What is really needed for admission to an IVY or 2nd tier school? How many AP classes at a min, GPA needed? What courses do colleges look for? I would love to hear from those who received recent acceptances.
At least 12 AP classes, GPA at least 3.9, and high test scores for a strong chance. Additional requirements include good essays, recommendations, and impressive extracurriculars.
My school doesn’t even offer 12 AP classes so it really depends on your school. As long as you take the most rigorous schedule you should be fine.
Things that can really help:
Legacy
Recruited Athlete
Development ($$$)
Win International Award
Valedictorian
Salutatorian
Perfect standardized test scores
A family friend got into Cornell with less than 6 APs and below a 95 average… What about for 2nd/3rd tier schools? Georgetown, Duke, etc? Is there a section of the forum where recently admitted kids share grades etc and the schools they got into?
@algebraboy Yes, there’s a forum for that.
http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/colleges-universities/
http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/ivy-league/
You select these schools and under each school there is usually a “Results” Thread in which accepted, denied, deferred, waitlisted students post their stats, activities, mainly objective things. This gives you a general idea of what is needed (Strong academic record, in-depth involvement in extracurricular activities etc.)
They are not entirely accurate because they do not account for essays, teacher and counselor recommendations, interviews.
If you can’t find your school google “School Name+ CollegeConfidential” and you should be able to find a subforum for that specific school.
3.9+ unweighted GPA
2100+ SAT or 32+ ACT
Rigorous course-load at your school (which may include IB/AP/Honors)
Those are guidelines. From there, it comes down to your essays, activities, letters of recommendation, and “hooks.”
What is needed for a top school? Read this article by an MIT admissions officer:
http://mitadmissions.org/blogs/entry/applying_sideways
It’s not just for MIT; it’s for every single school out there.
Sorry but as hard as people try, there is no “formula” that will insure admission to these schools.
Generally? At least a 3.7 UW GPA (higher is better), with the most challenging course load, and an upward trend if it’s on the lower end. SAT score of 2100+ to realistically get your foot in the door (though sometimes there are outliers).
But beyond things you can measure, you have to be: outstanding in some way, showing drive and passion for the things you’re interested in, and a degree of serious accomplishment in those areas. You have to be not just smart, but have a depth of thought and intellect that comes across in your application/essays/supplements. Ordinary won’t cut it. The students I know who have gotten into Ivy & top tier recently have all had that “it” factor, and especially they presented very well “on paper”–because that’s what admissions officers get of you. An application package. It’s not a matter of a mathematical formula or a check-list you can meet–the hard things like grades, class loads, test scores, etc. are just the thing that get your app through the door.
In general, here’s what you need for admissions to an “elite” school:
- You need to show that you are academically qualified. This includes some combination of GPA/class rank (generally in the top 10% of your class is a rough target), curricular rigor, and standardized test scores. Colleges want to feel comfortable that you can handle the work. Letters of recommendation can also address this. For standardized tests, you should generally be at the 50% percentile or above to be comfortable; 75th percentile or above is better if you are an unhooked applicant. Here's a slightly old but still fairly valid guideline:
https://njsca.org/pdf/SAT_%20college_Class_of_2015.pdf
Curricular rigor depends on your school and what’s available to you; at the very least you want your GC to check off the “most rigorous” box on his form. Colleges want to know that you have pushed yourself, and have pursued academic interests at the highest level available to you.
In general, the more question marks you have in terms of academic qualifications, the higher the bar will be set for you to overcome those question marks in other areas. [Almost] no one will be admitted if the admissions committee does not believe that they can succeed academically.
1 is necessary but not sufficient: beyond being merely academically qualified, you need to show that you have something to offer that merits acceptance. Why should an elite college give you a spot over someone else? What skills to you bring to their community? Your ECs, essays, and letters of recommendation can play a huge role in this. Sometimes this is easy, especially for applicants with a high level of achievement in a particular skill set; sometimes it is more subtle.
- You need to package all of that into a clear and coherent application, which gives the admissions committee a strong picture of who you are and what you offer. You could be the greatest applicant in the world, but if you don't present yourself well, it won't come across to the adcom. I generally suggest that applicants come up with a "narrative" - a story that captures who they are. This often requires editing and omitting extraneous details and activities.
Remember, the purpose of the Admissions Committee at elite or highly selective colleges is to admit an entering class which maximizes “value” to the University. Most admissions decisions can be rationalized from this selfish perspective. I’ve discussed this a bit in a separate thread:
Here’s one elite college’s view on what they look for:
https://college.harvard.edu/admissions/application-process/what-we-look
You should assume that all of the following are necessary, but not sufficient, for admission to a super-selective school:
- Top end grades in rigorous course work.
- Top end test scores.
- Extremely high achievement in something other than the above (e.g. state or national recognition in something).
- Top end recommendations.
- Top end essays.
- No defects (e.g. poor interview).
I do not think the interviews matter that much unless you either could be a talk show host (positive) or are an arrogant SOB who clearly eats with their feet and shows up looking like a homeless person or an ax murderer. ALL OF THOSE, not just some. As in it is probably ok to be an SOB as long as you are not also dressed like a bag lady.
As for grades it is not an absolute but assuming no hooks or URM, at least top 10% of your class, preferably, one of the top 10 people in a large class (assuming you go to a typical school and not a Bronx Science), 2200 plus or 33. I know someone very qualified who had a 32 (her mother claims) and was rejected everywhere and ended up going someplace on a merit scholarship.
I also always felt grades and SATs were a package. So if you had perfect grades (or almost), then a 2250 was ok. If you had “only” a 3.8, then you really needed the 2350 to stand out. Others disagree and think there is a minimum and after that it does not matter whether it is a 2200 or a 2300 and they look at everything else.
Another thing is your prospective major. Girls in STEM, boys in liberal arts are favored. Also there are some schools that have under served majors. You want to get into MIT? Tell them you want to be a Russian/French/Spanish major. That assumes you speak the language and have visited the country and displayed ECs related to that. I read somewhere a while back that Penn was looking for certain science majors in its liberal arts college.
very helpful! thanks