<p>Our favorite was wright state. The people there were outstanding. It felt like a true family atmosphere. My son knew two alum, so had heard good things, but left the audition super impressed. I think it helped that it was a one day master class, followed by a half day audition. We were there long enough to get a try sense of the program. The school itself is really just okay, and Dayton certainly isn’t a big city, but my son could definitely see himself comfortable there.</p>
<p>Zonlolo I agree, it’s the way the whole thing was done, not that it was done. It seems like there are schools that do the same thing but with a little more dignity. Sounds like it was even a little off putting to the kids who did get the call back. Flossy I agree, it’s not about “sour grapes” or the end result at all, my daughter LOVED her experience at DePaul but was cut mid-day from their program.</p>
<p>Food for thought but I’d urge caution, or at least reflection on the role of the audition experience in picking an MT program. It could be a bit like deciding you hate or love a school based on what student tour guide you get randomly assigned to. I’m sure we’ve all had the experience of the dud tour guide and the one that you can easily imagine you will be BFFs with once you arrive on campus. None of it really means anything but gosh it is so hard to resist the lasting impression that is made from that simple encounter which is random and just one data point in evaluating a school.</p>
<p>There are indeed MT programs that provide an incredibly nurturing and welcoming audition experience and/or department tour experience. Others that are far more businesslike bordering on seeming uncaring especially when it comes to the parents and sometimes when it comes to the student prospect as well. </p>
<p>Does this really provide a window into what the next 4 years will look like or not? Some schools simply must work harder to make you love them and make personal calls, have warm cookies in the waiting room, answer every good and stupid question until there are no more raised hands. Others programs have a line out the door and have no need to show you the love but that doesn’t mean you won’t be shown a ton of love once you decide to attend. </p>
<p>Be careful about what you are actually looking at. The audition experience is only a single data point.</p>
<p>^^^ I strongly agree with @halflokum’s post above.</p>
<p>D didn’t do Unifieds (she’d been admitted ED to the program that caught us all off guard and became her top choice, Northwestern, so she cancelled all remaining auditions) but she did do the summer auditions at the Nebraska Thespian Festival and a round of regional auditions. At those auditions we experienced school reps literally chasing us down the hall to tell us how amazing their programs would be for her, as well as schools persistently phoning and sending mail to sell their schools after she got home. A couple BFA programs had local alumni call and ask to meet for coffee. Similar story after YoungArts.</p>
<p>NU may show the LEAST up-front love to applicants of any theatre program in the country, since you never meet the people who evaluate you. Plus I found the admissions folks we met during our visit to be a bit cold. After you’re admitted, they again show no love in the form of talent or merit scholarships. But all that said, once kids are there they are instantly a part of NU’s strong and proud tradition and I’ve yet to meet a student who hasn’t loved it.</p>
<p>As @halflokum points out, though, very little of the up-front love is relevant to the quality of training a school offers… and the professional audition process can at times be lacking in warm fuzzies as well.</p>
<p>It’s late tonight, so I’ll address the whole topic tomorrow, but I wanted to comment on the cut process at Pace. </p>
<p>My daughter auditioned at Penn and was cut, she felt it was not her best audition and she deserved to be cut.
She also auditioned at Pace and was one of the lucky ones to make the cut.
