<p>Hypothetical situation: The parent of a high school senior wants to give his son every possible “edge” in applying to Ivy League schools. So, the parent hires an extremely qualified consultant to help his son pick the college application essay topic, and to edit it to a point where it is virtually perfect. The final product is a true masterpiece. </p>
<p>In December, the student is accepted to the Ivy under the Early Decision plan. The student can now “relax” a little.</p>
<p>In the spring of his senior year, the student has a major essay that is due for the AP English course in which he is enrolled. The student decides to pay his friend, an English major at an Ivy, to help him pick a topic and then edit it to a point of virtual perfection. The boy approaches his father, and asks him for money to pay the friend for help with editing the major essay.</p>
<p>If you are the father, what would you do in this situation? And why?</p>
<p>What??? This is crazy. No offense but the answer is clear. You tell him do it yourself! if he gets caught in any way plagarizing and sometimes teachers know wether its your work or not, they can report it to a school and that could cause the college to rescind there offer.</p>
<p>You pay for the assistance of the friend. The message with hiring someone in the first place was that it is okay to pay someone for assisting in what truthfully should be the student’s own work.</p>
<p>The two situations are identical and to somehow come down on or punish the student for the second can be described in no terms other than hypocritical.</p>
<p>The issue you’re trying to raise here is whether professional college admissions counselors are ethical or not. I agree with you that they are not. How, after all, are the situations different? (Except for the perceived importance of the assignment in question. It still doesn’t excuse the student.)</p>
<p>I think you tell him “NO”. Because then he will think that he can pay people to do his other works and this can lead to a bad habit and when he goes to college he going to pay people to his work there. So tell him no, and give that kid some advice before he get kick out of school or college.</p>
<p>Hypothetical situation: The parent of a high school senior wants to give his son every possible “edge” in applying to Ivy League schools. So, the parent hires an extremely qualified consultant to help his son pick the college application essay topic, and to edit it to a point where it is virtually perfect. The final product is a true masterpiece.</p>
<p>In December, the student is accepted to the Ivy under the Early Decision plan. The student can now “relax” a little.</p>
<p>In the spring of his senior year, the student has a major essay that is due for the AP English course in which he is enrolled. The student decides to pay his friend, an English major at an Ivy, to help him pick a topic and then edit it to a point of virtual perfection. The boy approaches his father, and asks him for money to pay the friend for help with editing the major essay.</p>
<p>If you are the father, what would you do in this situation? And why?</p>
<p>In my opinion, it is a matter of how much the student “learns” about writing. If the person “editing the paper to perfection” actually sits down and shows him why he made the changes, how the changes are advantageous, why some words are a better use of proper speech, why it is better to write this way vs. that way in formal writing, etc., then I would consider it a “tutoring” session. Otherwise, if the kid is learning nothing from the experience, then it is fraud.</p>
<p>I wouldn’t have paid for the first consultant or supported it in any way and therefore would have been in a good position to explain in the second situation how unethical his plan for getting his second essay written is. I’d not only not pay for it but I’d not allow him to do it.</p>
<p>Having a consultant choose the topic and heavily edit the result is effectively having that consultant write the paper. Why not just pay the consultant to go ahead and provide a turn-key paper so the son doesn’t have to do anything at all?</p>
<p>arcata 07: I didn’t say create the essay. I said “help the student pick the topic, then edit it to virtual perfection.” </p>
<p>Also, in regard to your response to post #2… “Elite” colleges are fully aware that parents hire experts to edit their children’s college application essays to virtual perfection. With that said, how could that same college have the nerve to rescind an offer of admission, if the student is simply getting the exact same kind of help on his English essay that he got on his college application essay?</p>
<p>ucsd: Getting into the Ivies is tough. If other parents (the “competition”) are providing their children with consultants, what’s wrong with a parent giving their child the same opportunity. It’s a dog-eat-dog world out there.
