<p>so I’m confused today
who is the “real” Hillary? The one who was sweet and loving at the end of the last debate saying it was an honor to be on stage with Barack or the strident almost fire breathing campaigner of today comparing Barack to Carl Rove for a campaign tactic of sending out brochures about health care and NAFTA, and once again demeaning his massive rallies and empty speeches.
Is it any wonder people can’t get a handle on who she really is?</p>
<p>Lorelei, could you please link to some examples on this board showing “hysterical bashing” by “obama devotees” that reveals their inability to “function analytically”?</p>
<p>I have to tell you that that when my mother was teaching medical school at the University of Chicago, the dean thought that her analytical skills were just fine. The two federal judges who have trusted me to write their opinions likewise thought that I was able to offer more than “wildly thrashing advocacy.”</p>
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<p>And yet, I’ve heard in the media several times that the demographic of the typical Hillary supporter is the “less-educated” (and “lower income” too, I think). Would that be accurate - or just another way the media subtly incorporates messages to voters (i.e. “all the smart people are voting for Obama”)?</p>
<p>In any case, this has been, for the most part, a great discussion on CC. </p>
<p>I tend to think that most of what has happened in HRC’s life has played out very close to her own device. I think she loved Bill, but also saw that by latching on to him she could open a lot of doors that she wouldn’t otherwise be able to open on her own, slogging away in obscurity in Washington. Bill was elected as governor of AR at a very young age. That was probably their (her?) goal early on. As the accomplishments grow, so does the ambition. There’s no doubt that Hillary is ambitious - she just chose what appeared to be the path that would open the most doors in the shortest amount of time…</p>
<p>Even if it meant whipping Bill into shape politically and putting up with his antics from time to time.</p>
<p>Yes, I’d say she has done the most politically expedient thing from day one. </p>
<p>JMHO.</p>
<p>Well, Hanna, those sharp analytical skills should have convinced you to read exactly what I said instead of defending your mother’s analytical skills, about which I know nothing, or your writing of legal opinions which presumably I have never seen. Nothing in my post says anything about the posters on this board. </p>
<p>cathymee: The “real” HRC is much like most parents, capable of great love and compassion AND getting p**<em>ed as h</em>ll at things she does not like nor think appropriate. Most of our offspring can vouch for that kind of breadth of demeanor in each of us. To present differently makes us rather boring and not a bit believable as invested human beings.</p>
<p>"“How about Teddy, Bobby & Patrick Kennedy? How about W & Jeb Bush? How about the many (mostly) sons of various Congressmen, governors, civil rights leaders, etc. Do the names Udall, Sununu, Chaffee, Jackson, etc ring a bell?” </p>
<p>Ok, I have absolutely nothing good to say about any of the Kennedys so I will defer on that one. I think they are among the most sleazy humans to walk the earth. To think I would defend them is laughable. Chafee? Me? Defend? Surely you jest. I’m on record as never having been a fan of W, but from what I know, Jeb was an excellent governor in the state in which he lived. True or not? The thing you don’t get is this: had Hillary run for office in Arkansas, that would have been a totally different thing. She had roots there and was well known in her own right. She had none of that in New York and elbowed out of the way a very competent woman. The thing that bothers many in the Hillary camp is that when it is pointed out that she has no experience and is, in fact, riding coattails, it shines light on the fact that there is no rational basis for supporting her. It’s all about emotions and bringing bias to bear by her supporters. It’s the opposition, although populated by many haters, who have the rational argument to make. She has no more experience or accomplishment than Senator Obama and the supporters can’t make a factual argument for her candidacy and that drives them nuts.</p>
<p>“People are speaking here as though she has no background or education. Even if you don’t want to vote for her, I really don’t understand why anyone (and especially women) would completely discount her own education and accomplishments,”</p>
<p>She is brilliant and educated. She is an amazingly hardworking woman and her constituent service is unparalleled. But those attributes don’t qualify her for the presidency. As I said, I know hundreds of people with similar or better qualifications who have no business in the White House either.</p>
<p>^^ couldn’t have said it better.</p>
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<p>Is BO any more qualified than HRC under those circumstances? Will there be no one to vote for come election day (if you’re a dem)?</p>
