Why do state schools divert from their mission and open the doors to an increasing number of OOS students?
Why do state schools buy “scholars”? (And why from OOS?)
What happens when those state schools stop buying scholars (by direction of legislature)?
Is prestige important?
Is fit important?
Is net cost important?
Is outcome important?
Is freshman retention important?
Is transfer out rate important?
Is 4 year graduation rate important?
Some state schools “buy scholars” to raise their profile. It’s easier to attract better profs if you can put smart bodies in the seats. From, there it’s a domino effect.
Fit is important, which is why some opt to go OOS to a school that they deem to be a better fit.
Some care about cost and will go OOS if the net cost is affordable, particularly if instate was not.
Of course outcome is important.
Freshman retention rate isn’t much of a concern to those who trust that they or their kids are strong enough students to get thru.
Transfer out rate doesn’t tell the whole story. Unless there is clearly an obvious reason, like a school losing its accreditation or miserable weather, or the rate is very high, many people probably ignore it because they feel that it doesn’t apply to them.
4 year (or the more often reported 6 year due to co-ops) grad rate is important if the school’s upper 50% cannot graduate on time.
If the grad rate is lower because frequently the lower 25-50% of the school takes longer, then why would a better student worry?
I can only answer for my own family. My kids apply to schools that offer high $$ merit awards bc the local university does not fit their needs. They are strong, competitive students who have parents who can only afford a fraction of their EFC. High merit awards allow them to pursue their desired degrees at schools with appropriate course offerings.
Of course outcomes matter. my kids spend hrs researching depts, contacting professors, and planning visits to the schools that meet their needs. They eliminate schools where their goals and the dept goals don’t match.
Prestige is not a factor for our family. Cost drives decisions, but it is through the filter of which affordable school best matches their needs.
Retention rates, graduation rates, etc are not something we have paid a lot of attention to. My kids are pretty driven and they pursue their vision under their own steam.
I used to work at a public university. Our state had declining birth rates, and the university saw out-of-state students as a way to maintain/increase enrollment. We particularly wanted good students, who would stay (retention) and graduate in a timely manner. We offered financial incentives to students like that (waiver to in-state tuition, merit aid).
Many public institutions offer incentives to children of alumni - my S applied to both H and my public university alma maters (didn’t end up attending due to ED at a small liberal arts college).
Certain regions of the country typically have more money than others. More money and by design better private universities than public. With fierce competition for the privates which are expensive, their kids want the thrill of a big college experience with school spirit and top football. Plus many of those OOS publics are a bit more than their instate but still less than the elite privates (to which they couldn’t get in).
So the choice for some families becomes:
boring in state school (no brag, no spirit)
off brand expensive private (again no brag, no spirit)
OOS football school they and their kids will enjoy
So you see a lot flock to Penn St, Ohio State, Michigan, Wisconsin, Alabama, Florida, Florida State, etc.
Some of those schools will even discount the OOS tuition a little bit and everyone is happy. And research shows some of these kids that are there for somewhat social reasons are active of campus, join Greek organizations, care less about grades, pay more, and are less likely to be taxing on university resources, A win all around?
Maybe they even take longer to graduate paying even more… We shall see how this brand mania progresses because over time it will become harder for instate kids to get into their own state schools and their administration and legislature will need to determine what their mission truly is…
I’m not sure I buy " easier to attract better profs". The talent pool for profs is staggeringly deep due to the glut of PhDs and shortage of tenure track positions. I know absolutely amazing profs (teachers and research-wise) at state directionals and schools like Truman State. Hundreds of profs, many highly qualified, vie for every open position. State universities don’t need to pull in OOS students for that reason.
@intparent I agree. Maybe winning sports teams makes it easier to attract coaches and athletes. And then more applications from students based on the national exposure. Professors? Not so much.
I believe that students choose OOS schools for many reasons , but to assume that students who choose schools with " school spirit or big football experiences " will be an less academically responsible and require longer to graduate or ultimately transfer out may be a stretch . I’m sure there are many factors at play which are personal and unrelated. IMO, football is a small part of the decision making for most families. I also believe that the college selection process is a personal one between the student and their family which shouldn’t be scrutinized or judged by outsiders who believe that they know better or have all of the answers. I don’t judge because it truly is not my decision to make.
