Wow. So intersting. Wonder how this will play out.
So there is a constitutional right for the accused not to be publicly named before conviction?
Here is a more local source, with additional articles and opinions:
http://www.startribune.com/gophers-football-players-plan-to-threaten-boycott-of-bowl-game/406928136/
@sorghum I believe they are protesting the players lack of due process.
“At issue is the players’ belief that the suspensions are unfair because the alleged incident of sexual assault had been investigated by the police with no charges being filed.”
good for them…duke lacrosse/U of virginia rolling stone situations(among others) should serve as a reminder to schools about doing the wrong thing. I am proud of the football players for standing up for the civil rights of the other players . a state school (public) is not a private school different rules and the dear colleague letter from the department of education is beyond pathetic and should have never been allowed in this country.(it will soon be gone)
these players who are united in boycotting the schools action also hopefully understand they can wind up kicked out of college. so as long as they understand their highly principled stand may cost them their college career…good for them.
I’m guessing the University standards for a punishable school conduct/offense is different than what qualifies as criminal conduct. Just because the DA didn’t feel they could get sexual assault convictions doesn’t mean their conduct didn’t violate school code of conduct.
That said, I don’t know enough of the situation to understand the due process followed thus far. That’s certainly a concern these days… This looks to fall into the “no win” category at this point.
My guess is that the president will stand by the equal opportunity office/committee’s decision as long as the process and due diligence in that office/committee followed the book. Then, the punishment to those students will stand as a result.
Punishments to students do not have to base on criminal acts. A student who cheat, which is not a criminal act, can be suspended or even expelled if so desired.
“Punishments to students do not have to base on criminal acts. A student who cheat, which is not a criminal act, can be suspended or even expelled if so desired.”
It is true that punishment does not have to be based on criminal acts. But cheating is generally viewed in a different category by courts than discipline based on criminal acts. The question is the degree of due process required by PUBLIC universities like the U of Minn.
This is a complicated and unsettled area of the law. But there is certainly an argument to be made that secret hearings held by universities do not suffice to protect the Constiutional rights of students accused of sexual assault.
This is beyond grotesque. In announcing that he would not bring charges, the DA said that he did not have enough evidence to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that force was used or that the woman was helpless when she had sex with five football players. There has never been a suggestion that this incident was a total hoax (as with UVa, where no one from the fraternity accused was ever disciplined based on the false story, or Duke, where the students’ actions were pretty despicable, but not as despicable as the accuser claimed). After the DA decided not to pursue the charges, a civil court – due process and all, and with testimony about harassment of the woman involved – enjoined the five players from a number of areas on campus, including the football stadium, where the woman worked.
This isn’t one of those ambiguous claims where a year later, after a breakup, a woman decides to claim that she didn’t consent to sex twice out of a dozen intimate encounters with the same man, or where a couple of drunken freshmen hooked up and the parents of one turned it into rape. This is a situation that screams “Wrong!” If anyone here heard that his or her daughter had engaged in serial sex with five football players, I doubt that any of us would leap to the conclusion that she was an enthusiastic, consenting participant in the activity, although I guess I’m willing to believe that it’s not impossible that a young woman who would freely consent to that exists somewhere.
What I see here is a bunch of spoiled children who have spent much of their lives in a bubble of immunity having a tantrum over the suggestion that their privileges have limits. The University of Minnesota would do better to scrape its football program clean and start over than to give in to this. That’s not going to happen, but it should. The culture of men’s college athletics and how athletes view women needs to turn around 180 degrees.
“After the DA decided not to pursue the charges, a civil court – due process and all, and with testimony about harassment of the woman involved – enjoined the five players from a number of areas on campus, including the football stadium, where the woman worked.”
A temporary restraining order does not require due process or a hearing. It is one sided. A hearing is then set to determine if an injunction will issue. It appears from the news accounts I have read that the parties reached some sort of settlement before a hearing took place. This could include simply an agreement not to pursue the matter further in exchange for not seeking fees for a bad faith claim. No one knows and the issuance of the restraining order establishes absolutely nothing about whether there was any merit to the allegations.
