<p>Alright, I’m probably just a dumbass, but, because I couldn’t find the answer on Wikipedia, I’m posting this here question:</p>
<p>Has the University of Pennsylvania always been an Ivy League? If not, when did it become one and why?</p>
<p>I’m asking this, because (1) I remember hearing a few times that there were only seven Ivy League schools, and (2) its name sounds like the name of a state school, not a prestigious private one. Thank you.</p>
<p>“In 1945 the presidents of the eight schools signed the first Ivy Group Agreement, which set academic, financial, and athletic standards for the football teams.”</p>
<p>“In 1954, the date generally accepted as the birth of the Ivy League, the presidents extended the Ivy Group Agreement to all intercollegiate sports. Competition began with the 1956 season.”</p>
<p>[Ivy</a> League - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia](<a href=“http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivy_League]Ivy”>Ivy League - Wikipedia)</p>
<p>The 8 schools that make up the Ivy League have always been in the Ivy League. It is a sports association. </p>
<p>Yes, the name sounds like the name of a state school. It is not.</p>
<p>This post reeks of ■■■■■ and/or flame</p>
<p>I think that every other Ivy League school started off as a divinity school, or at least was religiously affiliated. Penn was the first US college set up specifically to be independent of religion by Ben Franklin, so that’s probably why it got the name University of Pennsylvania, as opposed to Franklin University or something. And I think also that all the other ivy league school names come from the founders of the schools, who were religious men. I might be wrong on this though. And yeah its funny how the original football league is now like Division III status and the bottom rung when it comes to college football. Smart people invented football, then realized how dangerous it is, haha.</p>
<p>Uh, Division III status? Let’s not be silly, here. Although football games don’t have a great attendance record in recent history, the programs are pretty good. Penn finished ranked #14 in the nation for the FCS (Divison I-AA), which means it was better than 131 teams in the Football Championship Subdivision. If not for a completely stupid Ivy League rule prohibiting teams from playing more than ten games in a season, Penn would have received an automatic bid to the 20 team FCS playoffs this year; last year we also would have received an automatic bid. In addition, Harvard and Yale both have reputable football teams which get consideration for the top 25 every year in recent memory.</p>
<p>Think of it this way… Penn’s football team this year was probably good enough to beat Indiana and Purdue, considering it hung tight with the best teams in the FCS and considering that some of the better FCS teams routinely beat the worse FBS teams. Is Penn as good as, say, Temple, UNC or any of the unmentioned Big Ten teams? No way. But for not having scholarships and having next to no pro recruiting, we don’t do too badly for ourselves.</p>
<p>Honestly, the Ivy League is really shooting itself in the foot by continuing its policies. Although the idea of “no athletic scholarships” in order to promote academics is great in principle, it just doesn’t make practical sense. Student-athletes are asked to dedicate just as much time at Ivy League schools as they are at any other division I school, and the schools make money off of some of the programs (Cornell hockey, Penn basketball, etc), yet the athletes get no compensation? It’s senseless! Start allowing schools to offer athletic scholarships; they can, like Stanford, maintain high academic standards for athletes (Stanford recruits must have academic credentials similar to non-athletes in order to get in!). The progression is pretty simple. Offer scholarships to student-athletes; those athletes who would love to go to an Ivy League school but who get a full ride offer from another school could be persuaded to go to the Ivy; the level of play increases over the course of a decade, generating more student body interest in the sports; student demand for tickets increases, causing ticket prices to increase; schools begin to attract attention from networks, and the league gets a modest TV deal (think basketball for this one); schools receive more and more money, allowing them to recruit better student-athletes but also allowing them to divert money to other academic pursuits (just look at Duke, for heaven’s sake! their basketball team was their ticket to academic excellence!); the level of both athletic and academic success is necessarily raised over the course of 25 years. Plus, a school with well-known successful sports teams kinda recruits without having to try.</p>
<p>Just sayin’</p>
<p>@chrisw, are you from Indiana? I am, and I find it curious that you mentioned IU and Purdue.</p>
<p>I went to a Yale-Penn game (my sister goes to Yale and it was on Parents Weekend) and during the game, the quarterback (I think) dropped the ball in the middle of a play. It was hilarious but a funny game to watch. Just sayinggg.</p>
<p>The University of Pennsylvania was named the University of Pennsylvania a century before the first “public” universities were created. Back then, any nonprofit institution was essentially public. What made Penn different was that it never sold its “naming rights” to the highest donor, unlike Harvard, Yale, Brown, Cornell, Stanford, Duke, Williams, and many others. And it never changed its name to something snootier-sounding, unlike The College of New Jersey (now Princeton, but still for less than half of its existence).</p>
<p>I don’t fully understand the process that occurred in the mid-19th Century, when some pre-existing universities seem to have become fully state-controlled (UVa), others more hybrids (Michigan, Cornell), and still others received oodles of public support while remaining almost totally private (Harvard, Yale). I’m sure there is an interesting reason why Penn DIDN’T become Penn State, but I don’t know it.</p>
<p>Nope, been in Philly my entire life. Indiana and Purdue are just the two worst teams in the Big Ten haha</p>
<p>Sorry, Ivyleaguer11. This really wasn’t a flame or a ■■■■■ post, though I know it’s kind of a stupid question. Just wanted to know the answer.</p>
<p>Why don’t people ask questions like this about the Massachusetts Institute of Technology? The Georgia Institute of Technology is fully public, as was the Texas Technological College (now Texas Tech) . . . .</p>
<p>People actually do the opposite–occasionally they ask whether Georgia Tech is a private school. The two best-known [blank] Institute of Technology schools are private, after all.</p>
<p>^don’t forget the Fashion Institute of Technology. ;)</p>
<p>Princeton is named after…Princeton, NJ…</p>
<p>Don’t worry about Penn’s name. They people who need to know (graduate schools, high prestige internships, etc) will. If you’re truly upset that Penn doesn’t sound prestigious, then you aren’t applying to colleges for the right reasons.</p>
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<p>They seem to do OK on CC. </p>
<p>And I can’t speak for all alumni of the Ivies, but I’m not bothered by the somewhat amateurish level of play on the football field. I think it’s kind of…quaint.</p>
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<p>I don’t think that’s necessarily true just because I feel like the Ivy League is acclaimed more for its academics than its athletics. People never say “Harvard” and think “oh, football team”, yet it still remains a household name. The Ivy League will never fall to wayside because at the end of the day, it will always be prestigious and well thought-of, regardless of the quality of its athletics.</p>
<p>ivy- University of Pennsylvania, aka: Penn or UPenn
public- Pennsylvania State University, aka: Penn state</p>
<p>Upenn was an ivy-league long ago (founded by Ben Franklin, isn’t that cool)
its also a killer med school, has alot of funding from the NIH.</p>
<p>lol. Pennsylvania State University is not public… it is semi-public. Penn State is, ironically, not a state school, meaning it is not part of the Pennsylvania State system of universities. It has its own president and governs itself as it would were it a private school, but it just happens to get a LOT of state funding. Unlike Bloomsburg, Millersville, etc. Penn State has its own endowment, as do Temple and Pitt.</p>
<p>The more you know!</p>
<p>Also, I would partially disagree with the first two posters on this page. Although the Ivy League is known far more for its academics than for its athletics, that doesn’t discount the idea that the Ivy League shoots itself in the foot by maintaining antiquated athletic policies. Is the Ivy League good overall? Yes. Could it be better in some fashions? YES!</p>
<p>Penn State is public in about the same way that most “state flagships” are public. Almost all of them have the same mixed character.</p>