<p>“Is BO any more qualified than HRC under those circumstances? Will there be no one to vote for come election day (if you’re a dem)?”</p>
<p>I think neither has the edge in experience and both are just different degrees of extremely liberal. Obama’s edge is that he doesn’t have to lug Bill around on his back! I’d like to be on record here (and you can all rip me apart if I’m wrong) that I think she could and likely will win the nomination. If she wins even small victories in Ohio, Texas and PA, I think she will be the nominee.</p>
<p>“Is BO any more qualified than HRC under those circumstances? Will there be no one to vote for come election day (if you’re a dem)?”</p>
<p>BO is MUCH more qualified. We know what she accomplished in 8 years, we know how she used her judgment, and we know that she doesn’t do her homework (and then brags about it). </p>
<p>Both rightwing Democrats. But BO is definitely the more qualified of the two.</p>
<p>Re #114</p>
<p>Wishful thinking as a Republican ? ;)</p>
<p>If she wins the nomination, I would think (no bets yet) that McCain will be our next President.</p>
<p>"Wishful thinking as a Republican ? "</p>
<p>Ha! No, it’s like calling Bloody Mary!</p>
<p>lorelei
I dont know what Hillary’s parenting skills have to do with the reaction she had today to the Obama campaigns brochures, which apparently have been in circulation for weeks already or how she summarized the debate last Tuesday in her closing statement? I’m questionoing how different she can appear to the public as the needs of her campaign require.I think its confusing for the public and makes it hard to define her persona.</p>
<p>“Yellow dog democrat” here, too, but I have to agree with simba:</p>
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<p>Also agree with lorelei:</p>
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<p>I really don’t understand this hatred for Clinton. Honestly, when I hear the die-hard Obama supporters and their never-ending Hillary bashing, it sounds like they’re running scared to me-- despite how well he’s doing in the polls.</p>
<p>"“Yellow dog democrat” here, too, but I have to agree with simba:</p>
<p>Quote:
It seems that many here are having orgasms by bashing her. "</p>
<p>What specific posts are you folks referring to?</p>
<p>cathymee, I was not referencing her as a parent, just paralleling the extremes of persona we all demonstrate as we move through life within our various roles…sorry not to be clearer.</p>
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<p>I remember reading the results of a poll taken in the past couple of years that asked whether the person would vote for a woman for president. The percentage of those who would NOT vote for a woman was in the high 20s/30s. That is a high obstacle for any woman who is trying to get elected to the Oval Office. Politics at the highest levels is definitely a boys club.</p>
<p>Add onto that the numbers of people who just hate the Clintons. Republicans (and others) just froth at the mouth at the mere mention of them, just like the Democrats used to froth at the mouth at the mention of Nixon.</p>
<p>Add those two groups together and it is hard to see how HRC could win the presidency.</p>
<p>People are not all crazy about Obama. Some of us find it hard to vote for someone who displays this type of behavior. She was so full of grace last Thursday. ;)</p>
<p>[Clinton</a> to Obama: ‘Shame on you’ - CNN.com](<a href=“Clinton tells Obama: 'Shame on you'; Obama fires back - CNN.com”>Clinton tells Obama: 'Shame on you'; Obama fires back - CNN.com)</p>
<p>This is nothing but another embarrassing display on her part. She wants Obama to point out differences in policy. Yet when he does, she attacks him for being negative? Why is it ok for her to attack him personally, by calling him a cheater (plagiarizer) and empty suit, yet he can not point out policy differences that are true without her going ballistic?</p>
<p>Again, I just don’t see what the Clinton Kool-Aid drinkers see.</p>
<p>HRC was just on t.v. bashing Obama over some campaign flyers he’s been sending out which misrepresent her policies, etc. She was using some harsh language, including the phrase, “Shame on you!”. She said, “Meet me in Texas and let’s have a real debate!”.</p>
<p>Personally, I was glad to see the gloves come off & glimpse a little of that spark we all knew HRC was capable of, but up until now, had not shown very much. She’s gonna have to get tough in order to beat this guy & now I think she can do it (get tough I mean - securing the nom is another story!).</p>
<p>Right now, I’m supporting John McCain, but I’d still like the race to come down to the two most qualified candidates. I think Hillary has a better grasp of the issues and better decision-making abilities than Obama. And I don’t much care for the clueless “mass-hysteria” surrounding his campaign.</p>
<p>Looking forward to a “real debate” on the issues between those two (and then McCain prevailing in the general election!).</p>
<p>bz,</p>
<p>We cross posted. Her campaign has been asked to identify the “un-truths”. They can’t.</p>