This isn’t a straightforward case of gang rape. To me, if the victim reports the crime to others and the police as soon as possible after the fact then I’m more likely to believe them than not. This woman did that according to the following article:
However, the same article says that there were three videos produced by the football players and the police, who viewed the videos, said the victim appeared “lucid, alert, somewhat playful, and fully conscious at the time”. I guess the “somewhat playful” part is what sticks in my mind. Regardless of the actual facts, this incident is disgusting … but I guess we’re not allowed to be judgmental like that anymore.
“There has never been a suggestion that this incident was a total hoax”
instead it is just a partial hoax???..therefore punish the students …I mean they are men and worse jocks so we need to toss all standards out the door ???ummm no!
p.s. duke lacrosse involved criminal activity by the DA, police department (DA went to jail for one day…he should have gone for a long time)
the school, a large group of faculty and administration acted maliciously and should have been fired.
a rape hoax is super serious…filing a false police report is criminal. the behavior can not somehow be equated to just being more despicable than the behavior of the lacrosse team…that is over the top.
I personally dislike frats and think sports have no place in a college setting. I am the person who the stereotypes of both of those groups bullied in junior high, high school etc… but I believe in not putting my personal history/prejudices ahead of finding people guilty or innocent based of many factors including there be absolute certainty they committed a crime. not the whim of a bureaucrat or an administrator at a college.
Despicable? They hired two dancers from an ad in a local paper.
That’s like saying going to Vegas is despicable, or going to a bachelor party where there are strippers is despicable. Not everyone’s idea of fun, but not illegal and not despicable.
Was the restraining order made permanent? I thought it was ridiculous anyway as she is a ‘game day’ worker in a huge stadium and I can’t see how 5 guys on the football field, with cameras on them, could present a danger to her during a game or prevent her from doing her job. I am absolutely sure not one of the 120 guys on the team speaks to her. What I originally read was the five players couldn’t play in home games because of the restraining order but could play when the team traveled as the order would not be violated (she did not travel with the team). I don’t know if they actually did travel or practice with the team this year.
When someone has a restraining order, it doesn’t mean she has the right to the world and the one(s) being restrained can never go to a restaurant or mall EVER for fear of violating the order. The university could have managed the restraining order better, either by changing her job location or having the players enter from another gate, use another locker room, come at a different time.
I do not think the president of the university or the athletic director will leave. The players may be making demands that just are NOT going to be met.
“I do not think the president of the university or the athletic director will leave. The players may be making demands that just are NOT going to be met.”
two in and done…while I agree with you they probably will not leave…and slightly different factors at play…
ask the president and chancellor at U of missouri about what happened to them…when those demands were made of them(neither are still at Mizzou)
<or duke,="" where="" the="" students’="" actions="" were="" pretty="" despicable,="" but="" not="" as="" despicable="" accuser="" claimed).=""> Despicable? They hired two dancers from an ad in a local paper. That’s like saying going to Vegas is despicable, or going to a bachelor party where there are strippers is despicable. Not everyone’s idea of fun, but not illegal and not despicable. >
One of the accused lacrosse players was NOT even at the party! He was not involved at all! And it did not matter to Duke faculty - they vilified him anyway.
Just think about it - you, as a parent, pay $60,000 per year. This tuition goes towards salary of faculty and admins. Yet, when your child is it trouble, they turn against your child, make everything possible to vilify him, and call him “rich and spoiled”. Wow. Faculty hates their own students.
BTW, no faculty was ever disciplined. Most faculty, who harassed students, were promoted.
californiaa you know how the police and the DA had crystal magnum choose her victims?
they lined up everyone from the LAX team together and told her point out who attacked you…no matter who she choose they were on the LAX team. a line up is the suspect mixed in with 5-6-7 other unrelated people. each suspect gets their own line up. it was 100% gurantee that ms. magnum would choose 3 LAX team members.DA and cops knew that…and they violated the civil rights of the entire LAX team.
the duke lax hoax is truly a travesty and a blemish on law enforcement at all levels in durham. the school and it’s behavior was equally horrendous…just on a civil level not a criminal level.
At some point soon, a decision will have to be made on whether or not the Minnesota team is showing up for the bowl game. If the answer is no (or unclear) then Northern Illinois will take Minnesota’s slot in the bowl game. Then things will get really interesting from a football perspective. Some deep pocketed alums will not be happy.
MODERATOR’S NOTE: Please don’t rehash the Duke case. Stay on the subject of the Minnesota case.
I was amused to read some of the comments in the WaPo article saying it’s all Obama’s fault.