will a conservative student be mocked and bullied by fellow students and teachers??

Prep School Admissions
41

A rhetorical question, but the answer “absolutely”. What better debate practice could there be than to debate a strawman argument with someone who sincerely believed it. Most of us had experience like this with religion and politics and it is a non-trivial undertaking. With Kyrie, you say “Look at the Moon, it’s round. Through a telescope, it’s spherical. During a lunar eclipse when the sun is in opposition, you can see the Earth’s shadow and it’s curved. Isn’t this conclusive evidence that the Earth is spherical, even apart from all the satellite imagery of a spherical Earth?” Do you think you have now “won”? Do you have any familiarity with what a modern flat-earther believes and are you prepared to counter their arguments? How do you react when Kyrie instantly scoffs when you mention “satellite imagery” and says “Oh, you mean from ‘NASA’?”, and rolls his eyes?

So you’ve answered your own question. Kids don’t have to worry about being polite.

42

@dogsmama1997 I honestly don’t understand your post. I have no idea who Kyrie Irving is. Frankly, I think you intellectually missed all my points. Let me rephrase, Open debate and ideas are good things. Not all academic environments are open to the free exhange of ideas. That means that in the absence of open debate, one side rules because the other side is silenced. Not good but happens.
Honestly, any context here doesnt matter whether they are arguing about something that is totally nonsensical or something you believe in. What matters is the exchange and whether or not you believe it will happen at this particular school. Some do, some don’t.

43

@happytimes2001, I believe @dogsmama1997 was pointing out that some things are a matter of opinion and some things are a matter of fact, and while it is an interesting and educational exercise to debate matters of opinion (such as economic policies), it is pointless to debate matters of fact (such as a spherical Earth) and pretty much impossible to debate anything with someone who is unwilling to accept basic facts and proofs of such facts. It might make for good debate practice, as @damon30 suggests, but I naively think that the reason to discuss difficult topics is for people to learn from each other and try to find common ground. You can’t find common ground if the other person doesn’t believe in the ground. :slight_smile: I am glad my children went to a school where civil discussion of difficult topics was included in the curriculum and was part of ordinary daily life. I (also naively) hope and trust that most other boarding schools can say the same.

44

@twinsmama No this wrong, and it absolutely is possible to win debates. My point is that this is neither simple nor hopeless, and it takes practice to get good at it. My Kyrie example was that the argument I presented was incomplete, and that it would take a couple more rounds to counter all possible objections. It’s analogous to the difference between being able state a mathematical theorem and being able to prove it. Saying “everyone knows that’s true” has no place in math or in science. If you want to believe in truisms, believing in “the free exchange of ideas” is a good place to start. Anyway, I think post #35 was as close to an authoritative answer to the OP’s question about bullying that we are likely to get.

@Happytimes2001 Kyrie Irving is a former Duke “one and done”, and likely future NBA Hall of Famer , who once let slip that he believed the Earth was flat.

45

MODERATOR’S NOTE:

Here’s my way - Stop debating about whether it’s possible to win debates. It was not what the OP asked. So debating about an off-topic topic violates 2 of the site’s rules. Focus on the OP’s question, please, if you have not expressed your opinion already.

46

Good topic. I myself have my concerns about this issue.

I don’t know anything about CA, but I would be very hesitant to send my child to a school that puts up signs advertising “safe spaces”, organizes bus trips to political rallies, or that treats individuals only as part of racial groups (talk of “white privilege”). Even if this school has a stellar reputation.

There’s still time to find other schools. If you’re still giving CA a chance, I’d encourage you to have a frank talk with the administration and look specifically into the social studies curriculum and syllabi the school uses. It is possible that the signs are just indicative that students can express themselves – and most of us in our youth have “tried out” a radical idea or two.

A lot of universities now are over-the-top with political correctness, to the point of moderate and classical liberal professors being literally shouted down or told to leave. It would deeply concern me if this trend is moving to prep schools.

