Ah yes, the usual dig about teachers hardly working from the usual person. My niece is a teacher and arrives early, stays late, and advises at least two student groups. She is never home before dinner time (about 3 hours after school). She returns to school in mid-summer to coach a team with summer practice, but only after returning from whichever student trip she’s leading. And she isn’t the only one at that HS alone. There’ no “babble” teachers really do work past school hours.
My own D’s school does require teachers to stay after school on certain days of the week, and kids are encouraged to use that time to ask questions, get extra help, etc. When there are exhibitions or large projects due, most of them stay for at least 2 hours. On exhibition or event nights, most don’t go home at all, putting in 12-hour days. But hey-they get summers off! After the two-week post-school-year summer school, the classes they take to stay current in their field and the trips THEY lead. Yup. Lazy babblers.
I refuse to justify my salary to someone who has never done it and doesn’t have a clue of the workload involved…
But I do have a question for anyone who thinks my job is the world’s easiest, most overpaid gig: Why on earth aren’t you teaching if it’s such a gold mine?
I think that the most important thing a parent can do is attend conferences and other parent directed activities.
There are certainly times where a parent needs to become directly involved in an issue with a teacher or coach, but hopefully they are few and far between. If you find yourself getting directly involved often in high school, something is probably wrong.
Because then they’d have to surround themselves with all those lazy babblers who can barely tie their shoes they’re so dumb.You remember, education majors are for college-bound kids too stupid to get into “real” majors.
^^ Well, except for missing the point about staying AT SCHOOL to take care of the administrative matters, and NOT having to take home more work, I think you are absolutely correct about the generalist educators having the lowest qualifications of all majors. Is it unfair to rely on the statistics about the students who graduate with degrees in education? It is what it is!
As far as the hours, this goes to the eternal debate. Some of us think that there are teachers who are overpaid and do not justify their salary. Again, we can rely on anecdotes, stories about “stuff” like rubber rooms, statistics on absenteeism and substitutes – a good bet is to look at Chicago and Detroit-- or simply rely on our experiences.
The debate could be stopped in its track by changing both the way teachers are compensated and treating them like professionals. Drop all that non-sense about working during the summer for a reasonable salary adjustments and “have” to spend ungodly hours of work when other families are having a dinner. Just accept to have to work with a schedule similar to other professionals with 40+ hours and 10 to 20 days of paid vacation plus legal holidays.
Of course, the tradeoffs will be that it will be difficult to pick your own kids when the school ends, and have more worries to schedule personal vacations around the school year.
Again, why are such changes unpopular and why are teachers clinging to the CBA agreements? The answer is simple and it’s has all to day with a gig that offers superior benefits to complement a lower salary in the early years, and quite a nice balance in the latter years. And superior benefits that are added to 1,000 hours workloads.
There is a reason why the profession attracts the lowest common denominator of college graduates! And that explains why our schools are swimming in mediocrity and lack of accountability. And why people with better degrees and education find it hard to either stay or even start in a profession that is so undermined by corruption and the protection of the lazy and clueless.
Is it unfair to teachers? I think so, but the problem is that the system makes little difference between great and dedicated teachers and the army of freeloaders who were attracted by the benefits and short workdays and months. Wanna change the image and perception? Change your leaders!
I don’t think that vast majority of teachers are at all resentful of appropriate communications from parents. We welcome knowledge of things going on that have an effect on the behavior, the attendance, the moods and the grades of the kids we teach.
But know that not all communications are appropriate.
I admit that I have been more involved than I prefer with one of my DS’s teachers this year, but at the teacher’s request. Yes, this teacher said “he is not working hard enough” at parent teacher conference so I have monitored progress more than I have since 3rd grade. I see the parent teacher relationship as a partnership. I will do what I can to support the teacher’s efforts and rules. This ended well but was very shaky in 3rd quarter. I finally requested a meeting with the teacher and GC to talk it out. I did not include my son to give the teacher an opportunity to share info about testing methods, grading, etc. he may not want all the students to know. I needed the info to handle the situation from my end. DS earned an A for 4th quarter so I do think my involvement improved the situation. There are times when even a junior needs a parent involved. They are not adults yet. They are still learning the ways of the adult world and sometimes need it explained by a parent. The teacher did seem to resent my meeting request at the time but I hope understands why it was needed now that the results are in.
