Hey everyone,
So I know you have the Ivy League + Stanford, Chicago, Caltech, Berkeley at the top in the 1st tier. Then you have the UCs, some strong LACs, georgiatech, UMich, etc in the second tier, but about the third and fourth?
Here are the rankings, draw the lines wherever you see fit.
http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/search?school-type=national-universities&_mode=table
http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/search?school-type=national-liberal-arts-colleges&_mode=table
My main problem was where to draw the line. I figured that with my 31 ACT, 4.0 GPA but with only 3 AP classes, weak ECs, I shouldn’t aim too high, so I was wondering where the third tier schools are at. I have not idea what to look for. Do acceptance rates, average GPAs and ACTs, research expidentures, # of students, students to teacher ratios determine this?
A 31 ACT is average somewhere around National Rank of 24 and LAC rank of 7. Acceptance rates <20% are reaches for most.
You might want to think more about what type of school interests you and fit your budget instead of these imaginary tiers.
Try the super match
http://www.collegeconfidential.com/college_search/
If your suggested tiers are based on statistical factors, you may have underestimated the strength of LACs. These colleges have entering standardized scoring no less than equal to that of Cal-Berkeley, for example:
Harvey Mudd
Pomona
Williams
Amherst
Swarthmore
Bowdoin
Claremont McKenna
Carleton
Haverford
Vassar
Grinnell
Hamilton
That point dispatched with, should you want to roughly place yourself among all schools with respect to your own admissions prospects, you can cross-reference your own record with that of an analysis such as “The 610 Smartest Colleges” (Business Insider). Your personal “safer” schools may simply be those along the range at which your standardized scoring would place you beyond the 75th percentile when compared to attending students. However, your impressive 4.0 could be a very strong factor on your behalf even at schools above this range.
Wih a 4.0 and a 31 ACT, you don’t need to go into third-tier schools, let alone 4th tier.
Pretty much any national LAC ranked 40-125 will work, plus your flagship(s), regional universities ranked 1-15, and private universities ranked in higher numbers than your flagship (so, if your flagship ranks 40, numbers 41+).
While any of the Tier 1 schools is always a gamble for any student, my son got into two Ivies with the same 4.0 and 30 ACT. He didn’t have any over the top ECs. He was a URM IB diploma student from an area where most kids don’t even dream of top tier schools and I know that helped. He just picked schools he liked for his matches and reaches. So I’m encouraging you not to give up on the Tier 1 schools if they fit the profile you are looking for, but pick some Tier 2 and a few safeties as well. Best of luck.
Thanks everyone for your responses. So @merc81 are you saying that a match is when your grades are above the 75 percentile or is that a safety? Also @MYOS1634 Do you mean any national university ranked 40-125 or LAC? and @BUalum93 I considered applying to a top tier school- not sure which- but I’m still considering my real chances. btw are you a Boston university alumnus? Because I am considering going there because of their strong engineering program and generous grants. Do you think I have a good shot?
@koolguy654 : I’d say if your academic profile in general appears to be statistically even slightly above average for a school, then you could reasonably regard it as a solid match. Schools at which you would be above the 75th percentile may be admissions safeties for you. (Schools with acceptance rates below ~25-30% may be challenging admits for even highly qualified applicants.)
Btw, if you were to search for and read through the “Smartest Colleges” list (post #4), it would help you place the posts in this thread in context, in that it includes LACs and universities together.
Roughly, if you are applying to a school where fewer than 40%are admitted, you want to be near top 25% stats to consider it a match, well above top 25% to consider it a safety. No school that admits fewer than 30% applicants can be considered a safety.
If some universities can have a high acceptance rate and be very selective due to the specific (high stats but unique) pool of applicants, universities with low acceptances rates must always be considered as reaches.
It’s been a long time since I graduated and I only new two kids back then that got great financial aid at the time. I don’t know the kind of financial aide they give these days - my kids aren’t interested in BU unfortunately. S2 was looking at their premed options until he visited yesterday. The campus was not what he envisioned for himself. Have you visited campus? It’s not for everyone. Many don’t like the lack of a campus. In general your stats look good for BU, can’t speak to the specifics of the engineering school. Best of luck.