47

As a student, I wouldn’t bully your son for being conservative. I may, however, laugh if your son tried to tell me climate change is a hoax.

I wouldn’t worry about him running into trouble on-campus either. I’d be worried about him getting into heated fights with non-students off campus

48

I think only your son will be able to determine what level of discourse he feels comfortable with. I assume he is attending a revisit day. Not that people talk politics at those events, but he might get a feel for how differences of opinion are handled.

49

I’m a student at a New England prep school that is not CA but is fairly liberal overall. I think it depends on both the culture of the school and the individuals in question. If the school is a warm, close environment that encourages civil, reasoned debate then it seems unlikely that your son would be bullied by students who disagree with him; in my experience, I am fairly liberal and I’m able to have civil, reasoned debate with conservatives, which often ends with us still disagreeing on the specific issues but better understanding each other’s and our own perspectives, and then continuing perfectly well with discussing other topics and staying friendly. If your son is mature and chooses to debate with other students who are mature, it shouldn’t be an issue; there are some immature people out there, but in general if the school culture is good then bullying/harassment on any grounds will not fly. And on the whole, politics comes up now and then (more if you choose to be exceptionally vocal about it) but it isn’t the dominating factor of life in high school, so even if very few of your son’s friends happen to be of similar political leanings, they’ll still be able to share a lot of other qualities and interests and have strong friendships.

50

Things could get very uncomfortable for a Trump supporting student at a very liberal school in the run up to the 2020 election.

51

"Things could get very uncomfortable for a Trump supporting student at a very liberal school in the run up to the 2020 election. "

" He will likely be made to feel uncomfortable "

“He won’t be bullied, but his judgement might be questioned”.

"But making those sorts of argument IRL at most boarding schools is likely to produce rough social sailing, although he may find a pocket or two of like-minded thinkers. "

"Backlash is not the same as bullying. I doubt he will be bullied at CA, but he will be met with emotional opposition to almost all his ideas. "

"Being bullied and having people roll their eyes at you are two different things. "

“He is unlikely to find people who support or agree with his beliefs. He probably won’t be bullied, unless there are other aspects to his personality or behavior that put him at risk, but he will be challenged for his beliefs.”

"If he’s looking for an atmosphere where there are others who support Trump, and don’t accept science, he should probably choose a different environment. "

I’ve read the OP several times now, and I am hard pressed to understand some of these responses. Are these facts or just measured wishful thinking? Either way, I was hoping for something better and more steadfast like… If CA or any BS CAN’T provide an open and safe learning environment for your conservative student, I’d be absolutely appalled! Some of these responses actually stop a little too short and almost gleefully suggest otherwise … Are people actually cool now with young conservative kids feeling mocked, isolated or shunned away from home?

I certainly hope not, but give me something better to go on.

Please Note : Bullying ( of any kind ) is not permitted at BS. It is clearly outlined in the student handbook. If your child is harassed in any way, please encourage him to call you immediately . Civility and an exchange of ideas is a two way street, and no one should ever feel ashamed of being an independent, conservative or libertarian in a free society or on a BS campus. .

OP : If any unacceptable, boorish or bullying behavior happens due to his views or party affiliation ( in or out of the classroom ), or if your child is made to feel excluded, uncomfortable or unwelcome in any way , please contact the Head immediately or fire off a letter to the board of trustees, if you feel that any response is less than adequate . This is not your son’s problem… it’s theirs. Your child’s comfort and well-being away from home ( especially at this age ) is paramount to everything else- and given some of these responses on this thread- you’re wise to be concerned. I would be really concerned , too and I’m a former democrat turned independent.

I’ve said it before, but people are complex. We arrive at different conclusions and form new opinions throughout our lives based on what life brings or throws at us. It should always be a thoughtful, fluid and unhindered journey void of a bunch of intolerant hall monitors or people who can somehow justify harassment based on THEIR beliefs .