I think teachers may fear a parent is a “my kid would NEVER do that” kind of parent! I always tell them that I presume they would do THAT bc they are kids, and kids do stupid stuff!! I think they appreciate a parent not making it adversarial.
Sometimes I disagree with the punishment for the stupid stuff, but hey, their house, their rules!
We had one of those union rep teachers in elementary school. They basically had him do reading groups half the day. One of my friends was moaning and groaning about how awful he was and trying to figure out how she could get her kid in a different reading group. One weekend he keeled over with a heart attack. I remember the next time I saw her, we kind of chuckled that at least her reading group problem had been solved.
After middle school (when we were trying to get a 504 plan in place) I don’t remember dealing with the teachers beyond saying hello at Meet the Teacher night and maybe helping with chaperoning at some of the events.
I’m sure they do. I remember the administrators calling me incredibly apologetically because they were giving my older son an in-school suspension for getting into a fight. When I was told what had happened (no one was quite sure), I thought it perfectly possible that my son might have been the first to get physical. In any event it was 8th grade, it wasn’t going to go on any permanent record. A good lesson learned for him and had the added plus that no one ever tried to bully him again.
When my DD was in first grade, six students had parents who were also teachers in primary schools. that first grade teacher was fabulous (my kid still corresponds with her 21 years later). She communicated well, and welcomed our questions…which we didn’t ask frequently. All of us parents were friends, and several of us worked together.
I believe communication is an essential part of my job as a teacher.
Hmm, how about D being accused of plagiarizing on an IB math essay project while the teacher claimed the work was too sophisticated and called her out in class? D spent 6 hours on it and had a couple college level writing courses accomplished with CTY when she was only 14. Her writing has been claimed top-notch from all of her previous Language Art teachers. D stopped us from intervening because she believed she had explained herself enough but the teacher still gave her a barely passing grade. Should I have had done something or just let D learn how to be more assertive in her own course?
Of course there is no other place of employment or career where there are employees who don’t pull their weight- or try to do the minimum amount of work…teaching is the ONLY place that ever happens. I think I will go watch office space…
But before I do- I have a theory about education/teaching. Everyone went to school and had teachers - so they assume they know how it works (or should work). But that would be like me assuming that I know how to fly a 747 b/c I have been flying in them for years…
Late to this thread, OP, but this is one teacher neither resentful nor afraid of communications from parents. I welcome that communication and have a reputation for excellent communication with parents. About 98% of the time – even if the parent is angry (usually more anxious or inquisitive than angry), simply meeting with the parent calms the parent down, and the open communication answers most of the anxiety. Some teachers simply have prejudices. I found this out once when younger D was in high school. I was actually very happy/excited about one of her new teachers, but my merely posing an innocent question during an Open House when questions were invited rattled the teacher, who acted frightened and defensive at merely being asked neutrally about some of the course content. Ridiculous.
@toowonderful – I have to laugh about your analogy of flying a 747. I always use a similar explanation- that the fact that I’ve given birth twice doesn’t exactly make me an OB-GYN. The experience was shared, but the perspective was very different.
I think this is usually age/experience related. Although sometimes there are teachers (like other people) who aren’t great at handing even the slightest conflict. I’m beginning to develop a theory that many teachers enter the profession because they like control and authority, and that some of the aberrant behaviour you see relates to things that challenge either of these.
In those cases, it doesn’t help that public schools occupy a unique monopoly in our lives.
I disagree with the that statement that public schools have a “unique monopoly” - a quick look at the national center of education site said there were (approx) 98,000 public elementary/secondary schools in 2012 and 38,0000 private ones. I am a public school teacher - and a huge supporter of public education- but there are choices out there. My family made the choice to move from one county to another (in the same metro area- distance was only about 15 miles) son that we would be in area eligible for an arts magnet school for my D’s HS.
