There are anti-vaxxer doctors?
With all due respect, marie, what are you talking about?
marie, reputable doctors are telling these people “vaccinate or find another pediatrician.” So they’re left with those who support their non-medically sound beliefs. Again, we have discussed a lot of this in the thread.
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/patients-649632-see-vaccine.html Good for these guys. Watching out for the majority of their patients.
^^^I was in the midst of typing a response, but you said exactly what I was trying to say, but so much better.
I think most doctors do approach parents’ concerns with respect and patience, but once they have presented them with the reams of evidence and research which has been conducted by experts not only from the US, but all over the world that shows that the benefit of vaccines far outweighs the risk, what else can they do? At that point it begins to seem like many of these parents are being willfully obtuse.
Even some formerly anti-vaccine or vaccine-choice doctors are now gladly administering measles shots.
There are anti-vaxxer doctors?
Yes, of course. I could name names but that may be inappropriate. But, certainly they exist. They are pro-choice when it comes to vaccines more than anti, I think.
@jym626 - I didn’t mean to imply anything about doctors in general, and I’m sorry if it sounded that way. I was trying to interpret the other poster’s point.
It’s probably the case that most of us “disobey” doctors on one thing or another, but vaccines are one of the few that can have such a devastating effect on other innocent children…
Again, healthcare is a team approach. Often in today’s healthcare model the conversation about the purpose of today’s visit, the risk/benefit of any scheduled treatment and discussion of questions/concerns is done with the nurse prior to the physician coming into the exam room. It would be lovely if every physician could spend 45 minutes with each patient having a lengthy conversation, but with the possible exception of concierge healthcare its sadly one of the wonderful things about healthcare that went out with the housecall.
Note: I am not saying no Doctor spends time with their patients. Many of us can give plenty of examples to the contrary. But in the new world of Drs pressured by the owners of the practice to see XX number of patients an hour and possibly review the PA or nurses work in between patients, its become the exception rather than the rule.
Well, as someone who is married to someone whose job it is to develop new drugs and bring them to market, I can tell you that it is anything but rushed. It takes years… many, many, many years of various levels of clinical studies and multiple FDA approvals along the way. It’s not like a company with a new drug decides one day, “Let’s submit these Phase 3 clinical trial results next week and get ready to ship out the new drug next month.” I just watched this process unfold over the last few years in the company H works for. It is so regulated so that no interpretation of impropriety exists such that, when H has visited the FDA, he can’t even buy a colleague there a cup of coffee, or visa versa. He could get fired for doing that.
http://www.fiercebiotech.com/topics/fda_approval_process.asp
From the link:
I can guarantee you that most times, it is the patients and physicians who are saying it’s taking too long to get drugs to market. The pressure is on these companies to make their product available yesterday, but the extreme thoroughness required by the FDA process (as it should be) often prevents this from happening. The company that H works out just had a major project reach final approval just over a month ago. Based on the time frames that are laid out by the FDA and how long they have to get back to companies with their approvals or denials, companies know when to expect an answer. And they can then prepare for product release to coincide with that final approval date because so many people are waiting for it. But it’s basically in the FDA’s hands, who are not the ones who stand to make money on new drugs.
It seems like even if a parent had a fear that there was a connection between autism and vaccinations they would see that it would be “safe” to have their child vaccinated after that magic window where autism is often diagnosed. So kids have rounds of shots between 18 months and 3 years and wonder of wonders that’s also the time where kids are becoming more verbal and social . . . or not. What’s to stop these parents from having their kids fully vaccinated before kindergarten?
If not what’s to stop them from just attending The Waldorf School rather than public school.
What teri said. I’m very familiar with the process as well.
Yup. It is not as simple - as Teri said. It costs millions of $ to get to the starting line of Phase 3 and many more millions of $ to run the Phase 3 trials, and in the end, about 1 in 10 drugs that enter Phase 3 make it to the market.
An irony just hit me.
When Ebola hit (a disease admittedly more deadly but less contagious), people were losing their freaking minds. Nothing happened here (as most non-hysterical people predicted).
Now that Measles is on the rise- an almost completely preventable disease that you don’t even need a hazmat suit for!- it’s largely silent. Very few people care. The most you get is some eye rolls and frustration from those of us who care about people.
Hm… I just can’t put my finger on why we’d scream and freak out over one and not the other… I almost wonder if it has something to do with the origins and target population of each outbreak.
Can you imagine if a relatively unknown and exotic disease was striking white, upper middle class young people like Measles is? Can you imagine the cries for a treatment, a prevention, etc? And if this was striking a poor community of color there would be cries of isolation and closing the borders.
I’m not trying to be political- I’m just tracking the recent history of these issues.
I have been thinking about this too, romani. There was a collective national freakout over Ebola. Schools closed, people cancelled trips, and at least one person who refused to self-quarantine was the subject of intense national debate.
I think the foreignness of Ebola vs. measles is part of it but there might be something else too.
Well, to be fair, Ebola was in the headlines because it’s fatal something like 50% of the time. Measles is, for most people, uncomfortable but not a killer. Of course, for that very small percent it is a killer and disabling, but people are stupid.
Besides, it is in the headlines right now.
A Bard college student who was contagious but not symptomatic travelled from Penn Station, then Albany via Amtrak. The train then continued on to Niagara Falls.
( Ebola is perceived as nearly always fatal. Measles is perceived as harmless; I think that’s the crux of the panic differential. )
The Bard case has been reported here… twice ( now 3 times). And the comparison to a more deadly disease like ebola has also been made. The hysteria with ebola was probably in part due to ignorance, unfamiliarity and the horrific effects on a person as the disease rapidly progresses, with a high frequency of death and no available vaccine. Measles seems less scary to people because they are generally familiar with it and see it as a relatively benign illness. However, it isn’t a benign disease, especially in the young and in countries with high rates of malnutrition and poor healthcare. http://www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs286/en/
The same ignorance that caused the overreaction to ebola in the US seems to be feeding the comparative under-reaction by many. If/when we start to see some fatalities from measles, and/or cases of significant complications with permanent effects like blindness or cognitive or neurological effects from encephalitis. And, like ebola, there isn’t really a treatment for measles- just management of the symptoms and course of the illness when it hits.
Failing to prevent one’s child from this potentially fatal disease should be considered neglect, IMO. This is a HIGHLY contagious disease, that remains in the air and on surfaces for several hours. People SHOULD be alarmed. Too bad there isn’t a vaccine for stupidity.
Besides, there’s a vaccine for measles. People can get vaccinated. It’s not really a threat.
Right. So if there were a vaccine for Ebola, and American doctors encouraged everyone to get it, would the anti-vaxers do it? Or would their “principles” still stand?