Here’s a tip for the kids reading this : Everyone knows that people who shame others for party affiliation or political beliefs don’t offer any real value . Why? Because truly smart/ successful people are smart because they instinctively surround themselves with people who WILL disagree with them. Learn to embrace this skill now . This is also a mandatory skill for future employment where you’ll likely find that militant or myopic views are not in the job description.

Oh, and one more thing, kids- before you believe anyone or anything - Do your research and follow the money. It’s a great exercise ( and a great skill to have anyway ). See where it takes you… because I can guarantee that you’ll learn a lot.

To the OP- All the best to you and your family. I sincerely hope everything works out for your son . :slight_smile:

52

You may get a hint of the vibe during Revisit week…especially if the school has a club fair or club tables set up at Revisit. The most interesting political vibe we experienced was at a school (not CA)we ultimately decided not to accept. The Head of the History department gave a talk to parents and apologized for their American History requirement at the school. He explained that it was a requirement for the accreditation ( maybe by state?), but he stated that he felt this was very unfair to foreign students…We appreciate all perspectives OK…just reporting…and asking any parents to report back if they hear it again this year.

On another note, what a great experience it will be for the students in primary states who may have the chance between now and 2020 to meet or see candidates in person.

53

Those other students have just as much right to speak as your son does. If he’s going to engage in labeling and name calling, which is what describing people he’s never met as “virtual signalers” is, then he can probably expect to get called on it. If he can have an intelligent discussion based on ideas he’ll probably be fine.

54

Exactly, @austinmshauri . I wrote upthread about my liberal daughter’s friendship with a conservative boy. She was called a “hippy socialist” by some conservative kids in her class (she is neither, unless hippies now wear Vineyard Vines) and her friend is the one who stood up for her and told them to knock if off (which is part of the reason why they became better friends.)

If OPs son is like that boy, he won’t have a problem, IMO. If he’s the name caller, he just might. But that has very little to do with politics and everything to do with personality. So, what’s he like?

55

I’ve never been a fan of formal “safe spaces,” whatever the hell that actually means in practice. In fact, if you’re a racist, a homophobe, anti-immigrant, anti-vaxxer, anti-science, whatever, I want to know. It’s way better, IMO, to see a person for who they really are than some whitewashed construct.

Most adolescent kids (especially the economically privileged) often arrive to boarding school spouting ideas and beliefs with no real appreciation for how they square with the reality of others. An anti-immigrant viewpoint, for example, that sounded so neat and tidy at home, withers in the face of the Hispanic kid whose family has known far more suffering than safety. Very important lessons, maybe the most important, happen when consequences are understood “in the real.” Empathy, for starters.

As much as I hope that my son would stand in complete opposition to everything the original poster’s son stands for, the experience of those two hashing it out would be invaluable, even if it’s just to learn how to say, “let’s agree to disagree” and then, in the next sentence, go out for pizza and argue plain or pepperoni.

56

Interesting to note that the OP asked if he would be MOCKED and or/BULLIED. Many have addressed bullying. But no one has addressed being mocked. IMHO, someone not respecting someone else’s opinion and rolling their eyes, laughing or talking under their breathe is mocking someone. Even if they say something that is cringe worthy.
I also noticed several posters implying that as long as the OP is contained within a framework they are comfortable with in terms of arguments, all will be fine. IF not, then it’s going to be a problem. Couldn’t it be the case, that the OP is made to feel mocked and uncomfortable since there is a limit as implied by many on the thread that he has to stay within the confines of their “safe space” whatever that means to each of them-or risk them behaving in a manner that isn’t pleasant?
Did OP say that he was going to name call and be belligerent? Did OP say that he was going to attack virtue signalers? Did I miss that post? IF OP said that then I would put it in the category of not respecting other opinions. But if someone inferred that someone with a different opinion could not be tolerated the tables are then reversed.
I always find it so interesting that people who believe themselves to be open minded rarely are. And those who would never state that they are open to other ideas find discovery in new ways of thinking.
I think this thread gives the OP a lot of insight into what is said and what will actually occur once OP’s son opens his mouth in a class to speak.
I wish as a parent and citizen that this were not the case but politics is a hotly debated issue at every school. If not in history class than elsewhere. OP and all students should consider it as a factor in the fit of a school.