She also auditioned at Point Park and did not make the cut list (even though she is an excellent dancer, too)</p>
<p>All of these schools did the cut process a little differently, but all did same day cuts.</p>
<p>I think this was a valuable learning lesson for all students. This is real life in the theatre business. Things will be harsh, much harsher. When my daughter was 9 years old she auditioned for the Annie National tour. They started with a room full of 500 kids (with parents) and after each round of singing or dancing, they walked into the room with a stack of headshots and read off the names of the kids that were to stay. Yes, kids cried (they were 6-12 years old), but this is how it is done in the business. It’s tough and they need to learn that they have to say, “I did my best, it just wasn’t what they were looking for this time”. They need to learn to not take it personality. I always tell my D “Things happen for a reason” and many times another opportunity does come up that she would have had to pass on if she had been cast. </p>
<p>As for colleges, I tell her “if they didn’t pick you, your were probably not right for their program, so therefore, you do not want to go to that college because it will not be the right fit for you.” You want the school to the student, as well as the student fit the school, for it to be an ideal learning environment.</p>
<p>So I’ll address Pace as well since I auditioned on the last day. They said “most of you know about the callback list by now, and really there is no good way to do it. Amy’s very busy right now and hopefully we won’t have to do this callback process next year”. I was fortunate enough to get called back, but man, now I kind of wish I wasn’t because the waiting is intense and insane. I was in the morning group and 13 out of 41 got called back, which isn’t as extreme as some of the others I’ve heard. In the afternoon there were apparently 11 called back.</p>
<p>But back to the topic at hand! Two schools that really surprised me with how nice they were were Utah and Northern Colorado. Utah kept me in the room for about 15 minutes to do vocal adjustments, talk about my academics, and hear every impression on my resume. I was accepted to the program. After my NoCo audition, Matthew Herrick was very complimentary and made my day much better and let me give him a hug for brightening my awful morning. I was waitlisted but I hope I move off the waitlist because I’m very interested in the program thanks to him!</p>
<p>The auditors at the LA Unifieds BoCo audition were also very nice and made me much more interested in the program. Same goes for the regional NYU Tisch audition I did in Houston.</p>
<p>One of the worst experiences I had was at __________. (not naming!) I got about 2/3 the way through my belt song and was stopped. They asked if they could “hear my voice in a different place” so I sang my legit and they actually let me finish. I don’t know if it was their way of testing people but it rubbed me the wrong way.</p>
<p>Another school, the auditors were VERY nice and interactive, but the person they had working the table at Unifieds was one of the most unpleasant people I’ve met. She gave me a hard time because I missed my initial audition, which was the morning session (we got the hotel wrong- oy. This was in LA), and rescheduled for afternoon the next day. When I had to miss the information session to do two dance calls, she gave me such attitude because OBVIOUSLY I don’t deserve to audition for this program because I CHOSE to do the dance calls for the other schools. She was pleasant to the other people auditioning but had an attitude with me that whole afternoon.</p>
<p>I tend to agree with halflokum and MomCares above. While I think it is natural to judge a school a bit on the audition experience, I would caution people to not use that as the basis of whether or not the school/program would be a good fit. It is sorta like kids judging a school from a tour guide and so on. I’m not saying it doesn’t matter, but I think it is not going to be that indicative of what the program or school would be like to attend or whether it is a good match. I think a very thorough campus visit is necessary in order for one to get a better sense, on top of speaking with current students and faculty outside the actual audition. Examining curriculum and other pertinent facts about the school and comparing those to other schools are additional things that will matter in the end. The program and campus “vibe” also matters. But how the audition itself is run is not going to be really what you are dealing with during the four years you attend. So, I would not put quite as much stock into that. Hopefully each prospective student is doing in depth college visits and talking with students and faculty way beyond the audition itself.</p>
<p>I think our worst audition experience (for both me and D) is an example of why a recruiting team being “too nice” can be a problem. This school watched my D at a regional audition and the representative fell over herself complimenting my D saying “we want you!” “Please come audition” “You are perfect for our program!” - a bit over the top but hey my D thought, well I think I’ll get in here and I think I want to go! She went to the first audition they held and when we got there, the faculty were not particularly nice to anyone, they let the students do that. The same representative that so emphatically encourage my D didn’t really even act as though she recognized my D. She was rejected a couple of weeks later (not even wait listed). It’s not that she was rejected from a school - we expected that would happen. It’s the irresponsible way the recruiter was so over the top in what she said to get her to come to campus and then just basically ignored her after that. I feel like recruiters really need to be responsible how they speak to the kids and parents. Say “you have a ton of talent, and we’d love you to come down but who knows how it will turn out so please have many options. This is a hard business.” Certainly I knew that, but my D thought differently because of the words the recruiter used with her. She has no hard feelings about any other schools where she was rejected after the audition -but we both feel this particular school was irresponsible and wouldn’t recommend them to friends because of it. Integrity matters.</p>
<p>I agree with you LuvMT. I have heard of similar stories where a student got a personal phone call or email from the head of the department right after an audition telling the student how great they were --really over the top wonderful feedback and then a rejection. I know it is a hard business and there will be TONS of rejection–but I really don’t think this is right.</p>
<p>Hmmm…all very interesting thoughts on this sensitive matter. I think most, if not all, of us with children in this business have already had our fair share of rejection between school plays, community and regional theater, college auditions etc. I guess I view the college process different than an Annie audition where a child is auditioning potentially to be paid for their work or to be cast in a production. As much as my child is auditioning for a coveted spot in some excellent college programs, these are still programs that I am going to be spending tens of thousands of dollars on over four years. I have no less respect for the quality of programming at Pace nor the talent of those they accept. I simply feel that integrity, dignity and respect do matter. I do believe the inaccessability of those running the programs to parents and students questions does matter and I do believe that the treatment to those auditioning also matters. If some schools can do it so right, it seems that others could learn something.
