Yup!! Made DH promised I wouldn’t go out with a goatee!!
So there is no evidence of penetration between the husband and wife?
I think there are some deeply ingrained cultural ideas of sex as an imposition on women and a favor for men–they can be seen even in the language, and in stories. (I was thinking about the conception of Garp in “The World According to Garp.”) I’m not brave enough to opine on whether these differences are based on anything other than culture, but they are certainly there in culture. I think they may make it difficult for us to identify the basis of our assumptions about this topic.
Which would be monumentally disingenuous on the part of the daughters since they SPECIFICALLY had her moved to a double room AGAINST her spoken wishes in order to make it more difficult for her to be intimate with her husband.
LOL abt the grooming; that’s my family, too.
I mentioned my ailing 95-year-old grandmother upthread. Mostly when I visit her she’s either non-verbal or babbling about hallucinations. But a few weeks ago, out of the blue, she had a moment of coherence in which she looked at me and said, “I like your new blush!” Yep, I was indeed wearing different blush. There’s not a single other person in the world (with the possible exception of my mother) who would have noticed that I was wearing different blusher/rouge.
The care facility said that Mr. Rayhons was there in the meeting where it was decided that Mrs. Rayhons would move from home to the care facility, didn’t they? The daughters also say that at that meeting, they broached the idea of in-home care but Mr. Rayhons shot it down. She needed more care than she was getting at home, and something had to be done. It’s often the elder’s children who initiate the necessary higher level of care, as those of us who read Parents Helping Parents know. Often, it’s an unhappy but necessary transition.
I would facilitate my sister having sex with another resident, if she wanted to. (Not an orderly-- care facilities should not employ orderlies who want to have sex with patients. There is too much opportunity for abuse.) I’d bring them a nice bottle of wine. However, I’d want to be sure that it was what she wanted, and not just what he wanted. If my sister was so far gone she stared vacantly at a sandwich having no idea what to do with it, I think I’d say the time for her consenting to sex with other residents or orderlies was over. I think-- maybe if I were there and saw exactly what that state was like for her, I’d have a different view.
Garp: The scene that sticks in my mind is the car accident. It might be interesting to talk about that book in the context of all these threads. It seems a pretty stereotypical male point of view in my memory, but It’s probably been 40 years since I read it. A rape? A feminist response?
ETA: I could download it to my new kindle if anyone wants another book thread. He wouldn’t be my first choice, though.
@jym626, according to what I’ve read there was no evidence of penetration, either semen or vaginal tearing or anything, no matter how minor.
So what was the nature of the “sexual contact” that she was unable to consent to?
@Consolation, where is the article that says that Mrs. Rayhons was moved to a double room against her spoken wishes?
The prosecution didn’t offer any physical evidence of penetration, that I’ve read of, and surely they would have done so if they had had it.
One of the newer articles said that she was very unhappy about being moved to the new room, but the nursing home wanted it for a male patient. (Evidently combined with the Ds’ desire to call a halt to her sex life.) I can’t remember which one.
It was this article:
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-12-09/rape-case-asks-if-wife-with-dementia-can-say-yes-to-her-husband.html
Here is the quote "Donna moved into Room 12 North on Friday, May 23. She wasn’t happy about it, according to the daughters’ log. She wept and accused Brunes of not liking her husband. "
This paints the daughters as participants in the sequence of events leading to this point, and I wonder if their being “sickened” wasn’t the driving force, whether they pursued prosecution or not.
The fact that Mrs. Rayhons recognized her husband up until that point and clearly sought his company, tells me a lot. Like the doctor said in the article, the testing showed that she had dementia, nothing more than that.
I think the daughters are getting a raw deal on this thread. It wasn’t the daughters that were “sickened” it was the “staffers” at the facility:
Yes, it hardly sounds as if she was incapable of consent on that date. Sounds to me like she had a pretty good grasp of the family dynamics, even if she didn’t know what day it was.
You’re right HarvestMoon, I misread that. But I don’t think being sickened is a professional and appropriate manner of making decisions.
That certainly indicates awareness to me.
Thanks, @zoosermom. I hadn’t seen the Bloomberg article.
The daughters wrote in their logs that the staff was “sickened.” The only direct staff testimony I have seen was that she was always happy to see Henry and enjoyed his visits.
I doubt the judge would allow testimony about the personal feelings of staff members toward Mr. Rayhons. So whether the staff was sickened could not come out at trial. Have any staff members spoken to the press about the matter?
The case has gone to the jury. I predict acquittal.
I also predict this is correct:
“”"One of my sisters already made me promise to see to her personal grooming needs if she is unable to do so. That is so important to her, she wants to be absolutely positive it is taken care of regardless of her physical circumstances. She gave me a list.
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adding: this may tell you something about my family of origin that the main concern thus far, when considering end of life issues, is personal grooming."
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Ha - that’s ours, too!
“”"
Yep!! My sisters and I would certainly see to it that we each were “groomed.”
My sister and I did NOT like the way make up was applied to my mom for her viewing before her funeral. We took mom’s actual make-up bag and “fixed things”. Heck, I even changed the actual casket because mom would “look better” resting in soft pink satin. (mom’s fave color was pink)