57

There are students at most schools that share many of the same beliefs as your son. It might be best for your student to quietly, patiently find his people before he begins debating students who don’t believe the same things, that way he’ll be able to receive affirmation and encouragement from his friends, if things occasionally go badly for him.

58

My only framework was that if he’s easy to get along with, he’ll be easy to get along with. If he’s not, then not.

It’s just like anything else.

59

I don’t think anyone can provide a definitive answer, which is what I think some posters are looking for in terms of a response, because we’re dealing with an incomplete hypothetical. The posters (at least this poster) does not know OP’s child and does not know how OP’s child will express himself. And no one can accurately provide a definitive answer to how every student at CA (or any other school) will respond to the unknown manner in which OP’s child will express himself.

Every school has rules against bullying, and I do think the posters on here generally agree that is extremely unlikely bullying will occur. But the rules exist because someone, somewhere crossed the line into unacceptable behavior, and in recognition of the possibility that the line could be crossed by someone else. Will every school impose considerable punishment for someone who has crossed the line? I certainly believe so. But that’s an answer to a different question than whether the unacceptable behavior could possibly occur. Regardless, I think most here agree that the possibility of bullying is quite remote.

As for everything else, I think any person will be judged (positively or negatively) on their views, their manner of delivery, the soundness of their logic, and the facts used to support their views. And I think the responses of the audience will vary depending on how they judge the speaker. I have friends who are staunch conservatives and friends who are staunch liberals. [Yes, I’m self-aware enough to recognize that I said I don’t think the terms are particularly meaningful in a vacuum, but I’m purposefully trying to keep things a little vague here.] We regularly discuss politics; we respect one another’s informed opinions; we learn from one another; and we get along just fine. On the other hand, there are people who I find exhausting because they continually express their unsolicited opinions more with table thumping and rank speculation than facts or logic, and they do it in a way that comes across to many as callous or derogatory. Based on my assessment, I’m unlikely to become good friends with someone in the latter group, particularly if their opinions conflict with something for which I have strong feelings. Delivery matters, words matter, and one cannot force people to be friends. As we don’t know OP’s child, don’t have a concrete situation to consider, and don’t know how each student will respond to OP, it seems to me all anyone can do is offer a range of possibilities that OP will have to consider in the context of their deeper knowledge of their son and his past experiences.

60

If we (the parents) are struggling on this thread to figure out how to have this discussion, it is safe to assume our children are, too.

I am less concerned about high school kids learning how to respectfully debate the hard issues if the adults around them are modeling respectful communications.

One of the reasons we decided to leave our public school system was that there was a lot of lip service to inclusiveness, but how it played out was that political discussions were verbotten. What confirmed leaving was the right choice for us was when the middle school put up on its front sign something along the lines of “Everyone has a place at [school]!” I get what they were trying to do with that message, but it is patently untrue – the rash of suicide attempts (in middle school!), drug use, lack of diversity, bullying (among children and parents alike) and complete inability to actually discuss big issues tell the real story. When we first saw the sign, kiddo laughed out loud. Just because a school claims to be inclusive, and pays lip service to “diversity training” and anti-bullying seminars, doesn’t make it so.

Isn’t it the human condition – liberal or conservative – to feel like an outsider? Especially teenagers? Seems to me that is what fuels the best political conversations. So it is on the adults in the room to channel that teenage angst productively. Some school administrations are going to be better at that than others – it is a top down school culture thing. It isn’t as easy as “Harkness” or “no-Harkness”. Or how popular various student clubs are. Or promises of tolerance and open-mindedness from the administration. You can look at student publications, read through the student handbook, and the gold standard – talk to students about it when they have their guard down, if you can – especially older ones who have lived it for several years.