thread a rest. Hopefully WashU will learn from their mistakes this year. I would definitely recommend visiting WashU before making a final decision. It seems to me that the kids there feel very wanted and happy at WashU. In any case I am sure that in the end everyone will make the decision that works out best for them. Good luck to everyone.</p>

70

<p>“It might be good to keep in mind that Wash U is a private institution, and we are the ones seeking membership–free, at that!”</p>

<p>That’s a good point, MallomarCookie. As a private institution, Wash U. has every right to do what they want with their money. It’s just my (humble and possibly erroneous) opinion that the fortune they invest in mass mailings could be put to better use. … As for seeking free membership, that was not something our family considered very likely. We were merely hoping for “discounted” membership!</p>

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<p>I will at least agree with you on that point Hindoo - I am a transfer student and I received two of the same course catalogues (thick books) and three separate packets each containing the same brochures (very nice ones, too). WashU can do what they want with their money, and it may be hard to keep track with so many applicants/prospective applicants, but I felt bad (environmentally) receiving the same stuff multiple times.</p>

72

<p>brand–I’m sure you’re a recycler, just as I am. … I’ve been complaining about Wash U’s promotional extravagance, but I guess I could have contacted them personally to say “no need for more mailings. You had me at ‘hello.’”</p>

73

<p>I wonder if anyone is going to start slamming the HYPS group of super elites when they start pouring large amounts of money into marketing and recruiting to boost the numbers of applicants from the international student community? </p>

<p>Will they be slammed for relentless self promotion overseas as they vie for the top candidates? </p>

<p>Will the fortunes, whatever the size, they will spend on international mailings and admissions officers’ travel budgets as they try to get their name more widespread ‘out there’ in China, India, Africa, etc. come under attack as wasteful spending that should have gone to scholarships?</p>

<p>Will they be accused of trying to “market” their way to the top of international college rankings, trying to boost their name recognition abroad to match established international greats Cambridge, Oxford, Tokyo University, etc. </p>

<p>And when these elites succeed in attracting a flood of new applications from international students, and end up turning away qualified students in droves because they can only accept so many, will anyone come on the CC boards to accuse them “hustling” those applicants with their enticements?</p>

<p>I doubt it. The efforts of Stanford and Yale and others to boost enrollment of the top international students will be hailed as the smart thing to do and in the best interest of their institutions and of the students they do admit. That’s pretty much how I regard the marketing efforts of Wash U officials. (No excuse, though, for the dumb decision to send the all-in-one-envelope scholarship notification.)</p>

<p>And, BTW, S1 received multiple course book/brochure mailings not only from WashU, but also from Cornell, Northwestern, and Duke.</p>

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<p>jazzymom–Your son must be extraordinary. My high-achieving daughter slipped under the radar of two of the three schools you mentioned and every Ivy except Yale. She did get tantalizing mailings from some extraordinary colleges, but alas, Wash U. was the only one that peppered her with a continuous stream of brochures & letters. Mind you, I’m not offended. I just feel their money could have been better spent. Just my little ol’ opinion. … Ultimately, Wash U. got the last laugh. The barrage served its purpose in that my daughter did end up applying to Wash U. She may well be accepted and, if so, could well be a student there come next fall. Who knows? But I still feel my criticism is not out of line.</p>

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<p>I don’t think your criticism is necessarily out of line, either. I just would like to see less of a double standard applied to WashU for its marketing versus other colleges and the marketing they do and plan to do in the near future. My S got mailings from the schools I mentioned immediately after he visited them and signed interest cards in the spring of his junior year and again, the same info in the fall as application decisions were being made. It wasn’t a flood by any means, but the mailings were multiple. Extraordinary? Maybe not by the loftiest CC standards, but he is pretty special.</p>

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<p>Jazzymom-- </p>

<p>There is a difference between a school that gives no merit scholarships advertizing to broaden its pool of applicants and one that sets out to increase its pool of applicants by touting its merit scholarships. If the non-merit school truthfully discloses its “stats” on applications and admissions no one is deceived. If the merit scholarship “siren’s song” is deceptive, there is plenty to be angry about. </p>

<p>A lot of what I pick up on this thread is that the possibility of meaningful merit $$ was a strong factor in applying. There surely is nothing wrong with that and I think you would have to be naive to think WASHU was not aware of that.</p>

<p>I think each person would have a different take on how clear or unclear the merit scholarship information was. The real test would come if someone formally complained to Wash U and no effort to make it more clear happened in response.</p>

<p>That comes a little late for this years crop of students and parents who might feel it was at least unclear.</p>

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<p>I do think Wash U could have done a better job of explaining the odds of its merit scholarships. I had no idea that they only offered 12. I didn’t find that kind of number on their website or in the multitude of mailings. They made me feel like I actually had a chance.</p>

<p>But I agree that Wash U is not alone and should not be singled out. I applied for the Robertson scholarship and did not even get a notice of rejection–they don’t deign to send them, apparently. Only those selected get any sort of notification. I felt that that was rude considering their application had about 5 essays and wasn’t easy. At least Wash U sent out rejection notifications.</p>

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<p><a href=“http://admissions.wustl.edu/admissions/ua.nsf/3rd%20Level%20Pages_Scholarships_scholarship_ataglace.htm?OpenPage&charset=iso-8859-1[/url]”>http://admissions.wustl.edu/admissions/ua.nsf/3rd%20Level%20Pages_Scholarships_scholarship_ataglace.htm?OpenPage&charset=iso-8859-1&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>Jazzymom–I babble about WashU because of my own experience with their PR methods/procedures. (I still very much like the school.) … I’m certain you’re right that other well-known colleges market themselves similarly. And I’m absolutely certain that your son and my daughter are quite extraordinary!</p>

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<p>numbers of scholaships are here
<a href=“http://admissions.wustl.edu/admissions/ua.nsf/3rd%20Level%20Pages_Scholarships_scholarship_ataglace.htm?OpenPage&charset=iso-8859-1[/url]”>http://admissions.wustl.edu/admissions/ua.nsf/3rd%20Level%20Pages_Scholarships_scholarship_ataglace.htm?OpenPage&charset=iso-8859-1&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;