<p>A melee at a McDonalds restaurant following the high school basketball game in wealthy McLean, Virginia has created a firestorm of controversy as criticism has come from parents upset about agressive police, and other adults who argue that inebriated minors are being pampered by pompous parents. This is the second such news story about drinking and minors in the metro Washington area in recent weeks. The Washington Post and the local network affiliates have run the story.</p>
<p>Are there any lessons for us to learn here? Are parents who find relief in that their kids get drunk rather than use illegal drugs in denial? Do affluent communities excessively insulate their young from personal responsibilty?</p>
<p>Ok, I am sure this isn’t going to be a popular opinion here but I agree that you see more issues like this in affluent communities and a higher proportion of parents that excuse that kind of behavior. There was a high school not long ago that was making the news because it busted several kids on sports teams because of pictures of kids drinking at a party that were posted on Facebook. The parent’s answer to this was not to place blame on the kids for underage drinking and violating honor codes but to sue the school for “invasion of privacy”.</p>
<p>I think often, but not always. There are always a few responsible and sensible parents in the wilderness.
Too often the parents are worried about the consequences of their kids’ indiscretions rather than having them face the consequences as a logical result of their actions, or a learning experience. It’s kind of understandable- parents work hard to give their kids so much, and they don’t want them to blow their futures on a dumb mistake. Unfortunately, that attitude breeds a kind of permissiveness that the kids pick up on, and they take advantage knowing that mom and dad will help them out. I’ve seen it many times in my community.</p>
<p>^^ agree with moonchild - I’ve seen some kid sports teammates do some really dumb stuff that if punished appropriately at 14 or 15 might not have snowballed into the same level of bad behavior at 16 and 17. Schools and parents don’t seem to want to derail a team or perceived prospective college sports career, so bad behavior is not cracked down on to the extend that it should be according to all school and district policy. There is a kid or two who I expect to be reading about in the paper in future years for “team rules violations” at the collegiate level.</p>
<p>“Are parents who find relief in that their kids get drunk rather than use illegal drugs in denial?”</p>
<p>In denial about what? Chances are their little angels are getting drunk AND getting high. Probably getting laid too without adequate protection. That’s how it works in our neck of the woods, and this isn’t even a particularly affluent area.</p>
<p>Where have they escalated thelevel of punishment to unreasonable heights? I’ve heard local parents complain about this but when they are really pressed what ****es them off is that school authorities and elected officials are no longer agreeing to cover everything up.</p>
<p>^ I agree wholeheartedly. As soon as a schoolyard fistfight between two 8th graders began requiring multi-week suspensions and police intervention, we went past the point of no return as a society.</p>
<p>I agree. And I think that in many cases, affluent and well-educated parents are more aware of the long-term consequences of the punishments than other parents might be.</p>
<p>If more offenses were punished in ways appropriate to the level of the offense and the short-term thinking typical of teenagers (for example, through long hours of very boring community service) with no long-term consequences, I think most parents would be thrilled to work as a team with school authorities and the police to diminish unruly behavior.</p>
<p>My son once forgot to remove his pocket knife from his jacket pocket before going to school. This could have been punished by expulsion. That’s the kind of escalating punishment I’m talking about. He dealt with it by pretending to be sick and getting himself sent home for the day. Wouldn’t it have made more sense for him to admit to the presence of the knife and receive a small punishment – such as a detention or two or a few hours of picking up litter or stapling papers – rather than missing a day of classes for fear of expulsion?</p>
<p>I think kayf has a point here. If a youngster gets caught doing something (and I could elaborate on something that happened with one of my darlings, but I won’t), often a parent’s first reaction is something related to how it will torpedo their future. We are growing into a “no room for mistakes” society. Just read some of the threads on here about getting into THE SCHOOL OF MY DREAMS…IS MY PERFECT RECORD PERFECT ENOUGH? The perception is that any infractions will sink whatever dreams a child has, so as parents, we want to see punishment, just not for our kid. I completely get this train of thought.</p>
<p>Marian (brilliant person) and I cross-posted.
I would add that my daughter took a knife to school as well. She could have been expelled as well, but she turned it in herself. It was the knife used for trimming oboe reeds and her teacher had just given it to her the night before at her lesson.</p>
<p>Yes, and the parents of the upper-middle class, upper class kids do their best to avoid any record, yet the lower class kids are getting shut out of many jobs and further education because of our laws. Its not right.</p>
<p>Hudson Valley – when I was a kid, I never heard of anyone getting arrested for drinking, and yes it happened, and yes the drinking age was 18. Yes there were parties with kids under 18. The age for treatment as a juvenile in court has been reduced to 16. That means 16 and above, sealed records are more difficult.</p>
<p>Very true about escalation of consequences. I never put the 2 together before. DH tells stories from his youth that seem like childish pranks, etc. I have to temper them with a disclaimer of “don’t try this at home because now you’ll be expelled or not allowed to graduate.” Basic playground stuff that used to maybe merit being called for a quick chat by the “playground teacher” is now a serious offense. We almost had the knife experience when DS took H’s geer back for a class environmental camp. He found a hunting knife in one of the small burried pockets - oops!</p>
<p>I agree with KayF. And the parents see this. I admit I would probably do the same. Plus, they are your children. You are going to defend them. Not that they don’t deserve punished…and I don’t know the details of this particular story, but as another example,kids caught drinking at a party shouldn’t have their whole future threatened. </p>
<p>In my community, two girls were found smoking pot in their cars at school. The school wanted to expel them permanently. “Zero tolerance policy.” It took the parents in the office crying, begging and pleading so they suspended them for 10 days instead. I thought this was more reasonable. These girls were honor students who had never been in trouble before. (Or they hadn’t got caught.) Still, the suspension was a lot more reasonable.</p>
<p>When I was in HS kids used to smoke pot in class! I do believe that there should be some middle ground. How does missing 2 weeks of instruction help anyone?</p>
<p>One kid in my DDS high school, who had never hurt anyone, was suspended fpr 5 days for having a hit list in her notebook. Yes, it violated zerio tolerance. Was it fair? Kids mom (single mother) didnt have resources to fight.</p>
<p>I also agree with the escalation of consequences trend and it’s happening with everything not just our young adults. An MIP in my neck of the woods will put you in district court in front of a judge and you better have an attorney. And what kind of lesson does that teach kids other than get an attorney quick and fight everything. A civil infraction that hurts the kids wallet and mandatory alcohol counseling or something would be tons better and teach a stronger lesson. And yes, the playgrounds, the classrooms, the rules upon rules upon rules. My son’s swim team had to give up traditions that had been around as long as the high school because some parent sued the school and called it hazing. The kids see through all this BS and I don’t think they will forget any of it anytime soon. Make the punishment fit the crime and not turn minor things that can be handled in mediation, by parents or throughsocial pressure turn into criminal offenses.</p>