<p>EX:1) 90% return for sophomore year
2) 90% graduate within six years
I am researching for schools to attend.
Like I’m comparing schools to ivy schools. Ivy have 90 and over percent in both categories. But I still don’t get what this means.
I don’t understand #2 because not every one goes for their masters, which is obtain around 6 years.
Why isn’t “percent graduate in four years”?
What is a good percentage for each #1 and #2?
What does “six years” count for? Bachelors or Masters? Because generally it takes 4 years to get Bachelors.So, what percentages (both categories) will be good for each a small school and a large school?</p>
<p>Four, five, and six year graduation rates to earn a bachelor’s degree are typically reported. Obviously, four years is “on time” graduation. Six years is reported because few students who graduate take longer than six years, even though large percentages of students take more than four years.</p>
<p>A flaw in this reporting is that it is measured by calendar year, rather than number of semesters or quarters. This means that taking semesters off for co-op jobs or other non-school activities makes the four year graduation rate look worse, even if the student does not take additional semesters of school.</p>
<p>Where delayed graduation tends to be more of a problem is the situation of students needing extra semesters of school due to needing remedial courses, not taking full course loads, flunking courses, etc…</p>
<p>Graduation rates mostly track admissions selectivity, since stronger students are less likely to need remedial courses, be unable to take full course loads, or flunk courses.</p>
<p>Hey,
What about for an Art school or schools with "Art: in their name. Would that be fair because the majority of the Art majors take about 4 years to complete. It’s not like universities where people are bunch up in classes. When I do research, I noticed that Art schools have high percentages in “returning sophomore year” but a low percentage in “graduating in six years”. </p>
<p>‘Because generally it takes 4 years to get Bachelors.’ Perhaps, but a lot of people take longer than 4 years because of many reasons. 4, 5, 6 year rates include drop-outs too, though.</p>
<p>The Kiplinger’s site shows 4 year graduation rates for 100 private universities, 100 public universities, and 100 LACs. Most of the US News top ~20 national universities and top ~20 national LACs have 4 year graduation rates of about 80%-90%. Many highly-ranked state universities (UCs, Wisconsin, Illinois, Texas) have 4 year graduation rates of 50%-75%. Directional state universities generally have rates below 50%.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.kiplinger.com/tool/college/T014-S001-kiplinger-s-best-values-in-private-colleges/index.php”>http://www.kiplinger.com/tool/college/T014-S001-kiplinger-s-best-values-in-private-colleges/index.php</a></p>
<p>I think it’s reasonable to assume these rates reflect admission selectivity more than any other factor. Financial aid may be factor (since the highest-ranked schools also tend to have the best need-based financial aid). Course availability, program requirements, the quality of undergraduate advising, etc., also may have some impact. </p>
<p>^ Yes. Anecdotal data - my D’s friend went to art school and made it through two years before she quit due to burn out. What was a delight for her became drudgery. There was no relief from having to get more “product” done unlike with traditional colleges with broader curricula.</p>
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<p>Universities that serve a heavily commuter local student body may also have a greater number of part time students who take longer to graduate.</p>
<p>Most universities that have large engineering programs also have a lower four year graduation rate. </p>
<p>barkakid: Art schools may have lower 4 or 6 yr grad rates b/c in general 1) they are pretty expensive, 2) many learn that their talent won’t lead to a career if they continue in the field, 3) many realize the field isn’t what they dreamily thought it was as a 17 year old lugging around a portfolio.</p>
<p>My brother is a longtime adjunct at a local prestigious art school. About 20% of those who GRADUATE are still doing something in the field 5 yrs after graduation. And it drops off more after that. People’s blinders come off – they see the “struggling” artists and their $100K debts working 3 jobs to make ends meet. There is no shortage of highly talented people in the job market. He has a “Senior Seminar” to prepare 4th years as they graduate. He tells them: “You know that free lance job lead you hear about and ready your portfolio to sell yourself? I’ll be in the waiting room with mine as well” Harsh but true.</p>
<p>This, in part, explains why art schools in general don’t have wonderful 4 or 6 yr grad rates. It’s no secret among art school faculty and administrators.</p>
<p>T26E4: Yea, it is bad that art schools have some bad statistics. I either have the option to go to an Art school or large/small public/private university. I do want to go to a good school, so would you say that it’s a better option to attend a university over art schools? </p>
<p>The % return sophomore is usually an indication of how much the freshmen like the school. It would be lower if there are many drop out of transfer out students for whatever reason you can think of. </p>
<p>@barcakid39: It’s a tough thing to advise – it depends on how much fire in the belly you currently possess to be an artist and your willingness to enter into the field with your eyes wide open as to the real employment and remuneration possibilities. My brother is crazy talented – and gets flown several places yearly as his clients need him. But he still pounds the pavement to get free lance jobs and puts in his hours at the art college – still no benefits and he’s lucky to get Obamacare. He loves it and wouldn’t switch it for the world. </p>
<p>I’ll be frank with you: I wouldn’t want that life for either of my kids – based on what I know is important to them.</p>
<p>Where I teach, 25% of the incoming freshman class graduate with a bachelor’s degree after four years of college, from fall of year X finishing spring of year X + 4. 50% of that freshman class will graduate with a bachelor’s degree after six years - that’s including the 25% that graduated in 4 years, so that’s:
For that freshman class:
- a quarter graduate with a bachelor’s degree after four years of college (on-time)
- a quarter graduate with a bachelor’s degree after more than four but less than or equal to six years of college
- half of them DON’T graduate with a bachelor’s degree, after SIX years of college (some do drop out)</p>
<p>Which is very dismal.</p>
<p>The freshman retention rate where I teach is 80%, so that’s 20% of the freshman class are gone by the end of freshman year. Thus, we’d only be working with 80% starting sophomore year, and then 25% (25/80 = 31.25% of the ones still in school sophomore year) graduate after four years.</p>
<p>Remember that if you go into the arts or music, you VERY likely will be teaching at least part of the time to maintain some money. That is part of the drudgery of it. There are a few other ways to do it, like work at a museum and do art research.</p>
<p>What is “good” is more than 50% graduating after four years, what is better is more like 75% graduating after four years. Less than 50% graduating with a bachelor’s degree after four years is a warning sign. There are some five- and six-year programs out there, like architecture is usually at least five years and some degrees that mandate co-ops or internships to graduate go to five or six years. </p>
<p>You also have to look at the reverse - kids drop out because they were accepted and could not do the work. That is a problem with the university, not the kids. They should get funding based on graduation rates not enrollment.</p>