What are the Lifetime Advantages of Attending Top Colleges

Parents Forum
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<p>I have absolute confidence NSM went to Harvard.</p>

<p>Could an Ivy kid flunk out of state school? Sure…drugs, video games, never going to class, the usual suspects. Whereas the state school would cut you loose without a qualm, I believe that Harvard would make you take a year off and then allow you to return–hopefully with a more mature attitude toward your education and rehabbed. Once H deems you someone it wants as a student, I believe the institution gives you every chance (and more than one chance) to succeed.</p>

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Diversity as East Coast newspapers define it: journalists from H, Y AND P.</p>

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<p>beprepn,</p>

<p>That is so good you deserve a “high five”.</p>

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<p>ellemenope is right. I know a guy who was kicked out of Harvard for trying to steal a dorm sofa to take to his off campus apartment. He was reinstated later, and became a minister working with troubled youths. I read about his job in Harvard magazine.</p>

<p>I also knew a guy who during the turbulent 60s flunked every course one semester. Harvard let him continue, and he decided to take a double load the net semester and flunked those. To my knowledge, he eventually managed to graduate. Years later, I taught his son’s former girlfriend, who said the guy had become a lawyer.</p>

<p>I’m convinced that Harvard backs its students so much because of cognitive dissonance. After one does so much work to select a class from so many outstanding applicants, it’s hard to imagine that one could have made a mistake. With that kind of support behind them, eventually even the laziest, most troubled students usually manage to graduate.</p>

<p>Harvard also has a lot of patience with students who decide to rebel against Harvard.It didn’t permanently kick out students during the takeovers of the 60s and early 70s. After some of those students got over their anger at Harvard and the establishment, they became very supportive alum, including by making generous donations.</p>

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<p>““Overbooked public institutions”? As a journalism professor, clearly you know that word choice is important and powerful. By gratuitously adding “overbooked” to your description, I assume you meant to give the impression that public colleges are teeming with students who are effectively packed in like sardines.”</p>

<p>That’s because some public universities are. During one semester, the college where I used to teach had such an overload of freshmen that some classes overflowed into the halls.</p>

<p>Public institutions also in general don’t have a lot of patience with students whose grades drop. The universities have to be relatively generous with admitting students in order to keep voters happy. However, at many public universities, lots of students get kicked out for grade problems freshmen year. </p>

<p>Some students at public institutions end up taking 5 and 6 years to graduate because there’s no space available in courses they must take for their majors. From what I’ve seen, this isn’t as likely to happen at private universities. That’s also why colleges like Ivies graduate such a high proportion of their students on time.</p>

<p>As for why I think an Ivy kid might flunk out of a state school: Particularly at the less competitive state schools, there are more make work assignments like outlining and defining words, things to help the less prepared students learn. Those assignments, however, might be skipped by a student who could have gone to Harvard and is more inspired to do work by being challenged, not doing repetitious assignments about things that s/he already knows.</p>

<p>I also think that the professors at a lower ranked public would have less tolerance for students who are creative and who look to test their intellectual limits. It’s not fun for many professors and teachers to be challenged in class by smart know-it-all students, and some professors would take revenge by giving such students bad grades.</p>

<p>Some publics such as the one where I used to teach and one that I recently attended to take a language course for fun include attendance as part of their grades. For instance, automatic "Fs’ may be given for 5 absences. This is not anything I ever encountered at Harvard. Class participation was a small part of some course grades, but otherwise, as long as one got the work done, you wouldn’t be failed for skipping class.</p>

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<p>Apparently Harvard is also understanding when it comes to plagiarism: <a href=“http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060511/ap_en_ot/young_author[/url]”>http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060511/ap_en_ot/young_author&lt;/a&gt;.&lt;/p&gt;

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Is that really a good thing? From a personal accountability standpoint, isn’t there merit to “sink or swim”?</p>

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<p>DR14,
The students whom I mentioned were held accountable by being forced to take a leave of absence from school for a while. However, they eventually came back to school and graduated. To me, they were held accountable by being forced to take time off. However, they were also allowed to return after they matured, which seems fair to me. That both are productive citizens now also seems to indicate that they learned their lessons.</p>

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<p>Northstarmom, didn’t other schools have lenient policies in the 60’s and 70’s towards students with bad grades. Going to college in those times was a way to stay out of the Vietnam War. Many schools were protective of their students. Grades were not the big concern, keeping the students in school was the big concern. The alternative wasn’t appealing.</p>

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<p>IYes, colleges tended to be more lenient back in the ‘60s and 70s’ because being in college could keep young me from being drafted. However, in the cases of the students whom I mentioned, Harvard did kick both of them out for a while. They could have been drafted then.</p>

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<p>Northstarmom,</p>

<p>That’s not adult accountability. That’s a children’s time-out.</p>

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<p>Northstarmom, you used to make sense to me. I don’t know what you are talking about.</p>

<p>My guess is you are leaving CC soon and you just want to blow off some steam.</p>

<p>Great thread, though. :)</p>

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<p>“you’ll be among bright people.” “you won’t be the only geek at your school.” “you’ll give away your time for free like fellow idiots.”
“i may be a fat and ugly girl, but I went to Harvard.” “what if I’m unemployed and poor, I’m an Ivy grad.” …</p>

<p>Lame excuses all, desperate attempts to deny that all that time and effort were a waste.</p>

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<p>Too bad about that Bill Gates guy, though…</p>

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Yeah, whatever happened to that dude? I think he still has my beer bong.</p>

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<p>If you want a job upon graduation, you should get a marketable degree like accounting, engineering, etc., doesn’t matter from what school, but state schools are better if you just want to work and make money. avoid the ivies like a plague.</p>

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<p>^^^ I may comment on the rest of this thread later, but that’s the most absurd statement I’ve heard. Don’t back your statements with the writing of a sole English major from Yale a year after his graduation, it’s ridiculous.</p>

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<p>Wow, now there’s a great random sample.</p>

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<p>“Lame excuses all, desperate attempts to deny that all that time and effort were a waste.”</p>

<p>Just to be fair, I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you’re not trying to imply that a college education at an elite school is a waste. In fact, I think that spending money on your education, to the extent necessary or desirable, is the best investment that you can ever make in your entire life.</p>

<p>Also, to Northstarmom’s point, someone very close to me transferred this year to Cornell from SUNY Binghamton. He decided early on that he wanted to be an economics major. Unfortunately, he had so much trouble getting into classes in his major at SUNYB, and he was so frustrated that the classes that he did manage to get into had so many students in them that if you go to the class less than 5 minutes before it began, you had to stand in the back of the room, that he decided to apply to transfer out. I’ve heard similar stories from parents of students at Rutgers, ASU and a couple of other state universities. He has had a wonderful experience as an economics major at Cornell this year, despite his work study job and loans.</p>

<p>Just for the record, he originally chose SUNYB over Cornell after getting into both due to cost considerations. He is sorry now that he made that choice, and relieved that he had a second chance to fix his mistake.</p>

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<p>“A waste?” Heavens no where else can you consort with students such as these: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=179932[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=179932&lt;/a&gt;, and many others who are more interested in the getting in than getting educated?</p>