Our experiences at Marymount, Wagner, Urdang Academy in London were just so positive and so informative as well as the Royal Conservatoire of Scotland for which he was cut mid day! Some schools clearly get it and do it right.</p>
<p>^^I completely agree, zonolo. There’s no excuse for being rude or dismissive to a kid or for undermining students in what’s already a stressful process. And as you say, it’s important to remember that so many schools get it right…why not be considerate? Fortunately, most do, and we will look back on this as a very positive experience overall.</p>
<p>Zonolo wrote:" As much as my child is auditioning for a coveted spot in some excellent college programs, these are still programs that I am going to be spending tens of thousands of dollars on over four years. I have no less respect for the quality of programming at Pace nor the talent of those they accept. I simply feel that integrity, dignity and respect do matter. I do believe the inaccessibility of those running the programs to parents and students questions does matter and I do believe that the treatment to those auditioning also matters. If some schools can do it so right, it seems that others could learn something. "</p>
<p>Exactly. This is what I wast trying to say as well. Very well put. There is a difference here between auditioning a part and auditioning a school. And that being said, my daughter is WAY over it, and isn’t thinking about it at all. They were generous enough to offer her a spot to “walk in” and audition for the acting program at the campus auditions for MT and she enjoyed that experience. So she walked away from there feeling good. And as far as judging a school by the audition experience, I think for some of us that’s a good portion of time that we actually spend at the school. (We had a impromptu tour guide at Pace take us around the day before and she was lovely) So maybe the schools need to understand that’s where they make their impression. I see that some of them have the attitude that they are so big it doesn’t matter how they treat people, they will fill their spots with the best of the best. That’s great for a show, but for a school? That does reflect on them in either a good or bad way. Same thing when it’s very difficult to communicate with the school when you have a question. While I don’t think it’s the only thing, the information you gain during the audition process is something to put on your list when making the decision.</p>
<p>LuvMT, I have had a few advisees come back from some schools or auditions, often newer programs, where they were showed the love a little bit too much and in some cases, were misled to believe they were likely to be admitted. There should be a nice balance between warm and welcoming and businesslike. Between my own kid’s 8 auditions and seeing this through the eyes of many advisees over the years, I have seen or heard the whole gambit.</p>
<p>I think it’s more than appropriate to judge a program by the way the audition process is run. That’s like saying I don’t have to judge a car dealership by the way I am treated on the showroom floor before I make a purchase. I don’t know anyone who approaches a transaction that way…and college is a transaction, even in the most competitive situations. Certainly there are other factors, but first impressions still count for much. If we do not expect that of the schools our kids are auditioning for, then we’ve sold out to the whole “oohh this is a top school so it doesn’t matter how they treat PEOPLE” mentality. We’ve all acknowledged that although there are “top” schools, not everyone fits everywhere. With the growth and expansion of new programs and new challengers to those top schools, it seems that presenting attitude matters all the more. </p>
<p>While my son actually did most of his auditions on campus, I am aware that many people cannot afford to go that route, either because of financial or time restraints. Since that is the case, isn’t that 15-20 minutes of exposure to faculty/staff even more vitally important?? If you cannot treat people with common human dignity and courtesy, it’s should be a warning to the consumer…I don’t care how well-known and respected the program. Simple courtesy is not too much to ask from anyone who shares this planet with us, much less the school with which we plan to entrust our kids. </p>
<p>Pace is actually a school that we withdrew application from because of the way people in the department spoke to my son on the phone…before he ever auditioned!! Why would anyone sacrifice kindness to get in to a prestigious school when we’ve already acknowledged here over and over again that excellent training is available in lots of places? For my money, be nice to me…and my kid. This is a two-way transaction.</p>