As a teacher, I don’t have problem with parents emailing me; I would rather they brought their concerns to me directly than to go over my head to the principal and/or trash me out in the community. I am a middle school teacher though, so there is more parental involvement on that level. Most teachers generally don’t have a problem with parents emailing, unless it’s over-the-top stuff or too often or always accusatory, etc. In my 31 years, I’ve learned to pick up the phone and call parents when they email me with concerns, b/c most of the time it is a misunderstanding which can be worked out over the phone or with a meeting. My administration has an expectation that we answer ALL parent emails within 24 hours, and I think that’s appropriate.
As a parent, I have had to email my kids’ teachers in high school only a few times. These are times where, as mentioned above, a math teacher would not be posting any grades to the online gradebook for more than half the advisory, so my D had no idea where she stood in that class. My kids always prefer to handle it themselves and I ask them if they want me to email before doing so–so I know if they say “yes mom please email” that there is something going on.
I’ll add this–I did NOT follow through as I should have when my D was in 8th grade (which is housed in our high school) and struggling in Algebra. Multiple emails to the teacher did not work; quite honestly, she just didn’t seem to like my D, whereas pretty much EVERY other teacher loved her. As I teacher, I understand personality conflicts, but I blame myself for not pushing it harder and all the way to the principal. D got her one and only C in that class, and it has hurt her GPA since. I vowed then to never sit back and just take it when things need to be addressed. (As a teacher in the same system that your children are in, this can be a sticky situation. . . but I am a parent FIRST.)
Soooooooo, I’d advise trying to let your kids handle things as much as possible, and don’t email unless you absolutely have to. If you’re considered a pest after one email then that’s the teacher’s problem (or the staff’s problem). You know your child and you need to do what’s best. If you do need to email, do not be accusatory, let the teacher know that you realize there may be at least 2 sides to the story, and that you are only trying to partner together with the teacher for the success of your child. Any good teacher should want that type of involvement.
The teachers that are resentful of communications from parents usually are the ones that have a community of helicopter parents hovering on a regular basis. Helicopter parents make teachers lives miserable. Their entitlement couched in making excuses for their kids is pathetic. Having a kid take responsibility for their learning, and taking the initiative to discuss it on their own with the teacher is a breath of fresh air. When a parent acts as go-between, it takes away from the kid’s learning to speak on his own behalf.
Of course, there are always exceptions when a parent would be best to speak up…when there is a major concern, a special needs child, or a lazy teacher that isn’t listening to the kid that’s tried to approach on his own.
ps,. I have more than enough examples of helicopter parents that I cannot wrap my head around. I have never understood their version of reality that requires their children to play on a different playing field from the others. It truly boggles my mind. And I feel for the teachers that have ever dealt with these piranhas.
I know of parents who sued their school district b/c they said it did not provide then"least restrictive environment" for their special needs child. Now- all public schools are required to do that - but in this case, the “special need” was that the kid was gifted (not identified by the school, but by someone the family hired) and “their” specialist had determined the least restrictive environment was a local private school with tuition of $25k a year. Strangely enough their law suit was not successful…
My son goes to public school but he’s duel-enrolled in two schools. His “home” school is a small (500 students total) alternative school with a by-lottery enrollment where he takes 4 classes. He also attends the big conventional high school (1,700 students) for 3 classes. The biggest difference I’ve noticed is in the teachers’ attitudes toward the students as individuals. Both schools are in the same public school system, so same pay scale, average number of students in class, number of classes per teacher, etc. But at the small school, the teachers and kids are on first-name basis and the kids have their teachers’ cell phone numbers and are encourage to call and text. They really get to know each other and I think it makes all the difference in the world.
My son has only had “issues” with two teachers and they have both been at the bigger school. Neither were responsive to my son, nor to me until I insisted on a conference. In the end, both situations were resolved and he went on to finish the class successfully but I’m doubtful that the outcomes would have been the same without me getting involved. Neither teacher was happy to hear from me but there wasn’t any choice as they simply ignored my son’s emails and never responded.