I like to divide tier 1 schools into two groups: a & b. Schools like Ga Tech, U Michigan, & UNC are definitely top notch, elite schools, but they’re not quite on the level of schools like Harvard, Yale, Princeton, MIT, Stanford, Duke, etc.Basically, for me a 1.b. school is a public version of a 1.a. school, lol.
They biggest problem for me with tier one schools are that either: a- it is too selective or b- it does not give financial aid. My goal right now is to go to an engineering school and graduate with the least debt possible, that means I need a lot of FA, but after considering the schools in tier 3, do some of them give generous FA like tier 1 & 2 schools?
@BUalum93 I don’t think I will like the campus (or the lack of it) as well.I prefer the traditional campus.
Ok, so you want a near full ride. Those schools are listed here.
http://automaticfulltuition.yolasite.com/
http://competitivefulltuition.yolasite.com/
Some selections from these links for a 31 ACT are:
U New Mexico
University of Louisiana-Monroe
Application Deadline: Dec 3rd
Award: Full Tuition + Fees + $5000 housing stipend
Requirements: 3.0 GPA, 30 ACT or 1320 SAT (CR+M)
http://www.ulm.edu/scholarships/freshmen.html
http://www.ulm.edu/scholarships/outofstate.html
Note: First come, first served as funds are available
University of Arkansas at Monticello
Application Deadline: March 1st
Award: Full Ride (Tuition+Room+Board)
Requirements: 3.0 GPA and Top 10% Rank, 30 ACT
http://www.uamont.edu/pages/admissions/institutional-scholarships/
lots of others.
I like to divide tier 1 schools into two groups: a & b. Schools like Ga Tech, U Michigan, Duke & UNC etc. are definitely top notch, elite schools, but they’re not quite on the level of schools like Harvard, Yale, Princeton, MIT, and Stanford.
Unless you are an engineer make, Duke is a big step ahead of the schools you mentioned it with, and this is coming from someone who lives in Atlanta and bleeds gold and navy blue. Overall, Duke is FAR more comparable to Harvard and Stanford than GaTech and Michigan.
“Overall, Duke is FAR more comparable to Harvard and Stanford than GaTech and Michigan.”
IsaacTheFuture, first of all, Georgia Tech and Michigan are not comparable in most ways. GT is, almost exclusively elite in Engineering and CS. Michigan, on top of being elite in those fields, is also elite in other disciplines, such as the Social Sciences, the Humanities, the Life Sciences, Business, etc…GT is certainly elite, but it is a speciality school. Michigan shares more in common with Cal, Cornell, Northwestern, Penn, UVa and UCLA, UT-Austin, Duke etc…
“…and this is coming from someone who lives in Atlanta and bleeds gold and navy blue.”
Your coming from Atlanta naturally explains why you would think that GT is comparable to Michigan. And in what it does offer, it most certainly is. But Michigan offers much more. And their campus cultures (academically, intellectually, socially, even politically etc…) could not be more different. It also explains why you think that Duke is equal to Harvard and Stanford. Regional bias based on familiarity is perfectly understandable.
But in most other parts of the country, Duke is not considered “FAR more comparable to Harvard and Stanford than it is to Michigan”, unless you are referring to high school students, in which case, I agree with you. But if you are referring to people who actually hire college graduates, or graduate schools who admit undergrads into their programs, then Michigan are Duke are generally lumped together.
The most useful ranking is your personal ranking which takes into account costs to you and your personal interests, and likelihood of admission. Ranking lists are less useful because they have no value component. Arguably, any school with a degree in is inferior to one in . Likewise , a high cost school may be superior to a low cost school based on your estimated return. Look at lists from that perspective as well as cost and create your own.
Have you taken, or do you plan to take AP Calc and AP Physics ? If you have taken them, how did you do?
What was your ACT math score?