<p>mcpcwhite— great comments—I totally agree!!! My D changed her mind about auditioning for two more schools that were scheduled for this weekend-- mostly because she has some great acceptances and these two were her backups. Point is, both of these schools have been SO NICE on the phone and in emails --one she met two faculty members at her state thespian conference, that she actually felt so bad canceling her audition. So yes to a 17-18 year old first impressions are important!!</p>
<p>@mcpcwhite, there is room for both schools of thought. I brought it up for reflection purposes only. </p>
<p>However, I do believe what I wrote and I’ll tell you why: there are several schools I’m watching being gushed over here (that will remain nameless which I think is a good policy BTW) that our on campus audition experience last year was an absolute joke and mind you we flew to all of them from the west coast so I get the investment part of all of it. Maybe they got the memo and fixed things but I’m talking about programs (the programs themselves) that are so well loved by people here in CC and I’m sure for good reason. But if we had just walked away from them because of a shoddy audition process we never would have gotten to the good stuff. Admittedly my daughter didn’t pick any of those schools over the one she is in but the reason is not because of the audition experience. But again, I’m only urging caution, everyone needs to decide on their own what matters.</p>
<p>Agree, halflokum. Excellent point. There is a balance that needs to be struck, for sure. For us, the audition process was actually very good with only a couple of exceptions. One school which was a profoundly negative experience rejected my son – and it says a lot when the rejection notice comes with a sigh of relief! I do want to add that overall, of the 15 auditions, all but two of them were positive in varying degrees.</p>
<p>halflokum and others…my initial reaction was to agree that you shouldn’t judge a school totally its audition process. You rightly say that individiual experiences may be different on different days sort of like getting the “random” tour guide. Programs are not necessarily defined by representatives like the sassy girl at the Unified’s table, or the students who ignored the applicant in favor of gossiping loudly amongst themselves.</p>
<p>On further reflection, tho, I have a caution of my own…don’t dismiss these experiences either. The people that the programs use to represent themselves are not “random”… these students (and faculty) have been CHOSEN to represent the program because they are the best and brightest. These WILL be the kind of students you can expect to populate the program. Their attitudes will in some way REFLECT how they have been taught to represent the faculty. (e.g. a kind helpful faculty will not have the sassy girl sitting at the table - they will have coached - and modeled - behaviour that would not allow this attitude…and vice versa.)</p>
<p>Nothing we say here is a “blanket” statement. There will be as many speaking for as against on any topic, I imagine. But I caution not to simply DISCOUNT the negative experiences you have as a “bad day.”</p>
<p>I absolutely agree with you nicksmtmom and think we are arguing (advocating is a better word) the same thing :-). The main take away that I’m trying to leave everyone with is that the audition is but one data point to consider. Maybe it is signaling something systematic about the school but maybe it isn’t. Be sure to look under the hood!</p>
<p>I think auditions are not just about the school deciding about the student, but also about the student interviewing the school, as it were. By interacting with the students and faculty that day it can give an idea whether it’s a place you would feel comfortable for the next 4 years. I know there was at least one program where my D talked to the host students and asked them what they like to do on weekends, and the answer was to get drunk. Not a great answer from her perspective or mine. Thus, not terribly disappointing she isn’t going there. In contrast, a school where she’s accepted had a number of faculty and students available, gave parents a ton of information, students were very approachable and honest about things, and I think my D could see herself as being very happy there for 4 years. My general sense was that there are some programs who think they’re doing you somewhat of a favor by letting you audition and some that seem genuinely happy to have you for an audition. First impressions to me count; I’d rather see the latter.</p>