@ClarinetDad16 Totally agreeing with @carolinamom2boys My ds is surrounded by high-achieving OOS students at Alabama. Most investigated UA bc of their scholarships. Most attend bc they are getting a great education at an affordable price. I know for our ds frats and football had zero factor in his decision.
Curious, though,what is “less taxing on university resources?”
Wow. It has never occurred to anyone in our family, even the extended version, to go to a school for football. OOS schools will sometimes basically match your instate price if you are a good student. People like options. Not all state schools are the same so maybe you shouldn’t study marine biology in Colorado or ski resort management in Florida. Some universities have special key relationships with industries like University of Delaware and DuPont. State schools also work together regionally and give discounts for OOS students for majors not offered. Sometimes it’s a fit choice. Your state school could be huge and you are looking for a smaller option. If you are smart, you can find cost effective OOS options. In New England, it’s cooler in 12th grade to go to any other state school that is not your own. After that no one cares.
We are in PA and our in-state flagship (Penn State) is very expensive with very little merit $ for in-state students. It is in a very rural area and in some high schools 30-40% of graduates go on to PSU. Many high stats students choose to go out of state for a different location or to separate from high school cliques. (not at all a knock on PSU and I would be happy if any of our children expressed interest) Just our experience from our little part of the state.
Strength of program!! S is going into computer science and many of the top programs (and the more affordable ones) are OOS schools. I do think there is a “but everyone goes there” issue as well. S said at least 1/5 of his class is going to our state school. We are going look at it for S18 since he has no idea what he’s majoring on so extra cost wouldn’t be worth it.
But the everyone goes there/ it’s the same as high school mentality is not always rational. If 50 kids from your high school go to the state school with 30k students, you won’t see them unless you want to. Sometimes the hardest part of the college process is the 12th grade lunch room table.
Sometimes there is reciprocity, making the cost the same or nearly the same between states. A Wisconsin kid who wants to major in ChemE might cross the border for that especially strong major at UMinn, for example.
Students from my local high school do consider a lot of public schools: Arkansas, Clemson, Alabama, Ole Miss, Oklahoma and Purdue, etc.
I think this is because UT Austin is so hard to get into. TX A&M requires solid stats for non auto admits as well.
Texas has other in state options, but I think a lot of kids consider OOS schools with big football programs. Tuition reciprocity is also a draw from bordering states. My DS does not fit this profile, but I think it is common.
My D2 attends GTECH (OOS - applied from PA, now NY) . She is a sophomore majoring in Mechanical Engg. She is a full pay student.
Reasons why she chose GTECH (other places under consideration were publics like UCB, UMich, UWisc, etc. as well):
a) Strength of program (top 5 for both undergrad and grad)
b) Course curricula - broad and flexible
c) Option to change from one Engineering stream to another easily
d) Outstanding research options - access, facilities, guidance
e) City life, weather - lifestyle choices
f) Tremendous student body - academic, extra curricula
g) Choices for coops and internships
h) High name recognition in her field
I) Full college experience - D1 sports, great college spirit
j) Experience of her friends at the same college
k) Not interested in attending the in-state flagship - not cheap for instate, scholarships would not have made a difference
Because some people are residents of no state, so all state schools are OOS. Or, for candidates who qualify for neither need-based nor merit-based aid, public colleges in general are a financially attractive proposition.
Why do private schools bring in OOS and international students? Why do companies rotate staff on assignments? Why do people not marry their cousins? To bring in fresh blood and diversity of ideas.
They look OOS because there is an inadequate in-state pool for the qualities they’ve decided to recruit. They want to bring talent and fresh blood in the state to improve the school and build a strong future workforce/taxbase. They need to offer an incentive to overcome a negative image about the state.
If the school has not yet firmly established its reputation, then the fresh water pipeline dries up. And the school is relegated to sourcing local water from the Flint River.