Every parent wants his child to have an “even playing field” when it comes to admission.</p>
<p>Perhaps in Ivy college admissions this quote holds true: “Nice guys finish last”</p>
<p>What a twisted web we weave, when we practice to deceive.</p>
<p>I don’t think admissions into any college, Ivy League or not, is worth cheating for. </p>
<p>Certainly have your son write the paper himself. He can’t go through life having people do all his work for him. He needs to learn to do great work on his own at some point. Paying people to do stuff for you is not a good habbit.</p>
<p>My “Mom Hat” is on: I have no problem with a student asking someone for a critique of his essay, assuming the AP teacher has no problem with it. I’ve done this at home with my kids since they were young – I’ll read it, then sit down with them and go over it, line by line. My method falls along the lines of the Socratic method – “tell me how you can make this sentence active instead of passive,” “what verb/adjective might convey more meaning?” It’s time-intensive, but it works. Both write well and can evaluate/edit their own work.</p>
<p>Most colleges have Writing Centers for just this sort of thing, and my sons’ HS English teachers have made it abundantly clear they are more than willing to look at a student’s draft and go over it WITH THEM.</p>
<p>Paying someone to actually do the editing, with or without any participation invested by the student, is over the line to me.</p>
<p>On the other hand, I’ll bet that in this hypothetical, the father is saying “no” to handing out money, and the son is saying, “But why not? This is what we did for my college apps!” </p>
<p>In response to that dilemma, I would posit that the counselor (should have) earned his/her fees by sitting down and offering guidance and constructive feedback which the student then wrote down and implemented, not proofreading. In either event, someone else doing substantive editing is shortchanging the student, who will have to rise or fall on his own merits soon enough (say in early May with the AP exam?!). </p>
<p>If you are you saying that college counselors actually edit the essays themselves, I guess I’m hopelessly naive.</p>
<p>gfred: Is it really cheating to hire an expert consultant to help your child edit college application essay to perfection? If so, then why do the “elite” college admissions offices, who know such a practice is quite prevalent, let it slide?</p>
<p>“gfred: If it’s not a good habit, then why is it so often rewarded in our society?”</p>
<p>I think you are just using society as an excuse here. If you are saying your son can get through life simply by paying people to do his work for him, then yes, I agree. He can. The real question you need to ask yourself is if you really want him to go through life like this.</p>
<p>In my experience, when you get to this level of hand-holding, people tend to understandably dread cutting it off. You get to this point where every time you give in and ask for help it will be “last time,” but it keeps not being the last time. The sooner you put an end to it, the better. If these are geniune help sessions where your son is an active participant and is the one doing the actual writing, then there is nothing wrong. But I am getting the impression from your posts that this is a borderline case. So yes, I would say that the sooner he is cut off from such things, the better.</p>
<p>CountingDown: Please don’t use (misuse) the term “college counselor” interchangeably with “essay consultant.” The two areas of expertise are about as far apart as possible.</p>
<p>A “college counselor” is someone who assist the student in selecting a college that is a great “fit” with the students attributes, needs and goals.</p>
<p>A “college strategist” is a highly paid individual who has “inside knowledge” of what happens behind closed doors in college admissions offices. He/She makes suggestions to help to “strategically position” the student as the student competes for a highly coveted slot.</p>
<p>I know (think?) this is a hypothetical. But let’s play.</p>
<p>Honor Code: what does the honor code of his high school say? My guess is that it might address the situation. One is tempted to simplify it into making “paying for help” an issue. But what about paid tutoring in Calculus for a struggling kid? Paid tutoring in Remedial Math for a struggling kid in the non-college prep category? Consultant vs. tutor can be a fine line. Ditto paid consultant vs. unpaid mom or dad effectively writing a paper.</p>
<p>Honor signature (or whatever you call signing your college app to indicate it is truthful and your own work): doesn’t say you can’t hire consultants, paid Guidance Counselors, etc. Again, there is a line. And the outline in the OP doesn’t tell us enough. IMO.</p>
<p>Consider the following:</p>
<p>Scene 1: Kid writes essay. Submits it to consultant for help in “editing it to the point of perfection.” Consultant sends it back with notation indicating where the kid has been redundant, unclear, disorganized. Flags overuse of passive voice. Comments that there is not enough variation in sentence structure. Tells kid to revise and re-submit. Repeat. Until “point of perfection” is reached.<br>
Scene 2: Kid writes essay. Consultant rewrites it “to the point of perfection.” Kid slides it into envelope and submits.</p>
<p>Two entirely different scenarios. Both may violate some people’s sense of ethics. I assume Scene 2 would violate all people’s sense of ethics. Scene 1 does not necessarily violate mine.</p>
<p>Edit: cross-posted with CountingDown and I believe we are saying essentially the same thing</p>